These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Intergalactic Summit

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Short notes on the Shathol'Syn and the Supression Edict
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Odelya d'Hanguest
Order of St. Severian
#1 - 2016-01-24 12:04:16 UTC
In the Name of Light

Readers of the Intergalactic Summit

With great bewilderment it has come to our attention that so far the issue of the Shathol'Syn and the lift the Supression Edict has not been discussed in full. Given the misleading and tendentious prose of Zara Serir’s news piece, clarifications seem to be in order.

1.) The Shathol'Syn has neither roots in the Scriptures nor in tradition. It originates in the so called “Moral Reforms” and is merely a baseless invention.

2.) The Order of St. Tetrimon has always stood as a shining beacon of hope and faith against any attempts to corrupt Amarr’s sanctified traditions and religion. While its loyalty towards Empire and Emperor is beyond questioning, its commitment and true faith to the principles and laws that the Lord laid down through Dano Gheinok and all the prophets and apostles, even outshines its loyalty toward their temporal representatives. While the Order of St. Tetrimon has accepted to protect the heirs in their sequestration, one should not assume that this equates with an acknowledgment of the Shathol'Syn as an necessary and integral part of the succession rites—as a hasty reading of the Serir’s piece may imply.

3.) Since there has been no acknowledgment of the Shathol'Syn by the Order of St. Tetrimon, there is no connection between it and the lift of the Suppression Edict. The involvement of the Order of St. Tetrimon in the succession trials should be read as made possible by the lift—and not the other way around. A reading that the Order of St. Tetrimon recognises the succession trials is not in order. Yet, the Imperial Succession Committee and the Privy and Theology Councils recognise the Order of St. Tetrimon.

By His Light and His Will!
Odelya d’Hanguest, Begum of Palas etc. pp.
Lady High Chancellor of the Royal Khanid Capsuleer Council
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#2 - 2016-01-24 12:45:38 UTC
I don't believe though that Shathol'Syn is a baseless invention. I honestly admire this ritual. It displays resolve of the participants, as there is 5/6 chance they have to kill themselves after that. They are going towards their deaths and have just a tiny chance to become the Emperor. And this chance doesn't even depend on them.

Such strong determination and honor put them as example to all of us.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Nauplius
Hoi Andrapodistai
#3 - 2016-01-24 15:18:53 UTC
I tend to agree. Self-sacrifice is not original to the Amarr Religion; rather, the corruptions of a wayward and liberal Theology Council have resulted in the steady replacement of Scripture defending human sacrifice with those defending self-sacrifice (a distortion that often required only the change of one or two words). I suspect that early Imperial Successions involved the sacrifice of truly enormous number of Minmatar slaves, a spectacular God-glorifying rite that no doubt contributed to the Empire's early successes (and the cessation of these rites contributing to the Empire's more recent troubles. But it is silly to think that early successions involved the self-sacrifice of the losing heirs.
Odelya d'Hanguest
Order of St. Severian
#4 - 2016-01-24 21:33:25 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
I don't believe though that Shathol'Syn is a baseless invention. I honestly admire this ritual. It displays resolve of the participants, as there is 5/6 chance they have to kill themselves after that. They are going towards their deaths and have just a tiny chance to become the Emperor. And this chance doesn't even depend on them.

Such strong determination and honor put them as example to all of us.

It is a baseless innovation, neither based on the Scriptures nor on tradition. We can imagine cases in which self-determined ritual suicide might be considered recommendable, honourable and exemplary and in which it is—more importantly—supported by the Word. But those are individual cases. There are myriads of discussions on the Shathol'Syn; my simple aim was to elaborate on the news in general and the relationship of the Order of St. Tetrimon to the Succession Trials in specific.

N--pl--s wrote:
Self-sacrifice is not original to the Amarr Religion; rather, the corruptions of a wayward and liberal Theology Council have resulted in the steady replacement of Scripture defending human sacrifice with those defending self-sacrifice (a distortion that often required only the change of one or two words). I suspect that early Imperial Successions involved the sacrifice of truly enormous number of Minmatar slaves, a spectacular God-glorifying rite that no doubt contributed to the Empire's early successes (and the cessation of these rites contributing to the Empire's more recent troubles. But it is silly to think that early successions involved the self-sacrifice of the losing heirs.

Sacrifice and self-sacrifice are both fundamental to my faith; albeit not physically speaking, but metaphysically.
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#5 - 2016-01-24 22:48:27 UTC
Since when the Moral Reforms are not Scripture?
Sinjin Mokk
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2016-01-25 01:07:44 UTC
The political landscape in the Kingdom is currently, at best, nervous.

Khanid II has been an integral part of the Kingdom since he founded it. That we're now facing the imminent demise of such a great figure has many of us shaken to the core.

There are many questions regarding our continued sovereignty. We will remain a Kingdom? Will we remain a part of the Empire? What of our trade agreements with the Caldari? Do we Cyberknights have a place in the Empire without the Kingdom? Will there be equal recognition of our Houses? What will be the legal status of our slaves, of our Khaldari and other non-Amarr populations? What of the Royal Navy?

Why are the Privy and Theology Councils so quiet on these matters?

We maintain our loyalty to Kingdom and Empire. We remain true to God.

We hope the new Emperor does not make the mistake of selling out that loyalty.

"Angels live, they never die, Apart from us, behind the sky. They're fading souls who've turned to ice, So ashen white in paradise."
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#7 - 2016-01-25 08:23:50 UTC
Odelya d'Hanguest wrote:

It is a baseless innovation, neither based on the Scriptures nor on tradition. We can imagine cases in which self-determined ritual suicide might be considered recommendable, honourable and exemplary and in which it is—more importantly—supported by the Word. But those are individual cases. There are myriads of discussions on the Shathol'Syn; my simple aim was to elaborate on the news in general and the relationship of the Order of St. Tetrimon to the Succession Trials in specific.

Please excuse me, ma'am, I have misunderstood it.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Aldrith Shutaq
Atash e Sarum Vanguard
#8 - 2016-01-25 17:52:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Aldrith Shutaq
Sinjin Mokk wrote:
The political landscape in the Kingdom is currently, at best, nervous.

Khanid II has been an integral part of the Kingdom since he founded it. That we're now facing the imminent demise of such a great figure has many of us shaken to the core.

My advice to the Kingdom and its people in this time is to remain steadfast and look to its future in the King's appointed heir. The Empire and her royal houses have undergone many successions through time immemorial, always with the expectation that the cycle will continue anew which each new ruler. Life is granted to us all for only a brief time by the Divine, and it serves to remember that all life must come to an end so that the new may take its place. In this particular case I do not believe you have much to worry about.

Sinjin Mokk wrote:
There are many questions regarding our continued sovereignty. We will remain a Kingdom? Will we remain a part of the Empire? What of our trade agreements with the Caldari? Do we Cyberknights have a place in the Empire without the Kingdom? Will there be equal recognition of our Houses? What will be the legal status of our slaves, of our Khaldari and other non-Amarr populations? What of the Royal Navy?

The policies to be set in the future lie in the hands of Duke Farokh Khanid, soon to be King Khanid III. I would look to his guidance on these matters.

Just as a mention, there are many Cyberknights in the Empire of all colors and banner; orders, holder's guard, and independents alike.

Sinjin Mokk wrote:
Why are the Privy and Theology Councils so quiet on these matters?

Likely because they have no say in these matters until the new rulers of the Empire and Kingdom take their respective thrones and engage in dialogue.

Sinjin Mokk wrote:
We hope the new Emperor does not make the mistake of selling out that loyalty.

I do believe that we respect loyalty at least as much as you do. Fear not, the dawn of a new age is upon us.

Aldrith Ter'neth Shutaq Newelle

Fleet Captain of the Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris

Divine Commodore of the 24th Imperial Crusade

Lord Consort of Lady Mitara Newelle, Champion of House Sarum and Holder of Damnidios Para'nashu
Ascentior
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#9 - 2016-01-25 19:09:46 UTC
Sinjin Mokk wrote:
We hope the new Emperor does not make the mistake of selling out that loyalty.

Indeed, what a grave mistake it would be for any heir to sell out the loyalty of the Faithful.

Admiral of PIE Inc., Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris (See 'PIE Public' for recruitment)

Honorary Fabricator-General of the Imperial Navy

Chosen by God to serve the Empire.
Kador Ouryon
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2016-01-25 19:39:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Kador Ouryon
Ascentior wrote:
Sinjin Mokk wrote:
We hope the new Emperor does not make the mistake of selling out that loyalty.

Indeed, what a grave mistake it would be for any heir to sell out the loyalty of the Faithful.


God will guide the hearts and minds of the champions to ensure the most worthy candidate becomes our next Emperor or Empress.

What fills the soul? Something that guides a lost child back to it's parents arms. Or waves that dye the shores of the heart gold. A blessed breath to nurture life in a land of wheat. Or the path the Sef descend drawn in ash. In the wake of fire.
Sinjin Mokk
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2016-01-26 01:19:59 UTC
Aldrith Shutaq wrote:
Sinjin Mokk wrote:
The political landscape in the Kingdom is currently, at best, nervous.

Khanid II has been an integral part of the Kingdom since he founded it. That we're now facing the imminent demise of such a great figure has many of us shaken to the core.

My advice to the Kingdom and its people in this time is to remain steadfast and look to its future in the King's appointed heir. The Empire and her royal houses have undergone many successions through time immemorial, always with the expectation that the cycle will continue anew which each new ruler. Life is granted to us all for only a brief time by the Divine, and it serves to remember that all life must come to an end so that the new may take its place. In this particular case I do not believe you have much to worry about.

Sinjin Mokk wrote:
There are many questions regarding our continued sovereignty. We will remain a Kingdom? Will we remain a part of the Empire? What of our trade agreements with the Caldari? Do we Cyberknights have a place in the Empire without the Kingdom? Will there be equal recognition of our Houses? What will be the legal status of our slaves, of our Khaldari and other non-Amarr populations? What of the Royal Navy?

The policies to be set in the future lie in the hands of Duke Farokh Khanid, soon to be King Khanid III. I would look to his guidance on these matters.

Just as a mention, there are many Cyberknights in the Empire of all colors and banner; orders, holder's guard, and independents alike.

Sinjin Mokk wrote:
Why are the Privy and Theology Councils so quiet on these matters?

Likely because they have no say in these matters until the new rulers of the Empire and Kingdom take their respective thrones and engage in dialogue.

Sinjin Mokk wrote:
We hope the new Emperor does not make the mistake of selling out that loyalty.

I do believe that we respect loyalty at least as much as you do. Fear not, the dawn of a new age is upon us.



Thank you Aldrith,

We shall have to see how things progress and trust in the Will of God.


"Angels live, they never die, Apart from us, behind the sky. They're fading souls who've turned to ice, So ashen white in paradise."
Nauplius
Hoi Andrapodistai
#12 - 2016-01-26 02:12:55 UTC
Aldrith Shutaq wrote:
I do believe that we respect loyalty at least as much as you do. Fear not, the dawn of a new age is upon us.


A new Age. A Blood Age. May it come quickly. Amen. Amarr Victor