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Decline in numbers... starting to turn into RAPID!!!

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Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#4061 - 2016-01-18 23:26:51 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
And even so, NO ONE is trying to compete with EVE, most of the games people like to call "competition" can't have more than a couple dozen people in the same place at the same time. Last night I played in 2 battles with more than 100 players per side, no tidi. When Elite and SC etc can do that i'll give them a look).
You don't need to try to compete with EVE. You releases a game based in space and you've pretty much got it covered. The only reason other games tend to not have huge numbers of players is because they have more than one tick per second, and even CCP is realising that was a mistake and nuking down the reasons to have large scale battles, which is a shame really because that one of the parts I really enjoyed.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Captain Tardbar
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4062 - 2016-01-18 23:54:59 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Captain Tardbar wrote:


I suspect PVP won't be the death of EVE, its the inability to keep up with emerging technologies and competing products that will.


This suggests that everyone cares about such things. Not all do, some of us don't care about the next big thing.

And even so, NO ONE is trying to compete with EVE, most of the games people like to call "competition" can't have more than a couple dozen people in the same place at the same time. Last night I played in 2 battles with more than 100 players per side, no tidi. When Elite and SC etc can do that i'll give them a look).

Quote:

Which is why CCP is betting big on Valkyrie. It will be their World of Tanks.


May they get rich with these low attention span MOBA lovers.


Large fights are over rated and mostly focus fire and getting cups of coffee in-between firing cycles.

Also when was the last large fight? Its been a while hasn't it.

Anyways... EVE players are a minority of the gaming universe and its quite amazing they have sustained their model so far which is why CCP put so much effort into Valkyrie. EVE is dead end for them. They'll keep it around for a while at least because of sentimental value. They won't put too much effort into after that.

Looking to talk on VOIP with other EVE players? Are you new and need help with EVE (welfare) or looking for advice? Looking for adversarial debate with angry people?

Captain Tardbar's Voice Discord Server
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#4063 - 2016-01-19 00:04:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
Captain Tardbar wrote:
Also when was the last large fight? Its been a while hasn't it.

Depends on what you mean by large fight.

If you mean headlines outside Eve media, then it was B-R5 in January 2014, so 2 years ago.

If you mean several full fleets on grid, grinding Tidi, there has been quite a few since then; some organised events (eg. Recent failed launch of Eve.tv), nullsec battles (eg. When Brave were in Catch) and some of the lowsec fights (eg. Costelle R64 moon fight) for example.

CCP specifically designed the news headlines fights out of the game beginning with Phoebe, but quite a few people seem to miss them now.
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#4064 - 2016-01-19 02:14:43 UTC
I don't think CODE works like that.

Why would they gank a 50 ship Skiff fleet when they can more easily gank pilots that haven't adjusted to their presence?
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#4065 - 2016-01-19 09:50:22 UTC
Shhhh. You are wrong.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#4066 - 2016-01-19 11:22:51 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Shhhh. You are wrong.

Convincing argumentation. Just watch the clip and read the PDF. I know it's horrible for you, but at least you won't remain wilfully ignorant then. That's a good thing, just so you know.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#4067 - 2016-01-19 11:36:41 UTC
Vic Jefferson wrote:

Take an average Saturday when numbers on are fairly high. Uedama alone almost certainly sees more isk value destroyed by ganks than any given region of sov sees in ratting losses.




Uedama losses to ganking on the 9th January 2016 24,548,919,939.01


Deklien ratting losses on the 9th January 2016 109,121,516,407.86


So the most policed region in null has over 4x more killed than one of the most dangerous highsec systems. Yet another myth busted.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#4068 - 2016-01-19 11:54:45 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Vic Jefferson wrote:

Take an average Saturday when numbers on are fairly high. Uedama alone almost certainly sees more isk value destroyed by ganks than any given region of sov sees in ratting losses.




Uedama losses to ganking on the 9th January 2016 24,548,919,939.01


Deklien ratting losses on the 9th January 2016 109,121,516,407.86


So the most policed region in null has over 4x more killed than one of the most dangerous highsec systems. Yet another myth busted.



Those are just facts, thought. They're nothing to do with the Truth.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#4069 - 2016-01-19 12:39:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
It's funny though, because baltec is still dodging the call to prove ganking is less common now than in previous years.

Oh and Tippia, shh.

Malcanis wrote:
Those are just facts, thought. They're nothing to do with the Truth.
By the way, just so it's clear, while I don't agree with the guy that uedama is going to have more losses than null ratters of an entire region (not without a good look at the stats, anyway), he did say "Take an average Saturday", while baltec chose the one saturday when a multiboxing ratter lost 24 carriers in Deklein.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#4070 - 2016-01-19 12:47:39 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
It's funny though, because baltec is still dodging the call to prove ganking is less common now than in previous years.

Oh and Tippia, shh.

Malcanis wrote:
Those are just facts, thought. They're nothing to do with the Truth.
By the way, just so it's clear, while I don;t agree with the guy that uedama is going to have more losses than null ratters of an entire region, he did say "Take an average Saturday", while baltec chose the one saturday when a multiboxing ratter lost 24 carriers in Deklein.


I showed you, that you are unwilling to follow information or links is not my problem.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#4071 - 2016-01-19 12:50:09 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
I showed you, that you are unwilling to follow information or links is not my problem.
No, you didn't. You simply restated that ice interdictions happened and still ignored the record breaking gank events from last year.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
King Aires
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#4072 - 2016-01-19 12:55:20 UTC  |  Edited by: King Aires
Lucas Kell wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
I showed you, that you are unwilling to follow information or links is not my problem.
No, you didn't. You simply restated that ice interdictions happened and still ignored the record breaking gank events from last year.



But Lucas, the mouth-breathers don't consider blowing up Freighters and Orcas and Bowheads ganking remember.

Oh and Tippia saying that you linked to your 2008 sources by simply saying "I got them from CCP" is not actually linking them.
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#4073 - 2016-01-19 12:58:53 UTC
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#4074 - 2016-01-19 13:04:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
King Aires wrote:
But Lucas, the mouth-breathers don't consider blowing up Freighters and Orcas and Bowheads ganking remember.

The only one saying that is Lucas, so unless you're calling him a mouth-breather, your insulting the wrong people.

Quote:
Oh and Tippia saying that you linked to your 2008 sources by simply saying "I got them from CCP" is not actually linking them.

…and that's why I linked them instead. You should follow those links. Again, I understand that you don't want to since you want to maintain this truly fascinating head-canon where we I didn't follow my own dictum and you had some reason to be outraged. Unfortunately, reality has a strong anti-you bias in this regard, and at some point, you're just going to have to accept that reality.

Lucas Kell wrote:
Oh and Tippia, shh.

So I'm right then, since you are utterly incapable of mounting even the feeblest defence for your wilful and continued ignorance and abject refusal to look at the documents I provided.
You lost. You have proven this beyond any doubt by now.
Live with it. Or, you know, don't — either works for me. I formally accept your surrender at this point.
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#4075 - 2016-01-19 13:12:08 UTC
Quote:
4. Personal attacks are prohibited.

Commonly known as flaming, personal attacks are posts that are designed to personally berate or insult another forum user. Posts of this nature are not conductive to the community spirit that CCP promotes. As such, this kind of behavior will not be tolerated.

36. Posting of kill reports outside of the Crime & Punishment forum channel is prohibited.

More often than not, posts of this nature are made with inflammatory intent and are designed to promote trolling and flaming. Therefore, the posting of links to kill reports from any third party site, or the direct copy-pasting of kill reports from in game is prohibited on all forum channels of the EVE Online Forums, with the exception of the Crime & Punishment Channel.



Removed post and those quoting them for the above reasons.

ISD Max Trix

Lieutenant

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

I do not respond to EVE mails about forum moderation.
King Aires
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#4076 - 2016-01-19 13:21:12 UTC
I actually followed your link. And it doesn't say what you think it says.

They are listing the first jihadswarm ganking event of 2008 for Q1 and Q1 only. Those numbers are an anomaly and don't support baltec1's theory that 2012 was worse than 2014 or 2015.

Furthermore, look at the player averages during and after said event.

Eve-Online was growing very fast 2004-2008.

Ganking events started Q1 2008 and the growth stopped cold. By March of 2008 the numbers dropped and stayed down until the winter expansion 2008 late.

What happened in November 2008? Quantum Rise.

So unless you want to lend credence to the idea that ganking killed the growth of the game from 2004-2008, your numbers show that one concentrated event that went from an average of what you linked to over 30 procurers per day in 2015. Well I don't think you want to go there.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#4077 - 2016-01-19 13:24:12 UTC
Tippia wrote:
So I'm right then
Nope, I'm just done with feeding the troll.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#4078 - 2016-01-19 13:24:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
King Aires wrote:
I actually followed your link. And it doesn't say what you think it says.

You have the quotes. Please show where they differ from what was said and written.

Quote:
Ganking events started Q1 2008 and the growth stopped cold. By March of 2008 the numbers dropped and stayed down until the winter expansion 2008 late.
…which is exactly what I said.

Lucas Kell wrote:
I'm just the troll.

Your continued use of fallacies will not suddenly make you right or me wrong.
You still lost. Live with it. I formally accept your surrender.
Bloomer
One Man Isk Printing Machine
#4079 - 2016-01-19 13:40:28 UTC
Tippia wrote:
King Aires wrote:
I actually followed your link. And it doesn't say what you think it says.

You have the quotes. Please show where they differ from what was said and written.

Quote:
Ganking events started Q1 2008 and the growth stopped cold. By March of 2008 the numbers dropped and stayed down until the winter expansion 2008 late.
…which is exactly what I said.

Lucas Kell wrote:
I'm just the troll.

Your continued use of fallacies will not suddenly make you right or me wrong.
You still lost. Live with it. I formally accept your surrender.



Your link way back doesn't have CCP breaking down kill done by NPCs or Players. Your link also doesn't break down Security status. So neither does zKillboard.com

I took Y15' numbers added them up and divided them. Almost all kills per day are higher in 2015 than the terrible 2008 "Goon-Gank" or whatever they called it. 35.4 Procurers were lost per day in 2015 for example, that isn't taking the worst month or anything, that is a raw average. Compare that to 17 lost per day AVG Q108 and 37 lost in the worst day of the whole year.


I guess what I am saying is, Tippia where do you think your numbers help your cause?
King Aires
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#4080 - 2016-01-19 13:42:34 UTC  |  Edited by: King Aires
Bloomer wrote:
Tippia wrote:
King Aires wrote:
I actually followed your link. And it doesn't say what you think it says.

You have the quotes. Please show where they differ from what was said and written.

Quote:
Ganking events started Q1 2008 and the growth stopped cold. By March of 2008 the numbers dropped and stayed down until the winter expansion 2008 late.
…which is exactly what I said.

Lucas Kell wrote:
I'm just the troll.

Your continued use of fallacies will not suddenly make you right or me wrong.
You still lost. Live with it. I formally accept your surrender.



Your link way back doesn't have CCP breaking down kill done by NPCs or Players. Your link also doesn't break down Security status. So neither does zKillboard.com

I took Y15' numbers added them up and divided them. Almost all kills per day are higher in 2015 than the terrible 2008 "Goon-Gank" or whatever they called it. 35.4 Procurers were lost per day in 2015 for example, that isn't taking the worst month or anything, that is a raw average. Compare that to 17 lost per day AVG Q108 and 37 lost in the worst day of the whole year.


I guess what I am saying is, Tippia where do you think your numbers help your cause?



Please don't forget CCP stated in their report that Procurers were the favored barge, because of newbro skills. And that Procurers are much harder to kill today than they were in 2008. Also there was 12,000 more players online every day in 2008 on average than there is today, so more targets in theory.

But don't get into it with Tippia. It isn't worth the bandwidth tbh.