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How to not be terrible?
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Tallianna Avenkarde
Pyre of Gods
#21 - 2012-01-02 16:08:58 UTC
Definately leave your corp. Anyone that offers to train pvp nublets, then whines about killboard efficiency is a tool.

Agony Unleashed, RVB, not so much eve uni, I think they teach you the "mechanics" but tend to pvp more in blobs.

You could join 303, we are as terrible as they get, don't care about KB stats, and are currently whelping ourselves into all forms of PVP. :P

Just sayin ;)

And a sudden plunge in the sullen swell. Ten fathoms deep on the road to hell.
Rellik B00n
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2012-01-03 01:19:30 UTC
mmmm plunge 
[Of a request for change ask: Who Benefits?](https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=199765)
Jack Dant
The Gentlemen of Low Moral Fibre
#23 - 2012-01-03 09:52:21 UTC
Cromwell Savage wrote:
For Palladius - let me clarify this a little.

Security status has nothing to do with gate/station gun aggro. Whomever goes or is GCC (global criminal) within range of gate/station guns will get aggro regardless if you are +5 or -10.

Now, what sec status does allow, if someone is -5 or below (red outlaw), you can shoot them without going GCC. But once you do, they can then shoot back without GCC as well since you aggressed them first. So.....if you want the guns on your side - let the other guy shoot first.

That's exactly what he meant. People don't want to have the sentries against them, so you are more likely to get fights if you are outlaw. Then people can engage you, and you can shoot back, and the sentries don't shoot anyone. When soloing, especially in a BC, you can't take sentry fire unless you are just shooting haulers. The added dps from sentries, with their perfect tracking, will unbalance any 1v1 fight.

What happens in lowsec, stays in lowsec, lowering the barrier to entry to lowsec PVP: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=476644&#post476644
Othran
Route One
#24 - 2012-01-03 10:02:49 UTC
As an aside Agony Unleashed have made their wiki pages public - I'd recommend a browse through as I think most people would learn something.

Linkage to forum thread
Luh Windan
green fish hat bang bang
#25 - 2012-01-03 12:08:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Luh Windan
random points :-

I'm learning PvP myself right now - although my corp don't hassle about my losses and are all extremely good PvPers and are more than happy to share advice. Going out on roams with one or more members has been a fantastic introduction.

I've been tentatively doing solo stuff. You need to be patient (or prepared to smack talk which isn't my style) and I'm coming to realise that 80-90% of PvP is reading the situation.

My skills number wise aren't far off my corp mates but what they have that I don't is knowledge. I'm working on that: every time I pass a gate I see if i know what type of boats are at it by name (this in high sec obviously) and read up about them if not. I keep reading the agreesIon mechanics - still don't quite remember them all. I read through my corp mates billboards (and ask questions). etc. etc.

The rifterdrifer site mentioned above helped me raise my game.

If you've got the isk then I'd go out in something bigger than a frigate - I'm learning to solo with Ruptures right now. it has enough tank to get you past the "rabbit in the headlight" bit. Again when with the corp I'm in a BC or a T2 cruiser and not normally primary which gets you in the thick of things with time to observe (mostly) which gives more insight.

I remember learning to drive (rather a long time ago!) and the driving instructor saying "change into 2nd" as I'm mid corner and wondering how you would *ever* be able to remember all of the different things that needed to be thought about. And of course like all practiced drivers I don't even think about changing gear - it's just muscle memory now. I'm just starting to see that PvP can be like that.

(not an alt - we all have to learn and you get nowhere by pretending you are brilliant before you actually are. I intend to get blown up loads and ask lots of questions until I'm genuinely really good at it)
Stukkler Tian
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2012-01-06 17:01:33 UTC

So, basically try to guess what the other guy's game is and warp away if I'm not reasonably sure I can kill him before his backup arrives?

But, the other guy's going to be doing the same to me. So, if I surmise that I can beat him then he'll surmise the same thing and disengage unless I'm wrong or he's being crafty.

I never imagined PVP would be 90% feinting and sizing each other up. How the heck do people do all that calculus in the 2 seconds before a fight starts all while juggling modules and managing range/speed? Is it just practice?

Reminds me of...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6MRR8IRvDQ[/quote]



That is what is so cool about pvp in eve, especially in a solo setting. The hunt to find the perfect target can be just as fun as the actual fight, you have to size up that opponent. One of the best ways to do this is to simply look up the killboard of anyone in local you have a mind to kill. This can show you what ship types they favor what fits they might be using if they are indeed a solo fighter or if they are a fan of the blob tactics and most likely bait.
Before fights ask yourself what you would worry about if you were flying your opponents ship, then do exactly that (if im in a wolf the only rifter i fear is a td rifter so if im going to fight a wolf in a rifter i will fit a td).
Or if all else fails do what i did when i first started, fit for maximum dmg and keep the fights as short and brainless as possible. (just warp in everything overheated and don't stop til something explodes.) Dont give your opponent time to size you or the situation up and keep the fight short enough that you cant screw something up.
Also leave your corp they sound like asshats. RvB kicks ass join it but get used to flying mostly cruisers frigs and dessys and you will still get blobbed most of the time.
Kara Books
Deal with IT.
#27 - 2012-01-06 23:24:26 UTC
Cromwell Savage wrote:
Don't go at it alone. Go out in small groups with the really skilled pilots in your corp to get the mechanics down - to include the "buck fever" you get during a fight.

Doing is the only way you will really learn. However, doing "it" with skilled pilots at your side in small group engagements make for a better learning experience. This way, mistakes won't always be fatal and you will hopefully have positive experiences to build upon.

When you feel ready - then start to go for the 1v1's - whether mutual or not :P .


Make friends and join every friendly fleet engagement you can get yourself into.
you dont know the limits until you push yourself to the limit.
Maximillian Bonaparte
Interstellar Booty Hunters
#28 - 2012-01-07 21:13:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Maximillian Bonaparte
Another plus 1 for RvB, you'll be accepted quickly, very noob friendly, and training is offered.

You are already not afraid of loosing ships - small fleet/gang ops run several times a day, arranged 1v1 almost anytime you want, and you'll be free to loose 2-3 ships a day in RvB and no one will bat an eye - you are also unlikely to get podded by RvB people.

The more I know about PvP, the less I 'know' about PvP. Pirate

Interstellar Booty Hunters - Pirate Small Gang PvP Forever!
Giovanni Auditore
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#29 - 2012-01-08 07:15:41 UTC
if ur trying to learn pvp.. DO NOT fly a Frigate / interceptor or anything small.. fights like that are way too fast to be learning anything.. I say use BCs to learn pvp..

Also, i will link you a channel on youtube called JampyZero , this guy is really good at explaining solo PVP and gang PVP, and i gurantee you will learn alot from it.

JampyZero

/Gio
Palladius Ahashion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#30 - 2012-01-08 17:12:40 UTC
I appreciate all the responses here. I have decided to leave my current corp. There aren't many active players in it, and they start their roams about an hour after I go to bed. They get pissy about my play schedule and my lack of PVP skillz. Even so, I'm really at a loss as to what to do next. I'm willing to get exploded as often as it takes to learn, but my play time is not infinite. Other than RvB, can anyone recommend a decent, ACTIVE, PvP focused corp that would recruit someone with almost zero PvP experience and train them to not suck?
Lady Spank
Get Out Nasty Face
#31 - 2012-01-08 17:24:08 UTC
Palladius Ahashion wrote:
I appreciate all the responses here. I have decided to leave my current corp. There aren't many active players in it, and they start their roams about an hour after I go to bed. They get pissy about my play schedule and my lack of PVP skillz. Even so, I'm really at a loss as to what to do next. I'm willing to get exploded as often as it takes to learn, but my play time is not infinite. Other than RvB, can anyone recommend a decent, ACTIVE, PvP focused corp that would recruit someone with almost zero PvP experience and train them to not suck?


Talliana invited you to Beasts of Burden at the top of this page. I used to fly with them way back and for the most part were pretty chill. I don't know what they are like these days except Talliana is very helpful on the forums but I'd see what they have to offer you.

(ಠ_ృ) ~ It Takes a Million Years to Become Diamonds So Lets Just Burn Like Coal Until the Sky's Black ~ (ಠ_ృ)
Palladius Ahashion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#32 - 2012-01-08 17:44:37 UTC
Yeah, just noticed that. I'll definitely give them a look.
Kessiaan
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#33 - 2012-01-08 19:27:38 UTC
When I got sick of mining years and years ago and decided to get into PvP, I joined the Gallente militia and proceeded to get lots of Tristans shot out from under me.

Although it's not the route I'd suggest for new players, learning how to pvp effectively in a slow, short-range, triple-split frigate was definitely one of the most useful experiences I've ever had in this game. Now I fly a 'cane for the most part (since I'm retraining Minmatar for my current corp) and its total easymode by comparison.

But, since it looks like Rifters aren't working out for you, definitely try something else. And DEFINITELY get out of your current corp if you don't like it - living in lowsec is a thousand times easier with a good corp that you fit in well with, and living in nullsec is practically impossible without one.

KB Link
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#34 - 2012-01-08 19:31:47 UTC
Buy a logistics alt, a booster alt and a falcon alt.
Lady Spank
Get Out Nasty Face
#35 - 2012-01-08 20:30:47 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Buy a logistics alt, a booster alt and a falcon alt.

Ignore shiptoasting moron alts that can't prove any genuine combat experience.

(ಠ_ృ) ~ It Takes a Million Years to Become Diamonds So Lets Just Burn Like Coal Until the Sky's Black ~ (ಠ_ృ)
shal ri
Short Bus Window Licker
#36 - 2012-01-09 17:06:37 UTC
there is ofc many things to keep track of when u pvp, its not the easiest thing to get the hang of in the slightest. as said by many others that posted, eperience is everything. BCs are great ships to use for pvp they can tank and gank at the same time ( with the right fit ofc ) and can take most ships on. however knowing is half the battle. most pvpers will know bait when they see it. some times is ballent, other times its not.

frigs are goin to be tough to start with. they have such a small range of targets the can kill u cant really find the fights u want even when there are ships on scan to kill. cruisers are ur best bet to pvp with when startin out as they can tank and move with some nice speed, ie the rupture is a great ships as well as the vexor.
if u want to do solo pvp in a BC, the myrm is the best solo ship the money can buy. it will own every other bc under the sun solo. yes i said EVERY BC. it ofc requires alot of micro management so not the best to start at the same token.

living in the same area also goes a long way to helpin in the intel department of pvp. knowings whos blue with who and whos does wat at certain times will get u kills more often then not. get the idea of a fair fight out of ur head. there no such thing as a fair fight. EVER. common sense is just as useful in eve as the mods on ur ship. u wouldnt follow some 1 to a dark alley at mid night just cuz they said that u could get a good deal on a tv. that just spells ******.

knowing ship fits for certain ships is a great way to get the upper hand in an engagement. like drakes for example theres 3 fits that ppl come up with on that ship. nano heavy drake, passive drake for the fags that fear losing thier ship, and the heavy asaault drake. so its a toss up between those fits but atleast u know wat u can do against the ship when its presented to u and fly accordingly.
Palladius Ahashion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#37 - 2012-01-09 17:43:08 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Buy a logistics alt, a booster alt and a falcon alt.


With all the ISK farming I'd have to do to pay for the extra accounts, toons, PLEX, and ships when would I have time to PVP?

And if I'm gonna blow all that cash on winning, why wouldn't I just pay people to let me kill them?
Kessiaan
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#38 - 2012-01-09 18:33:33 UTC
shal ri wrote:
if u want to do solo pvp in a BC, the myrm is the best solo ship the money can buy. it will own every other bc under the sun solo. yes i said EVERY BC. it ofc requires alot of micro management so not the best to start at the same token.


I love my dual-rep Myrm to death (multiple deaths, actually), but I'd question this statement. The Myrm (even a shield Myrm) is much slower than a run-of-the-mill shield tanked nanocane, which can kite it to death (after popping your drones) pretty easily if the pilot is even remotely decent. Same with the Drake - heavy shield tank can ignore your drones for a long time, and with a nano or two in the lows is faster and more agile than the Myrm, you'll just never get to web range. At best you can make them withdraw, and if they have friends you have zero GTFO ability. And don't even get me started on sentries popping your drones.

KB Link
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#39 - 2012-01-09 19:44:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Vimsy Vortis
Lady Spank wrote:
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Buy a logistics alt, a booster alt and a falcon alt.

Ignore shiptoasting moron alts that can't prove any genuine combat experience.

Not sure who you're talking to.
shal ri
Short Bus Window Licker
#40 - 2012-01-10 22:43:35 UTC
Kessiaan wrote:
shal ri wrote:
if u want to do solo pvp in a BC, the myrm is the best solo ship the money can buy. it will own every other bc under the sun solo. yes i said EVERY BC. it ofc requires alot of micro management so not the best to start at the same token.


I love my dual-rep Myrm to death (multiple deaths, actually), but I'd question this statement. The Myrm (even a shield Myrm) is much slower than a run-of-the-mill shield tanked nanocane, which can kite it to death (after popping your drones) pretty easily if the pilot is even remotely decent. Same with the Drake - heavy shield tank can ignore your drones for a long time, and with a nano or two in the lows is faster and more agile than the Myrm, you'll just never get to web range. At best you can make them withdraw, and if they have friends you have zero GTFO ability. And don't even get me started on sentries popping your drones.



thats when palyer skill comes into play. nano canes play at about 12 to 15 k range. and with 2 med neuts it came be a pain. but if u know wat ur doin myrm will **** nano canes as they cant micro forever running the nuets tryin to cap out the myrm. if u let ppl pop ur drones then ur just stupid. myrms have an over heat micro of about 1300 so will catch **** on the go with the right situation.

plus webs overheat to 13k. if that cane get in range hes dead. join that with ecm 600s and u got 1 mean solo ship. nut as with all pvp its player skill intensive. ive used the myrm many time on gate camps keepin an eye on ur drones is key.
like i said it requires alot of micro mangement to fly but a great ship all around.
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