Player Features and Ideas Discussion

OGB in their current state are damn near immune to risk. EVE is built on risk vs reward. Yet you can have a 6 link tengu follow around your svipul in LS and hug a gate or station for total immunity. Or make it where you have to invest in an HG virtue set just to probe one down in nul. Not to mention being nullified and cloaky so it can dodge gate camps too.

You park your booster and go use your cancer of choice (svipul, garmur, orthrus, gila etc) and you have an almost risk free way of pvping. Its not "just" the boosters i have issue with. Its the combination of links, HG implants and drugs that really make for rediculous scenarios. Like 11k/s garmurs or 4.5k/s gilas. Anyone can buy and plug in a set of implants or pop some pills. For links though you need a dedicated account pushing this out of the realm of a casual player.

Thats what is needed are more casual players, going out and experiencing pvp and learning the mechanics. Not be forced to feel like they NEED links to compete against all the elite lowsec pvp tryhards. Who think they're awesome because they have a 2nd account that does nothing but boost 1 ship. We make that ease of access easier and more pvp will come naturally.

In the case of fleets, every fleet has their own links. Hell when i lived in null our self defense fleet had links. Saying you need links to take on another fleet is silly. That other fleet has the same links you do. Removing links would make zero difference in what you do now, and what you do then. Both parties are on equal footing. If you really need to sig tank, pop that pill that reduces sig radius :)

Weren't fittings tweaked as well? Guess I need to re-read, but the point is that all CCP has said is that OGB changes are in the works and they are looking at making it AoE. Very vague. They might just change the warfare links to an area, or they might change everything and give us command battleships for high tank environments.

Main point I was stating is that due to the sheer lack of info, the direction of this topic would better be suited as to how to make on grid, and being and on grid pilot just an awesome role. Something that serious and focused players need only apply for instead of just a background alt on a side monitor.

actually i was going by the trends very few new players stick around from any of the major influxes and i used to FC incursions and hunt in wormholes so speaking from experience that there are just as many pve OGB's as pvp ones and i rarely saw OGB's in pvp when i lived in null and i always ran my command ship on grid shooting and tackling stuff.

Not sure how we made a connection, but if new players dont stick, is proof they are bored. I used to FC incursions as well. One of the first fcs and ran some of the largest fleets during the live events. To this day people from back then see me in channels and start a convo to say hi.

The game mechanics only go so far. It is up to us to make sure it is a rewarding experience

Not to sound rude, but what this says to me is
"I have more money to spend on Eve, therefore I should have a distinct advantage over those will less real world income."

Seriously, you're saying that because you can afford and/or have more time to spend earning ISK to PLEX your account, you should be better taken care of by CCP.
That is fundamentally against the design intent of Eve.

OGB 1 player to overpower another without representation, out playing/fitting, and allows a player with more personal wealth and/or free time.
Eve allows a player to potentially overpower you with a less powerful ship based on piloting skill (in some cases).
If you wish to pilot a second ship at the same time, then it either needs to be uninvolved with the fight/a small factor or you need to have the skill to be able to manage two ships actively involved in the fight.

Ahh, I misunderstood you, sorry about that, but I think I get what you mean.

The combat of small ambusher gangs taking out larger fleets. At current, having the hidden mobile off grid booster is the only way to get the advantage. Battlecruisers are kind of a pain to kite with. Not to mention reducing the mobility of the fleet on the whole.

Remember though, we do have the command dessies coming out as well, they are quite fast, though a little pricey for a more low cost cheap roaming fleet and will be in a hazard situation. Also will probably only be offering the one boost as to prevent gimping the fit too much. Still, no reason why a person cannot fit the rapid deployment then have a second ship to fit interdiction maneuvers. The jump drive has potential for kiting fleets as well as it can permit you to essentially cherry pick and yoink ships away from other threats.

The issue comes down to when is multiboxing just increasing your own productivity vs detracting from gameplay. Also, must consider the meaning of certain things from a new player and gameplay perspective. Will go along with your examples there. All good ones.

1. Cyno alts-this is the prime example of redundancy in eve. Yes, are needed for cap movements efficiently, but before fatigue changes, it was to the point where I was getting hazed for not having one. My caps cannot move unless I am in a group, and each cyno is at my own risk and I understand it. However, cap warfare really wouldn't function well without it. As a player, who wants to be stuck sitting in an assured to die and stuck frozen beacon in space. Has to be a better way, but for now, I would be hard pressed to hold fault with having a cyno alt.

2. Scout alts. This one is not quite good gameplay. Yeah, people do it but I have been in and heard more than a fair share of stories of ops blown because the person looked away from scout alt to move main, only to miss critical intel of a cyno showing up or a fleet jumping through gate, etc. Paranoia is the main reason that scout alts exist. Fair fair, solo moving through pirate space, but at the same time, it is doable without scouts. I used to do it all the time.

3. Region trader alts. Same as cyno alts. I mean it does what it does. Doing it without is pure tedium and contains absolutely no real value. If I did business, you bet I would get tired jumping back and forth between main hub regions time and time again.

4. Triple webber alts. This is a product of our own making. Veterans worried about killboards etc. and as such, are not getting disposable newbies to have fun and get into eve doing tackle. Only way to get around this is a more involved combat system in which case multiboxing will just be a weakness to you.

5. Mining and missioning? Well the player's loss (fun wise) by not including others in what you do. Yeah, you made more isk, but when I can have a kick ass time with four other friends, all in mauraders running level four missions just to hang out and be friends? I win out overall. Once more though, a product of underdeveloped mechanics that makes this doable.

6. Industry and research. Like trading, no real way around it. I mean you start it and wait. If that is where majority of your SP lies, what is there to do but to change to another character to do something else, even if it is rotating characters so you are continually researching and industry.


Overall, it is a common thread, and one that OGB fits into. Uninvolved gameplay. Some things, such as trading and industry, is a tough one to work around. Others, desperately need updating. Either way, uninvolved gameplay does not attract or retain players. I mean multiboxing is the way to get a more fulfilling experience. As such, whenever something is changed to make it involved enough so it cannot be multibox, that is a win provided it is gameplay, and not just tedium (aka minigaming)

i don't mind the removal of ogb used for pvp, but only on two conditions:
1.the passive effect of skills that impact fleet members while they are in fleet, such as leadership, continue to be offgrid
2. links that don't improve defensive/offensive/pvp support capability remain offgrid.

Faction warfare really is one of the best places to stick a newbean, however. Seriously, being in one by default should be an option for character creation.

Accessible individual income to recoup losses, good chance of action, and a relatively friendly community so long as you don't choose Gallente. It is the perfect way to get new players into the game.

And yeah, while people might just swap to Falcons in order to game 1v1 fights, at least that ****** is on the field where you can take a crack at him, not cloaked up fifty AU at the bottom of the system providing his unknowable boosts.

It's still a far better situation than we have now. Idk about you, but anyone I pick up anymore is getting pointed right to FW again, moreso now that Brave is basically dead.

Eh, baby steps I guess. They still have a ways to go to make PvP more accessible, but this is a step in the right direction. If they deploy this at the same time as the citadels we might see more impact.