Player Features and Ideas Discussion

And if you actually believe that 100mil or 500 mill is too high a price in eve actually, you maybe need a reality check.
Those prices were decided when plex didnt cost 1.2 b a piece, it's high time they go up XD

Its being discussed so much because:
a- Too many troll wardecs from corps who say they want to do war but cant bother to wardec people who are asking for war, they ll just wardec nullsec alliance/corps who just dont care enough to mount a response to these small game fish
b-wardec trolls who just go after noob corps or people who dont care about pvp (i think there is a good portion of eve players who play for the pve experience)
c-all these wardec corps do, is camp stations/gates, so i guess, they dont have much to do beside asking for more stupid concesion in this forum and crying about how unjust the system is to them.
d-wardec a corp or 2 or 5 is ok but when you see a corp with +2000 active wardec against alliances and corps, you can just conclude that the current system is kinda stupid. And it just means that the wardec costs are too low and the isk gains are too huge at the moment.
e-please wardec trolls, stop crying about how unjust/unfair the system is, and stop docking up at the first sign of resistance at the first sigh of resistance. AND PLEASE STOP TALKING ABOUT HOW ELITE PVP YOU ARE (we all saw it in your forums and recruitment posts lol) cause there is nothing elite about about ganking badgers with t3 blobs.
f- peace

If you want to declare war on nullsec alliances, why dont you go fight them in nullsec instead of ganking new players. and pls dont say that you fear you ll be blobbed in nullsec, first not all nullsec alliances have the numbers to blob, and second wardec troll corps are just blobs with more protection and less restrictions in high sec.
And last of all, id like to hear how you propose nullsec alliances could defend themeselfs against high sec wardecs? lol should they form a fleet once they have intel then do +30/40 jumps just to have you dock up? Be realistic for once, its impossible to respond to high sec wardecs and thats why you do it cause you dont expect any resistance from your targets...

1) The system would be better off using the contracts system allowing conditions to be set (surrender penalties/buyouts) as well as a victory condition - whoever surrenders allows the other to get the war dec cost that would be in escrow. Escrow prevents scamming.

2) Population base costs are there to allow small entities to enter into wars easily against other similar sized corps. Don't protect the small guys this is bad.

3) We were under a war dec for over a month and just avoided the station campers. Most "war dec" corps are just terrible. Hi Marmite Collective! And they don't hunt you down. Just move to low sec or w-space.

4) Bounty system is just a scammer dream...just ignore it. It is a terrible feature as implemented. Again contract system so I can put out hits on people. (allow me to even specify a ship class they must be flying for the full bounty - no noobship scamming - also podding condition)

5) Use of in-game contract system would be better than current "hand-shake" merc contracts. War decs should paralyze corps - members can neither join nor leave during the dec. After a war is over there should be a cooldown period for the corp that was dec'd for a week to prevent griefing. Multiple corps war deccing at is fine since people can neither leave nor join during a war. Again an anti-scam measure.

6) Surrender penalties can apply to both sides - discouraging the aggressor from cancelling a war
7) Surrenders and Victories should show up in corp/alliance war history.

sorry but english is not my main language, ill try to do better next time XD

honestly, this reflects very accurately the extremely poor opinion the rest of the game has of highsec in general despite what is an obvious lack of information.

the hub camping dock game playing mercs make up a significant portion of the highsec merc community for sure, but they are not the entirety. for every marmite there are 2, although smaller, hunting focused groups who pick up the slack where hub campers fail by deccing people and chasing them to where they hide. the reason most people know of marmite/pirat is because they see them every day in the same place doing the same thing with the safest tactics they can. meanwhile the rest of the population are not seen as frequently and as a result are completely ignored by everyone who is not apart of the situation.

sometimes i feel like the only person in the whole game who thinks that highsec pvp could be something UNIQUE to the game and not just the crappy state its in now and also not another lowsec/nullsec. every time wardecs are discussed the overwhelming response is "just go to null or low and be a real pilot". which besides being worthless overall further ingrains the idea that highsec pvp and anything related to it deserves to die.

i think that with a few small changes and perhaps a shift in culture. highsec pvp could become unique and interesting without having to be the training area for "the real game".

to prove the point. think of every narky critique and criticism of highsec mercs and pvp and apply them to blops. you will notice that as gameplay they are almost exactly the same. for me, i dont like roaming in low/null looking for "fights" where nothing is at stake besides the ships and nothing happens to the loser except having to go home. its just not how i like to play the game. i get a real kick out of hunting specific groups down and hitting them where they do not want to be hit. this on principle means that i will avoid pvp where i did not plan for it to happen, although i welcome the opportunity to be interrupted and fail.

the point is there are only blops and highsec wardecs where i can do that and the barrier of entry for blops is so high that it encourages even more risk averse behavior. i think that highsec pvp is a unique opportunity to not only have a lower entry level for blops style gameplay, but be something special as well.

An interesting thought so here is the challenge for you and all of the rest of those who actually go hunt war targets.
How would you change the system so you can continue to do what you do, AND prevent the vast majority that simply gate or station camp portion of WD?

And you are wrong on your assessment of the go to low / nul and fight as well. There is no genius level of intelligence required this is just a proper application of common sense and the ability to understand basic human nature. If you want a fight then WD those who like and want to fight and most of those players live in low / nul / worm holes. On the other hand if you choose to spend your ISK to WD a group of high sec indy players then you get what you paid for, a week of sitting around and hoping that someone gets stupid so you can shoot them.

You are hooked to the sensation of accomplishment you get out of beating people you consider bad at the game?

yes and if you are insinuating that most people don't then you are a straight up liar

and as Donnachadh pointed out. no one in this thread has given any reason that these proposed changes would not bring about the changes to wardecs and highsec pvp that most people agree are needed. the only comments i have gotten are snarky vapid posts and "i don't like wardeccers rawr".

it perfectly illustrates the true problem with highsec currently. anyone outside of it calls it bad, anyone inside of it is too egotistical to admit it might be bad, and the few of us who believe it can be better are constantly drowned out by the people who just want it to be like everything else.

#1
Before anything, they need to make dropping corp to evade a wardec a bannable offense. There's no counter to that besides suicide ganking, which is also being slowly whittled away at.

#2
As for the OP, I like this idea a lot.

I feel like it would shift the focus from terrorizing stubborn carebears and apathetic nullbear alliances to something more like a bunch of small mercenary gangs competing for supremacy, with, hopefully, a bunch of back stabbing, corp infiltration, and local smack talk. It will also pull the *billions and billions* of isk spent on dec costs back from the ether and into circulation allowing for a new potential profession, fueled by ingame mechanics. It might also throw a wrench in the station game hegemony that some groups have around important trade stations.

I feel like a good wardec system would help transform Highsec from the current babby's playpin with Daddy Concord making sure everything's boring into a gritty, politically complex metropolis with shady deals going down between small, dangerous mercenary groups and big, profitable carebear/indy/hauling mafias. In a perfect world, it would not be shameful to never leave highsec because the pvp would be equally high stakes.

I think, as mentioned earlier in the thread, "assassination" contracts would compliment this well, at least just on a thematic level. I've also always wanted a kind of "Arch-nemesis" mechanic, where you pay some huge amount of isk, like 5 bil, and you can pvp one specific person, without Concord interfering, for like 2 months. Thoughts on that?

I especially like how groups like Marmite and PIRAT (I have nothing against Marmite; I've got some friends in Marmite, and I can tell you that they are not bad at pvp, nor are they risk averse. They are running a profitable business in the most efficient way possible. That isn't to say they should be immune to having their way of life shuffled around ) would quickly find themselves with massive bounties on their heads, which would get them more and more paranoid. Watching big wardec corps implode into civil war would be really interesting.

#3
As someone who started pvping in a small, elite wardec corp that adopted my carebear ass despite the fact that I was bad, I can attest to how highsec pvp can begin the process of drawing carebears out of their procurers and into the mentality of aggressive content creation.

As for "grr wardeccers", there shouldn't be a single place in New Eden where you are 100% safe, except *maybe* when you're docked and logged off. All corps are able to defend themselves, not just mechanically (i.e. fit warp core stabs, cloak, mjd, or even f-fight *gasp*) but strategically (i.e. have neutral eyes, watchlist, safe spots, insta docks, common sense around trade hubs, etc); and if a corp can't manage to do this, then it should either seek help or roll over, becoming the prey of those who can adapt. OP's idea would make it easier and more profitable for the helpless to find protection, without relying on Daddy Concord.

Peace