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Survey

Author
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2015-11-19 12:23:30 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:


eg succubus

can engage and disengage at will.

etc



Unfortunatly not true Sad Anemic dps, easilly kited, relativly squishy and completely screwed by any type of neut... And thats not taking into account T3D's R us...

There is word of a buff coming tho... will have to see if they go far enough

No Worries

Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2015-11-19 12:28:31 UTC
i thought it was an iffy statement tbh.

the dd is also screwed by any neut
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2015-11-19 12:39:23 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:
i thought it was an iffy statement tbh.

the dd is also screwed by any neut


Yeah but it has 90% webs... NINETY PER CENT!!!! Shocked

No Worries

Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2015-11-19 12:43:36 UTC
lol yeah so either rails + navy web @ ~230dps

or risk neuts w blasters

also succubus in small neut range?
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#25 - 2015-11-19 12:52:02 UTC  |  Edited by: ChromeStriker
Bastion Arzi wrote:
lol yeah so either rails + navy web @ ~230dps

or risk neuts w blasters

also succubus in small neut range?


If you dont turn off theyre MWDs either a Frig will outrun you or you will have little to no transversal against a cruiser... both mean death What?

With the DD... your doing 300-400 blaster dps... if you catch something in web range you'll likely kill it before you cap out... well... one hopes lol

No Worries

Xzanos
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2015-11-19 17:52:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Xzanos
ShahFluffers wrote:
Xzanos wrote:
Im just going to come out and say it. I fly 100% Minmatar. That said i can not for the life of me find out what actually viable role most of our ships are supposed to fit into. I understand volley and know that it is a tactic used in fleets to nullify the effectiveness of enemy logistics. But what else is there?

If you are relatively new to PvP then I suggest you poke around New Citizens Q&A for awhile. Lots of good information in there.

Some examples;
A Breecher can be fit for brawling OR it can be fit to kite the enemy. The difference will lie in how it is fit.
Fit with Rockets and an Afterburner you can brawl quite effectively. However you will be vulnerable to hostiles that are faster than you. If you fit the Breecher with Light Missiles and a Microwardrive, you can pull and maintain range over other targets... however your damage output might be lacking against more beefy ships.
And either way, you should take advantage of the active tanking bonus on the ship as it increases your staying power... except against targets will high volley strikes.

You can also fly around in a Slasher. It is generally faster than a Breecher and has an added "Role Bonus" that cuts the capacitor needs of Warp Disruptors/Scramblers... making it ideal for running down and "pinning" targets.
The tradeoff is that a Slasher is more flimsy and can't tank as effectively as a Breecher. However, you can compensate by taking advantage of the Slasher's ample mid-slots; fitting a Tracking Disruptor or a Sensor Dampener can afford you better survivability against certain kinds of targets... depending on whether you intend to be at close or long range from your target. Just be mindful that Minmatar ships have smaller than average capacitors and may not be able to run such mods for long (in conjunction with everything else you are trying to run).


Both of the ships in the above example are IMO the best Minmatar frigates currently, but what can you fight? In a 1v1 the breacher is out brawled by pretty much any other brawling ship and a kitting breacher is done better by a kestrel, same goes for fleet setting. While the slasher can be extremely effective against some targets using the TD, the amount of targets is very very limited and in a fleet setting does not have the dps projection nor tank to survive.

I was recently in a group of 5 rocket breachers, and 5 tormentors warp in. With drones already out we primary the first target and... are all dead within 1 min and did not get a single kill. Yes we were all in range and applying dps... i just cant see this as balanced. Sure we could have been using light missiles and stayed out of range but again this roll is better suited for a kestrel.

*activates thermal hardeners for incoming flame

Titus Heldane
The Vomit Comets
#27 - 2015-11-20 15:13:15 UTC
a breachers active tank will just get overwhelmed against multiple opponents. tormentors have a big buffer and are better suited to fleet work. however, a breacher has a fairly decent chance of soloing a tormentor since he has range control and a good tank compared to the low dps of a torm. every ship can beat any other ship (within reason), depending on the circumstances.
Xzanos
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#28 - 2015-11-20 17:02:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Xzanos
Titus Heldane wrote:
every ship can beat any other ship (within reason), depending on the circumstances.


This may be true in a 1v1 scenario but when you enter the fleet realm its really a different story. Even with the new changes coming to Minmatar frigates there is really not a good choice for a fleet doctrine in comparison to other races.

*activates thermal hardeners for incoming flame

elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
Brave Collective
#29 - 2015-11-21 20:15:05 UTC
ChromeStriker wrote:
Bastion Arzi wrote:
lol yeah so either rails + navy web @ ~230dps

or risk neuts w blasters

also succubus in small neut range?


If you dont turn off theyre MWDs either a Frig will outrun you or you will have little to no transversal against a cruiser... both mean death What?

With the DD... your doing 300-400 blaster dps... if you catch something in web range you'll likely kill it before you cap out... well... one hopes lol


I will toast dat daredevil with that 5000 bajillion dps long before you are in web range in my Succubus, yarrr.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever

W0lf Crendraven
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#30 - 2015-11-22 09:20:07 UTC
The question is pretty terrible tbh.

Take the sacrilege - its a horrible ship for all sorts of pve, its a bad solo or micro gang pvp ship, its a horrible large scale pvp fit - yet its one of the best small scale - med scale ships there is and by far the best hac atm for that. Impossible to rate that.



That said, minmatar is by far the worst race of the all, all other 3 are fairly well balanced between themselves but minmatar ships suck. Svipul opness is their saving grace but that wont last much longer.
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#31 - 2015-11-23 08:50:26 UTC  |  Edited by: ChromeStriker
elitatwo wrote:
ChromeStriker wrote:
Bastion Arzi wrote:
lol yeah so either rails + navy web @ ~230dps

or risk neuts w blasters

also succubus in small neut range?


If you dont turn off theyre MWDs either a Frig will outrun you or you will have little to no transversal against a cruiser... both mean death What?

With the DD... your doing 300-400 blaster dps... if you catch something in web range you'll likely kill it before you cap out... well... one hopes lol


I will toast dat daredevil with that 5000 bajillion dps long before you are in web range in my Succubus, yarrr.


... \o/ yarr ... The DD goes close to twice your speed... (depending on fit etc etc) but definetly alot faster... 2-3 times the dps and thats not worrying about 90% webs... but you got this Pirate

No Worries

Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
#32 - 2015-11-23 19:04:43 UTC
So, assuming you're a newbro just getting started I'll answer like this:

Start gallente. Get you armor tanking skills and gunnery skills (guns and gunnery support) to all at lvl 4 (exception is weapons upgrades and hull upgrades both to level 5 - unlocking adv weapons upgrades and allowing DCII to be fit). At the same time get your drone support skills up to 3 and get to where you can drop 5 med T2 drones. Get frigates to 5 to unlock T2 frigates. Get cruiser to 4 and BC to 4 also. Strongly consider getting T2 small and medium guns. Get the basic engineering skills to 4 and the basic nav skills to 4 also (yeah it's a lot of stuff you need all at once)

A general newbro training maxim for early on. Any lower tier skill you train is worth training immediately to 3. Get it to 4 when you can. Level 5 is for a few necessities to unlock other things you need. Max stuff later once you have a good foundation.

Congrats - you've reached the first plateu. Up until now you've been training things you needed to train. Choices start to happen at this point.

The Maxer - keep going pure gallente and push for cruiser, BC and BS to 5 and go for T2 large hybrids. Polish off those armor and gunnery skills. Get all small and med drones and support skills to 5. Get at least one race T2 large and sentry drones. Once you have mastered all that is gallente - look to the other races for more fun.

The All Arounder - Move to get amarr ships. You already have the armor and gunner support skills. Just add lasers and start working on those missile skills. Get both gallente and amarr BS to 4 and push one of them to level 5 if you really like how one of them flies. Amarr pulls in missiles, so get the missile support skills to all 4s and get (pick your favorite two) T2 rockets/missiles/heavies. Now that you have a grip on armor/shield/drones/hybrid/laser it's 2 quick steps to the finish line. Get shields and caldari or projectiles and minny. Swap as necessary.

From here on out you can train stuff that interests you. Polish up your armor and shield support skills to 5, your gunner supports to 5 and then your drone supports to 5.

Another way to look at it:

Gallente - armor / hybrid / drone (3 things)
Amarr - armor / laser / missile (3 things)
Caldari - shield / missile / hybrid (3 things)
Minny - armor / shield / projectile / missile (4 things)


General observation over a decade of playing eve:
0 - 15 mil SP - you are totally defensive training things you need to train
15 - 30 mil SP - you have some choices and take the time to max some things you like
30 - 60 mil SP - life is good - you are training only what you want to train. Your tough decision is to embark on a month long skill or not.
60 mil and up - life is awesome. You've mastered several things you like and have the ability to enjoy the eve you like while your skill que takes you to mastery of anything you like. Your only issues at this point are bitter vet syndrome and hubris.

I had a blast flying frigates for my first 3 years (couldn't afford much else). Moved on to BS. Was then pleasantly surprised by how awesome amarr T2 cruisers were. Finally became fascinated w/ command ships as front line pvp vehicles. Along the way I dabbled in bombers, recons and am now playing around w/ pirate hulls. It's been a great ride. Just remember - train what interests you!
W0lf Crendraven
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#33 - 2015-11-24 03:17:34 UTC
Never ever have skillplans, skill for what you want to fly and once you can skill for the next thing unlike you like it very much - then max it out (or just get close to it).
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