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[December] Command Destroyers

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Amarisen Gream
The.Kin.of.Jupiter
#221 - 2015-11-17 19:28:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarisen Gream
Though I love the idea - ships are to cookie cutter, like every other ship in this game. To many stats are the same from faction to faction.
I stopped playing amother MMO because it became a every class is the same b/c we want every person to feel welcome.
I wouldn't have a problem with that, but here's the kicker. There is only one of me, and I don't want a copy.

I understand for balance you have to cookie cutter like everything, but there should be another way. Each Empire has like 5-10 strengths based in their lore, but we never seem to see it in the ships.
I.e - Amarr should always have the best over all armor and armor resist, while Gallente should always have to best armor reps and hull resist.


I wanted to edit this - why nit do something like this 1: two factions reduced spool up. Two factions increased area of effect.
This way they are not all 4 the same cookie.

"The Lord loosed upon them his fierce anger All of his fury and rage. He dispatched against them a band of Avenging Angels" - The Scriptures, Book II, Apocalypse 10:1

#NPCLivesMatter #Freetheboobs
Saisin
Chao3's Rogue Operatives Corp
#222 - 2015-11-17 19:28:42 UTC
Cool ship concept! I really like the potential...
Can't wait to drop this on carebear's Higgs equipped battleships trying to close their WH to rat in peace!

Did CCP consider something increasing their warfare link bonuses by an extra 1% for example when they are on grid with the other fleet ships?

Vote Borat Guereen for CSM XII

Check out the Minarchist Space Project
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#223 - 2015-11-17 19:31:13 UTC
Rosal Milag wrote:
afkalt wrote:


Confirming being shootable by any and everyone is "risk free".

Also confirming battleships can't fit MJDs thus cannot adapt.

And that no mission boat would possibly be able to lock and shoot at 101km.

Any interference allows the ship to be shot freely. That's far from risk free.

Or, you know. A prop mod. I know, I know, it's a big ask to get a ship over 1.1km/s

Doesn't work if invulnerable, which you are for 99.99% of the docking animation. BAd luck might get a few people, but a few at most.

I seriously doubt it is more affordable. Especially since I can shoot the thing.

And see you're only looking at this one way.

What about people white knighting? Blink the catalysts away from the target?

What about killing station gamers?

What about saving your friend from a bumper?

What about jumping neutral logi away from war targets?

What about jumping that sniping nado away from the undock so you can move freely?


People will NOT easily be able to abuse a 3 minute cooldown mod. How many bumps can one do in 3 minutes?

If swarms of people make a concerted effort to cause mayhem well....that is rather what the game is about, is it not?



Battleship MJD is much longer than the new destroyer one, by several seconds.

A mission boat that is sitting at 70km from the target rat and is now 170km? That's not something anyone plans for.

A battleship, which btw is the most common level 4 mission boat, going over 1km/s are you insane? Have you ever tried running a level 4 in anything other than a pirate ship? Most fit an AB or MJD for maneuvering as a MWD kills cap. Equipping both a MJD and MWD is impossible on some ships, as that takes up a ton of grid. And an extra slot, indirectly nerfing the shield battleship that now has to equip four more mods to counter your one, MWD, MJD, warp scrambler, sebo.



Any one of those mods will do fine, you do not need them all and nor does and MWD need run for more than 6 seconds.

Again, you're refusing to adapt to a POSSIBILITY, in the name of isk/hour.


Rosal Milag wrote:
Yes, every mission runner dreams of shooting suspect ships. They are totally confident that their specialized fit for the mission they are on can totally tank someone specialized to kill them once engagable. /s


So don't. But don't pretend the choice isnt there, or that changing fit to be,*gasp* less efficient is not an option.

Rosal Milag wrote:
The docking animation is not 99% invulnerable. You land in a 2,500 radius bubble on the edge of the docking ring. Which means 50% of the time, you are slowboating to the docking point. Unless you have an insta-dock point. And even then, a cluster of ships will be waiting. Odds are, if you are in the landing spot of a ship coming out of warp and cycle your MJFG right when you see them, they will be blinked the instant they land for an easy gank.


If you're bad an don't use instas, maybe.

Good lord you have a hardon for ganking huh? There are simpler and easier ways. If I can blink it, I can alpha it in a nado. You think a suspect destroyer will last long at 4-4? Ho ho ho.

Rosal Milag wrote:
White knighting? Yes, I want to move all the catalysts away from their illegal target and instead have them around a now legal target, me. Which hasn't stopped the gank, only delayed it as the mach is still bumping.


Except they have concord already coming for their asses. My lord you're really clutching at straws here aren't you?

>Gankers land and a dessie is there, do they kill it, pulling concord and losing members? Do they roll the dice and see if they can kill the target in 5 seconds? See if they can chew through the dessie and the target before concord eats them up? Does the bumper get removed from play?



It is ironic you complain about a lack of creativity, yet steadfastly refuse to try to employ any to defend from these ships.
Faltzs
Thundercats
The Initiative.
#224 - 2015-11-17 19:33:48 UTC
These ships are far to tanky, its easy to fit the Pontifex (with rigs) with 2x 400mm plate, mwd, add on 2x drone links and just perma mwd kite then dive in to force-mjd the hostiles, the poor ishkur and other AF's are definetly in need of some love. And then there is the Bifrost, just an amazing light missile kite boat, a just improved talwar, loosing some range in exchange for tank and more mids for utilities. These ships ideally need to focus on a support role rather than being strong damage platforms, either allow 2 links or give boost to items like remote sebo’s.
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#225 - 2015-11-17 19:43:08 UTC
Good job ccpCCP. I wmostly worried that the pull range would be too short (2km) but I think 6km is the sweet spot.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Rosal Milag
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#226 - 2015-11-17 19:47:08 UTC
afkalt wrote:


Any one of those mods will do fine, you do not need them all and nor does and MWD need run for more than 6 seconds.

Again, you're refusing to adapt to a POSSIBILITY, in the name of isk/hour.


Rosal Milag wrote:
Yes, every mission runner dreams of shooting suspect ships. They are totally confident that their specialized fit for the mission they are on can totally tank someone specialized to kill them once engagable. /s


So don't. But don't pretend the choice isnt there, or that changing fit to be,*gasp* less efficient is not an option.

Rosal Milag wrote:
The docking animation is not 99% invulnerable. You land in a 2,500 radius bubble on the edge of the docking ring. Which means 50% of the time, you are slowboating to the docking point. Unless you have an insta-dock point. And even then, a cluster of ships will be waiting. Odds are, if you are in the landing spot of a ship coming out of warp and cycle your MJFG right when you see them, they will be blinked the instant they land for an easy gank.


If you're bad an don't use instas, maybe.

Good lord you have a hardon for ganking huh? There are simpler and easier ways. If I can blink it, I can alpha it in a nado. You think a suspect destroyer will last long at 4-4? Ho ho ho.

Rosal Milag wrote:
White knighting? Yes, I want to move all the catalysts away from their illegal target and instead have them around a now legal target, me. Which hasn't stopped the gank, only delayed it as the mach is still bumping.


Except they have concord already coming for their asses. My lord you're really clutching at straws here aren't you?

>Gankers land and a dessie is there, do they kill it, pulling concord and losing members? Do they roll the dice and see if they can kill the target in 5 seconds? See if they can chew through the dessie and the target before concord eats them up? Does the bumper get removed from play?



It is ironic you complain about a lack of creativity, yet steadfastly refuse to try to employ any to defend from these ships.


Just fitting an MWD kills cap and cap is much more important for a mission runner.

Being less efficient isn't an option for some missions. If changing one mod means I have to warp off to recover my hp/cap, I'm suddenly not just a little less efficient, its a massive time difference now.

A suspect destroyer will last long enough to blink a juicy target. Especially if you want to keep the wreck from the vultures at 4-4.

If a catalyst is criminal, it doesn't necessarily have another 6 seconds of life. Which means a blink does not do much. To actually save a gank victim, you need to blink the ships out before they attack. And now you are surrounded 100km from any help, with a suspect tag. Good luck. And you didn't get the bumping ship? They kill you, warp to a ping, and start again.

>Gankers land and a dessie is there. They wait for it to blink them and kill it. Then warp back to the target being bumped.

You don't need a mach to keep bumping once the gank fleet shows up. 10 catalysts can bump just fine. And with the CD in the picture, why would the mach risk getting jumped if the catalysts can bump to?

I refuse to employ new methods to defend as it completely changes the rest of the game around one ship that 'might' appear. Putting a tank on a miner, easy enough as it reduces yield by 10% or so. Putting a PvP capability or defense against a command destroyer on a mission ship is more than this 10% reduction. It is potentially removing several ships from seeing use at all.

If CCP wants to change the way the entire game plays, thats fine. But there are better methods of making High Sec more dangerous and interesting than something like this. If CCP intended the high sec meta to adapt to this ship, they would play it up more as a lot of people have been screaming for it to shift.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#227 - 2015-11-17 19:51:53 UTC
afkalt wrote:


Any one of those mods will do fine, you do not need them all and nor does and MWD need run for more than 6 seconds.

Again, you're refusing to adapt to a POSSIBILITY, in the name of isk/hour.




Good luck getting a lock on the destroyer and landing a scram on him in less than 5 seconds without at least 2 slots being used for SeBos. Any lock time over 4 seconds will jump you before you can apply your scram on the next tick.
D'Kmal
Jump 2 Beacon
OnlyFleets.
#228 - 2015-11-17 19:55:16 UTC
Will this, if you have the most insane sense of timing, pull in-space travelling missiles?
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#229 - 2015-11-17 19:55:54 UTC
Rosal Milag wrote:
afkalt wrote:


Any one of those mods will do fine, you do not need them all and nor does and MWD need run for more than 6 seconds.

Again, you're refusing to adapt to a POSSIBILITY, in the name of isk/hour.


Rosal Milag wrote:
Yes, every mission runner dreams of shooting suspect ships. They are totally confident that their specialized fit for the mission they are on can totally tank someone specialized to kill them once engagable. /s


So don't. But don't pretend the choice isnt there, or that changing fit to be,*gasp* less efficient is not an option.

Rosal Milag wrote:
The docking animation is not 99% invulnerable. You land in a 2,500 radius bubble on the edge of the docking ring. Which means 50% of the time, you are slowboating to the docking point. Unless you have an insta-dock point. And even then, a cluster of ships will be waiting. Odds are, if you are in the landing spot of a ship coming out of warp and cycle your MJFG right when you see them, they will be blinked the instant they land for an easy gank.


If you're bad an don't use instas, maybe.

Good lord you have a hardon for ganking huh? There are simpler and easier ways. If I can blink it, I can alpha it in a nado. You think a suspect destroyer will last long at 4-4? Ho ho ho.

Rosal Milag wrote:
White knighting? Yes, I want to move all the catalysts away from their illegal target and instead have them around a now legal target, me. Which hasn't stopped the gank, only delayed it as the mach is still bumping.


Except they have concord already coming for their asses. My lord you're really clutching at straws here aren't you?

>Gankers land and a dessie is there, do they kill it, pulling concord and losing members? Do they roll the dice and see if they can kill the target in 5 seconds? See if they can chew through the dessie and the target before concord eats them up? Does the bumper get removed from play?



It is ironic you complain about a lack of creativity, yet steadfastly refuse to try to employ any to defend from these ships.


Just fitting an MWD kills cap and cap is much more important for a mission runner.

Being less efficient isn't an option for some missions. If changing one mod means I have to warp off to recover my hp/cap, I'm suddenly not just a little less efficient, its a massive time difference now.

A suspect destroyer will last long enough to blink a juicy target. Especially if you want to keep the wreck from the vultures at 4-4.

If a catalyst is criminal, it doesn't necessarily have another 6 seconds of life. Which means a blink does not do much. To actually save a gank victim, you need to blink the ships out before they attack. And now you are surrounded 100km from any help, with a suspect tag. Good luck. And you didn't get the bumping ship? They kill you, warp to a ping, and start again.

>Gankers land and a dessie is there. They wait for it to blink them and kill it. Then warp back to the target being bumped.

You don't need a mach to keep bumping once the gank fleet shows up. 10 catalysts can bump just fine. And with the CD in the picture, why would the mach risk getting jumped if the catalysts can bump to?

I refuse to employ new methods to defend as it completely changes the rest of the game around one ship that 'might' appear. Putting a tank on a miner, easy enough as it reduces yield by 10% or so. Putting a PvP capability or defense against a command destroyer on a mission ship is more than this 10% reduction. It is potentially removing several ships from seeing use at all.

If CCP wants to change the way the entire game plays, thats fine. But there are better methods of making High Sec more dangerous and interesting than something like this. If CCP intended the high sec meta to adapt to this ship, they would play it up more as a lot of people have been screaming for it to shift.



I must have dreamt the MWD on my machariel Roll

Cap stability in a mission boat is a fools errand and the only exception to that rule (and it is a rule, by they way) is undersized reppers on marauders for people who worry about a DC.

Warping out doesn't make the mission impossible - although it is a pretty good tell your skills and fit were not up to snuff.


PS: Mobile depots are a thing. No-one is asking you to run with a perma-"gimped" (and I use the term VERY loosely) fit. Or is sticking some options in your hold also "too much effort"?




You don't even know how ganking works for goodness sakes, it's on a knife edge - any disruption ruins it badly. And if you think nados won't be out to alpha flashy yellow small things which can't manage transversal I don't know what to tell you.
Catherine Laartii
Doomheim
#230 - 2015-11-17 19:57:27 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:


MAGUS
Gallente Destroyer Per Level:
10% Bonus to Drone Damage
4% bonus to armor resists
Command Destroyer Per Level:
2% to Armor and Skirmish Warfare link effectiveness
5% reduction in MJFG spool up time
Role: 95% Reduction in Powergrid Requirements for Warfare Links
Role: 50% Reduction in MWD Penalty Signature Bloom
Role: Can fit Micro Jump Field Generators
Role: Can fit one Warfare Link

PONTIFEX
Amarr Destroyer per Level:
10% Bonus to Drone Damage
4% bonus to Armor Resistances
Command Destroyer per Level:
2% to Armor and Information Warfare link effectiveness
5% reduction in MJFG spool up time
Role: 95% Reduction in Powergrid Requirements for Warfare Links
Role: 50% Reduction in MWD Penalty Signature Bloom
Role: Can fit Micro Jump Field Generators
Role: Can fit one Warfare Link

STORK
Caldari Destroyer per Level:
10% to Rocket and Light Missile Damage
4% Bonus to Shield Resistances
Command Destroyer per Level:
2% to Siege and Information link effectiveness per level
5% reduction in MJFG spool up time
Role: 95% Reduction in Powergrid Requirements for Warfare Links
Role: 50% Reduction in MWD Penalty Signature Bloom
Role: Can fit Micro Jump Field Generators
Role: Can fit one Warfare Link


BIFROST
Minmatar Destroyer per Level:
10% bonus to Rocket and Light Missile Damage
4% bonus to shield resists
Command Destroyer per Level:
2% to Siege and Skirmish Warfare link effectiveness
5% reduction in MJFG spool up time
Role: 95% Reduction in Powergrid Requirements for Warfare Links
Role: 50% Reduction in MWD Penalty Signature Bloom
Role: Can fit Micro Jump Field Generators
Role: Can fit one Warfare Link


And for their attributes I'm using a google doc this time for better readability: ATTRIBUTES

Thanks !

Ok, so several things stand out to me here as alarming and needing immediate change.

1. The Stork? Seriously? That's the BEST animal/bird name you could come up with? Did you swindled by a Caldari merchant as a child or something?

2. If these are getting full resists, then the Gallente and Minmatar Command dessies should get an active tanking bonus like the command ships, which do just fine with active tanking (especially the sleipnir).

3. Give the Magus and Pontifex 4 turrets (while removing the launchers), and apply bonuses as listed below.

4. The MJFG field is completely redundant and wastes a bonus to the ship; you can either increase the spool-up reduction into the skill itself or remove it and leave it as-is. Here is what you should replace it with on each ship:
-Magus gets 10% bonus hybrid turret damage per level
-Pontifex gets 10% bonus to laser turret damage per level
-Stork (gag PLEASE choose another name) gets 10% to missile velocity per level
-Bifrost gets 10% to missile velocity per level

5. Change PG values to
-Magus and Bifrost get 60 base PG each
-Stork (again, change the ******* name) gets 65 base pg
-Pontifix gets 75 base pg

6. The speed values are really weird. Magus and Stork (or whatever else it's going to get its name changed to) should get their max speed values exchanged, and Magus and Bifrost should get their total mass amounts exchanged.

Please consider these. ESPECIALLY RENAMING THE STORK. What?
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#231 - 2015-11-17 19:58:24 UTC  |  Edited by: afkalt
Frostys Virpio wrote:
afkalt wrote:


Any one of those mods will do fine, you do not need them all and nor does and MWD need run for more than 6 seconds.

Again, you're refusing to adapt to a POSSIBILITY, in the name of isk/hour.




Good luck getting a lock on the destroyer and landing a scram on him in less than 5 seconds without at least 2 slots being used for SeBos. Any lock time over 4 seconds will jump you before you can apply your scram on the next tick.



I wouldn't scram it in a mission ship. I'd just MJD myself back to where I came from. Well, I would, if I wouldn't be in bastion, but on the rare occasion I'm not in a marauder, I'd just MJD it.

Or I'd burn my machariel back...except, again I wouldn't because it'll burn out of the effective range before it spools up. Same with the navy raven.

Oh the sacrifices I would have to make for that. Oh my, the humanity

Oh wait, there are basically none. I suppose using a mobile depot does raise the :effort: bar if I want to maintain efficiency......won't someone think of the.....children? No...the bears?...the...something.
Nou Mene
Rattini Tribe
Minmatar Fleet Alliance
#232 - 2015-11-17 20:00:33 UTC
why is ppl discussing hs uses of it when ccp said it was banned from hs?

also missions needs to be scanned, from the moment you get there to when the dessie would be bothering you, you have a couple minutes (if that player is completely focused on ruining you), if you taking much more than that to run one mission (L4) then i'll get worried about my isk/hr in some other aspects (i used to run L4 in a pvp drake in LS, and/or t2 mach in HS, and it cant get any easier)
Mr Hyde113
#233 - 2015-11-17 20:01:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Hyde113
As much as the bittervet in me has a knee-jerk negative reaction to crazy mechanics changes like this MJFG, and HIC Point acting like scrams, ect...I'm going to ignore that instinct and say that these are certainly going to shake things up, and and that will be an interesting and content-generating challenge to deal with and utilize. It's sightly sad that something that was exclusive to BS and BCs is being expanded to smaller ships and potentially everyone, but I hope it will lead to more explosions and less risk aversion Smile

I see plenty of potential for abuse, but it will make for some hilarious videos at the very least.


Questions:

  • If these function similarly to MJDs, will scrams and the future Hic Points turn off/prevent them from successfully activating?

  • Will MJDing another ship create an aggression timer or suspect timer?

  • For those of us that like big (REAL Blink) ships, are there any plans to expand MJFG to command ships in the future?

  • Will the MJFG also create a sig bloom similar to MJDs? will the % amount be increased given the Destroyer hull's smaller base signature to give larger ships a chance to lock and react within the short spool up time?

  • Will Marauders in Bastion be movable by the MJFG?

    • .
    afkalt
    Republic Military School
    Minmatar Republic
    #234 - 2015-11-17 20:07:00 UTC
    Nou Mene wrote:
    why is ppl discussing hs uses of it when ccp said it was banned from hs?

    also missions needs to be scanned, from the moment you get there to when the dessie would be bothering you, you have a couple minutes (if that player is completely focused on ruining you), if you taking much more than that to run one mission (L4) then i'll get worried about my isk/hr in some other aspects (i used to run L4 in a pvp drake in LS, and/or t2 mach in HS, and it cant get any easier)



    Because the reason cited by Rise for HS not being allowed were terrible; it boiled down to "incursion players can't be arsed"
    Rosal Milag
    Republic Military School
    Minmatar Republic
    #235 - 2015-11-17 20:07:23 UTC
    afkalt wrote:
    Frostys Virpio wrote:
    afkalt wrote:


    Any one of those mods will do fine, you do not need them all and nor does and MWD need run for more than 6 seconds.

    Again, you're refusing to adapt to a POSSIBILITY, in the name of isk/hour.




    Good luck getting a lock on the destroyer and landing a scram on him in less than 5 seconds without at least 2 slots being used for SeBos. Any lock time over 4 seconds will jump you before you can apply your scram on the next tick.



    I wouldn't scram it in a mission ship. I'd just MJD myself back to where I came from. Well, I would, if I wouldn't be in bastion, but on the rare occasion I'm not in a marauder, I'd just MJD it.

    Or I'd burn my machariel back...except, again I wouldn't because it'll burn out of the effective range before it spools up. Same with the navy raven.

    Oh the sacrifices I would have to make for that. Oh my, the humanity

    Oh wait, there are basically none. I suppose using a mobile depot does raise the :effort: bar if I want to maintain efficiency......won't someone think of the.....children? No...the bears?...the...something.


    Because a Mach is going to outrun a destroyer?

    And sitting with 0 m/s on a depot is a great way to run a mission.

    Warping out doesn't mean the mission is impossible or lost. Only that you now have a huge chunk of time you could have been in the mission. Warp out and back, is at least 3-4 minutes to repair tank and cap up. That's no longer a slight difference in efficiency.

    Looks like we can only run missions in Machs and they are the only ships that can do everything you think a battleship can do for missions.

    You still haven't addressed someone not even targetting you and blinking your mission npc 100 km away from you. Or a gang daisy chaining it away. You know, the one you needed the drop from? Mission failed. And saying that mission runners have to blitz or have to carry MTU's and focus the target NPC stifles creativity and choice.
    Rivr Luzade
    Coreli Corporation
    Pandemic Legion
    #236 - 2015-11-17 20:08:48 UTC
    CCP Rise wrote:
    Lord Jasta wrote:
    Yet another item that can't be used in high sec, :( why not have this with a criminal timer?


    We really wanted to but even with a criminal timer you would pretty easily be able to destroy incursion fleets, which seemed over the top :(

    There is no need to add new things to High sec. The more things/toys/tools that are exclusively available in Low and Null sec, the more drag there is for people to venture at least once into these areas to test these things. That should be encouraged.

    UI Improvement Collective

    My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
    Daugan
    Dreddit
    Test Alliance Please Ignore
    #237 - 2015-11-17 20:12:59 UTC
    Any thoughts to potentially resetting the bomb timer after launch when the bomb is mmjd'd?

    Give battleships some chance :(
    Onslaughtor
    Phoenix Naval Operations
    Phoenix Naval Systems
    #238 - 2015-11-17 20:13:56 UTC
    I absolutely love these things. I have a few questions tho about them which I haven't seen answered yet.

    Does the pwg reduction for links apply to command possessors as well?

    Can it jump/blink a marauders in bastion? If so that sees a little unfair, and could we get a reasoning for it?

    Battleships will have a very hard time countering these things, even with support , could a special active module be made to allow battleships to self scramble? Thoughts?


    Apart from those questions most of the other ones have been answered. These things are by far the most powerful tool you have given players in a long long time. As it was put to me they have a very high skill ceiling in terms of actual player skill and the effects of that skill has the potential to wipe out entire fleets. It also adds a level of chaos to the field of battle as these things will create unpredictable effects on gangs of all sizes. I do feel based on the numbers I have calculated that the damaged for these might be a little strong. More so in the alpha department than the dps but its something to watch for considering their tank and speed.
    afkalt
    Republic Military School
    Minmatar Republic
    #239 - 2015-11-17 20:14:59 UTC
    Rosal Milag wrote:
    afkalt wrote:
    Frostys Virpio wrote:
    afkalt wrote:


    Any one of those mods will do fine, you do not need them all and nor does and MWD need run for more than 6 seconds.

    Again, you're refusing to adapt to a POSSIBILITY, in the name of isk/hour.




    Good luck getting a lock on the destroyer and landing a scram on him in less than 5 seconds without at least 2 slots being used for SeBos. Any lock time over 4 seconds will jump you before you can apply your scram on the next tick.



    I wouldn't scram it in a mission ship. I'd just MJD myself back to where I came from. Well, I would, if I wouldn't be in bastion, but on the rare occasion I'm not in a marauder, I'd just MJD it.

    Or I'd burn my machariel back...except, again I wouldn't because it'll burn out of the effective range before it spools up. Same with the navy raven.

    Oh the sacrifices I would have to make for that. Oh my, the humanity

    Oh wait, there are basically none. I suppose using a mobile depot does raise the :effort: bar if I want to maintain efficiency......won't someone think of the.....children? No...the bears?...the...something.


    Because a Mach is going to outrun a destroyer?

    And sitting with 0 m/s on a depot is a great way to run a mission.

    Warping out doesn't mean the mission is impossible or lost. Only that you now have a huge chunk of time you could have been in the mission. Warp out and back, is at least 3-4 minutes to repair tank and cap up. That's no longer a slight difference in efficiency.

    Looks like we can only run missions in Machs and they are the only ships that can do everything you think a battleship can do for missions.

    You still haven't addressed someone not even targetting you and blinking your mission npc 100 km away from you. Or a gang daisy chaining it away. You know, the one you needed the drop from? Mission failed. And saying that mission runners have to blitz or have to carry MTU's and focus the target NPC stifles creativity and choice.



    I swear I'm being trolled.

    I do not need to outrun it, I need to move further than 6km away when the dessie is LOCKED to a vector. That's simple. Do you even know how MJDs work for gods sakes?

    So..uh...don't be a bad and don't sit on the depot? Jesus god, I would have thought it was obvious but no, apparently not. Drop it if you get jumped, refit to MJD, jump back. Give no more f**ks. Good lord you're hard of thinking.

    I'm not even going near the BUT MAH ISK/HOUR garbage you keep bleating about.

    So you have a problem with a GANG of people being able to interfere with a SOLE player? Oh god no, not in an MMO, not on my watch!!!

    Or kill that target first. Or MJD after it, if it is a solo guy (see above for a gang of people). It is absolutely NO DIFFERENT to someone popping that ship and nicking the drop. Not at all. They even go flashy too. Mission running as a profession hasn't died out, last I looked.
    afkalt
    Republic Military School
    Minmatar Republic
    #240 - 2015-11-17 20:15:46 UTC
    Rivr Luzade wrote:
    CCP Rise wrote:
    Lord Jasta wrote:
    Yet another item that can't be used in high sec, :( why not have this with a criminal timer?


    We really wanted to but even with a criminal timer you would pretty easily be able to destroy incursion fleets, which seemed over the top :(

    There is no need to add new things to High sec. The more things/toys/tools that are exclusively available in Low and Null sec, the more drag there is for people to venture at least once into these areas to test these things. That should be encouraged.



    That's literally the best reason I've seen for putting it to low and below only.

    +1