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CCP Please Consider Making FW Plex Fights More Balanced
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Caladan Panzureborn
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2015-11-02 19:08:50 UTC
Here's my ideas for making FW PvP more fun and balanced:

  • Disallow Neutrals from entering FW plexes. If you're not involved in FW, you're not coming into a FW site.
  • Proposed restrictions on types of ships entering plexes. I'm not a EVE ship expert so bare with me here:
  • Novice Plexes: Allow only T1 frigates, no T2, pirate or faction
  • Small Plexess: Allow only T1 frigates, T1 destroyers only, all T2 frigates
  • Medium: Allow only T1 Cruisers, all frigates, and all destroyers
  • Large: Allow any Cruiser or T1 Battlecruiser, frigate, destroyer
  • Add an XL plex for anything higher than a T1 Battlecruiser

I think adding some balance here would make FW a lot more fun. As it is now, most of the time I just feel like I'm providing content for people who aren't even in FW and just use the plexes as their easy noob hunting grounds which I don't think really fits the purpose for those who are involved in FW. I hope CCP will consider these suggestions. Thanks.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#2 - 2015-11-02 19:28:36 UTC
Why should neutrals be locked out? You lot cry for this all the time and never actually back your argument up. You cannot have an instanced dungeon in which you are 100% safe from the big scawy piwate anywhere else in EVE, why the hell should you have it in lowsec?

And your plex changes do nothing but bar faction frigs from novice, and faction (and T2? I'm not an expert, my FW experience is mostly in frigates) from mediums.

Why do you think those changes are required? I could maybe see the no pirate ships in novices thing, but it's not like a high SP tristan, say, is any less of a threat than a navy slicer.
Nyalnara
Marauder Initiative
#3 - 2015-11-02 21:38:23 UTC
Caladan Panzureborn wrote:
Here's my ideas for making FW PvP more fun and balanced:

  • Disallow Neutrals from entering FW plexes. If you're not involved in FW, you're not coming into a FW site.
  • Proposed restrictions on types of ships entering plexes. I'm not a EVE ship expert so bare with me here:
  • Novice Plexes: Allow only T1 frigates, no T2, pirate or faction
  • Small Plexess: Allow only T1 frigates, T1 destroyers only, all T2 frigates
  • Medium: Allow only T1 Cruisers, all frigates, and all destroyers
  • Large: Allow any Cruiser or T1 Battlecruiser, frigate, destroyer
  • Add an XL plex for anything higher than a T1 Battlecruiser

I think adding some balance here would make FW a lot more fun. As it is now, most of the time I just feel like I'm providing content for people who aren't even in FW and just use the plexes as their easy noob hunting grounds which I don't think really fits the purpose for those who are involved in FW. I hope CCP will consider these suggestions. Thanks.


Err... No.


  • Neutrals will soon get a suspect timer on entering plexes, which make them fair game.
  • Faction frigates are fine in novice. Worm was a bit too powerful but it's going to be nerfed.
  • Faction frigs are fine in small too. And T2 dessies too. If they are fit for dps, they are squishy. Which also means they can be countered. T3 dessies are indeed too powerful in smalls, but they are going to be limited to mediums and bigger.
  • You got rekted in medium by a curse?
  • They are going to add a plex size for battlecruiser. What we would like to know is if command-ships will be able to enter with their insane tank.


Also, maybe stop fitting rails for close range fits? Learn tio use DScan. And, finally, fit some rigs. they don't require skils to be fitted.

French half-noob.

Non, je ne suis pas gentil.
Caladan Panzureborn
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2015-11-02 22:17:28 UTC
Nyalnara wrote:
Caladan Panzureborn wrote:
Here's my ideas for making FW PvP more fun and balanced:

  • Disallow Neutrals from entering FW plexes. If you're not involved in FW, you're not coming into a FW site.
  • Proposed restrictions on types of ships entering plexes. I'm not a EVE ship expert so bare with me here:
  • Novice Plexes: Allow only T1 frigates, no T2, pirate or faction
  • Small Plexess: Allow only T1 frigates, T1 destroyers only, all T2 frigates
  • Medium: Allow only T1 Cruisers, all frigates, and all destroyers
  • Large: Allow any Cruiser or T1 Battlecruiser, frigate, destroyer
  • Add an XL plex for anything higher than a T1 Battlecruiser

I think adding some balance here would make FW a lot more fun. As it is now, most of the time I just feel like I'm providing content for people who aren't even in FW and just use the plexes as their easy noob hunting grounds which I don't think really fits the purpose for those who are involved in FW. I hope CCP will consider these suggestions. Thanks.


Err... No.


  • Neutrals will soon get a suspect timer on entering plexes, which make them fair game.
  • Faction frigates are fine in novice. Worm was a bit too powerful but it's going to be nerfed.
  • Faction frigs are fine in small too. And T2 dessies too. If they are fit for dps, they are squishy. Which also means they can be countered. T3 dessies are indeed too powerful in smalls, but they are going to be limited to mediums and bigger.
  • You got rekted in medium by a curse?
  • They are going to add a plex size for battlecruiser. What we would like to know is if command-ships will be able to enter with their insane tank.


Also, maybe stop fitting rails for close range fits? Learn tio use DScan. And, finally, fit some rigs. they don't require skils to be fitted.


You guys are basically saying "No. Get good scrub." but with more words. That's great. I get it, you lot want to be able to get your easy kills with zero consequences. Suspect timer? Who cares. How is that a deterrent to the suspect or benefit for the plexer? It's not. CCP doesn't seem to want to take any real action on anything other than sov and alliance warfare null sec BS. This little half measures stuff is pointless.
I always use D-Scan. When I don't, it's my fault and you won't hear a peep outta me about any losses because of it. I always fit the appropriate rigs too so I don't know why your basically assuming I'm an idiot who knows nothing with these comments...
Caladan Panzureborn
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2015-11-02 22:27:21 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
Why do you think those changes are required? I could maybe see the no pirate ships in novices thing, but it's not like a high SP tristan, say, is any less of a threat than a navy slicer.


That comparison is dubious at best. Look guys, I'm not about to try to convince forum goers that my changes are good. Not interested in that whatsoever. They are my opinions and my suggestions for what I think would result in more fun fights. Take it for what it's worth. I only hope CCP will consider my input.
Nyalnara
Marauder Initiative
#6 - 2015-11-02 22:56:12 UTC
Caladan Panzureborn wrote:
You guys are basically saying "No. Get good scrub." but with more words. That's great. I get it, you lot want to be able to get your easy kills with zero consequences. Suspect timer? Who cares. How is that a deterrent to the suspect or benefit for the plexer? It's not. CCP doesn't seem to want to take any real action on anything other than sov and alliance warfare null sec BS. This little half measures stuff is pointless.
I always use D-Scan. When I don't, it's my fault and you won't hear a peep outta me about any losses because of it. I always fit the appropriate rigs too so I don't know why your basically assuming I'm an idiot who knows nothing with these comments...


Well, most of your losses have no rigs, thus the rig comment. Also, you get blobbed a lot, thus the DScan comment. Or maybe you don't know the different Caldari FW corps playstyles, but since you've been around since september, i assumed you knew the blobs. About the "CCP doesn't seem to want to take any real action on anything other than sov and alliance warfare null sec BS", maybe if you took time to look at CSM reports (especially CSM summit Day 4 minutes), you would have seen that CCP is indeed looking at PvE and FW content.

If you cannot compete alone against the blobs, or linked/drugged/implanted YAAAAAR pirates, look for a nice FW corporation, because you'll have fairer fights (look corps stats before joining to make sure corp is active, and check the recruitment forum). Unless you really want to go solo, but you're doing it wrong then.

Caladan Panzureborn wrote:
That comparison is dubious at best. Look guys, I'm not about to try to convince forum goers that my changes are good. Not interested in that whatsoever. They are my opinions and my suggestions for what I think would result in more fun fights. Take it for what it's worth. I only hope CCP will consider my input.


We don't ask for you to convince us that what you proposed is good, we ask for you to explain whatever you think is a problem. Because that's how it's meant to be: "identify a problem and propose a fix". Not "here is a fix, maybe there is a problem somewhere that we could use it on", that's definitely not how how it work.



Now, keep in mind that FW is not meant to be newbro-friendly PvP. The mechanics allow for small-size PvP without the risk of escalation (except for blobbing) which is good for new players as it allow them to focus on skilling up small ships related skills, but FW mechanics are designed to encourage PvP encouters with ships of similar size, which does not imply said content should be equally balanced.

That being said, please explain the problem you're trying to fix, while remembering that the problem should be the same for both low and high-SP players, otherwise it is not a problem but only a consequence of some people having lower skills because they started playing later.

French half-noob.

Non, je ne suis pas gentil.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#7 - 2015-11-03 01:16:44 UTC
Caladan Panzureborn wrote:
I think adding some balance here would make FW a lot more fun. As it is now, most of the time I just feel like I'm providing content for people who aren't even in FW and just use the plexes as their easy noob hunting grounds which I don't think really fits the purpose for those who are involved in FW. I hope CCP will consider these suggestions. Thanks.


If the bulk of your contacts in a plex are not FW affiliated that would seem to indicate your other side is not living up to their part of the bargain to provide PVP chances. Sounds like neuts are filling that gap if the case. FW is supposed to be a pvp/pve hybrid mix. Nothing says how that PVP is supposed to go down.

Welcome to low sec. Some go there for the fun of it. its not even hunting noobs, sometimes in 0.0 when dead as hell low sec jaunts provided some fun some roams I did in the past. Don't like it...there is option A, do what the null bears in 0.0 did to make humping it to low sec happen in the first place. Safe up to not be targets. Pvp'ers are like sharks, or stray cats or dogs. feed em once, they will be there the next day lol.
Yun Kuai
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2015-11-03 07:40:50 UTC
Caladan Panzureborn wrote:
Here's my ideas for making FW PvP more fun and balanced:

  • Disallow Neutrals from entering FW plexes. If you're not involved in FW, you're not coming into a FW site.
  • Proposed restrictions on types of ships entering plexes. I'm not a EVE ship expert so bare with me here:
  • Novice Plexes: Allow only T1 frigates, no T2, pirate or faction
  • Small Plexess: Allow only T1 frigates, T1 destroyers only, all T2 frigates
  • Medium: Allow only T1 Cruisers, all frigates, and all destroyers
  • Large: Allow any Cruiser or T1 Battlecruiser, frigate, destroyer
  • Add an XL plex for anything higher than a T1 Battlecruiser

I think adding some balance here would make FW a lot more fun. As it is now, most of the time I just feel like I'm providing content for people who aren't even in FW and just use the plexes as their easy noob hunting grounds which I don't think really fits the purpose for those who are involved in FW. I hope CCP will consider these suggestions. Thanks.



This is a terrible idea btw. And yes, I have been in FW for years and I try to pew pew everyday I'm on. The neutrals roaming through the area make it worthwhile, especially when the squids go into hibernation from time to time. The only complaint I can agree on is the novice in regards to some of the pirate frigs; read worm, in that they massively OP in a FW setting. Instead of adding the XL, they would be better to add in a true new player plex that would be based on your age so that 7 year vets like me can't go in and ruin your "experience". It would pay out 1-2k LP, take 10mins, and has no effect on system pushes. That would allow the truly new guys to try out FW and hopefully get some experience while getting in better ships/better skills.

--------------------------------------------------------::::::::::::--:::-----:::---::::::::::::--------------:::----------:::----:::---:::----------------------:::::::-------:::---:::----::::::-------------------:::-----------:::--:::----:::---------------------::::::::::::----:::::::----:::::::::::::-------
Nyalnara
Marauder Initiative
#9 - 2015-11-03 08:35:06 UTC
Yun Kuai wrote:
Instead of adding the XL, they would be better to add in a true new player plex that would be based on your age so that 7 year vets like me can't go in and ruin your "experience". It would pay out 1-2k LP, take 10mins, and has no effect on system pushes. That would allow the truly new guys to try out FW and hopefully get some experience while getting in better ships/better skills.


That's even worse: if based on character age, what about the 10yo character which never PvPed even once? If based on SP amount, what about the guy with RorqualV but no combat skills which decided to try PvP? There is no way to make that kind of thing balanced for everyone as there will always be disparities between skills or experience.

French half-noob.

Non, je ne suis pas gentil.
Swiftstrike1
Swiftstrike Incorporated
#10 - 2015-11-03 08:41:08 UTC
Nyalnara wrote:


  • Neutrals will soon get a suspect timer on entering plexes, which make them fair game.
  • Faction frigates are fine in novice. Worm was a bit too powerful but it's going to be nerfed.
  • [...] T3 dessies are indeed too powerful in smalls, but they are going to be limited to mediums and bigger.
  • [...]
  • They are going to add a plex size for battlecruiser. What we would like to know is if command-ships will be able to enter with their insane tank.




[Citations Needed]

Casual Incursion runner & Faction Warfare grunt, ex-Wormholer, ex-Nullbear.
Lan Wang
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2015-11-03 10:59:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Lan Wang
Caladan Panzureborn wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
Why do you think those changes are required? I could maybe see the no pirate ships in novices thing, but it's not like a high SP tristan, say, is any less of a threat than a navy slicer.


That comparison is dubious at best. Look guys, I'm not about to try to convince forum goers that my changes are good. Not interested in that whatsoever. They are my opinions and my suggestions for what I think would result in more fun fights. Take it for what it's worth. I only hope CCP will consider my input.


i go to fw plexes for pvp and to pretend im a pirate, why u not like pirates? Sad

how would restricting neutrals give more fun? blocking people from plexes reduces fun

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
erg cz
Federal Jegerouns
#12 - 2015-11-03 13:50:52 UTC
Swiftstrike1 wrote:
Nyalnara wrote:


  • Neutrals will soon get a suspect timer on entering plexes, which make them fair game.
  • Faction frigates are fine in novice. Worm was a bit too powerful but it's going to be nerfed.
  • [...] T3 dessies are indeed too powerful in smalls, but they are going to be limited to mediums and bigger.
  • [...]
  • They are going to add a plex size for battlecruiser. What we would like to know is if command-ships will be able to enter with their insane tank.




[Citations Needed]


csm meeting

Absolutely free head start for newcomers!. Just click the link and get extra 250 000 SP!
Nyalnara
Marauder Initiative
#13 - 2015-11-03 18:40:06 UTC
erg cz wrote:
Swiftstrike1 wrote:
Nyalnara wrote:


  • Neutrals will soon get a suspect timer on entering plexes, which make them fair game.
  • Faction frigates are fine in novice. Worm was a bit too powerful but it's going to be nerfed.
  • [...] T3 dessies are indeed too powerful in smalls, but they are going to be limited to mediums and bigger.
  • [...]
  • They are going to add a plex size for battlecruiser. What we would like to know is if command-ships will be able to enter with their insane tank.




[Citations Needed]


csm meeting



Already linked it in an earlier post. But indeed, read all CSM minutes, AND look up CSM members blogs/twits/whatever, there is a ton of non-NDA stuff available everywhere.

French half-noob.

Non, je ne suis pas gentil.
Chihiro Chugakusei
Fortune Hunters - Navy Operations
#14 - 2015-11-22 10:10:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Chihiro Chugakusei
Caladan Panzureborn wrote:
Here's my ideas for making FW PvP more fun and balanced:

  • Disallow Neutrals from entering FW plexes. If you're not involved in FW, you're not coming into a FW site.
  • Proposed restrictions on types of ships entering plexes. I'm not a EVE ship expert so bare with me here:
  • Novice Plexes: Allow only T1 frigates, no T2, pirate or faction
  • Small Plexess: Allow only T1 frigates, T1 destroyers only, all T2 frigates
  • Medium: Allow only T1 Cruisers, all frigates, and all destroyers
  • Large: Allow any Cruiser or T1 Battlecruiser, frigate, destroyer
  • Add an XL plex for anything higher than a T1 Battlecruiser

I think adding some balance here would make FW a lot more fun. As it is now, most of the time I just feel like I'm providing content for people who aren't even in FW and just use the plexes as their easy noob hunting grounds which I don't think really fits the purpose for those who are involved in FW. I hope CCP will consider these suggestions. Thanks.


I do agree that plex warfare is stagnant. Too much of the same ship over and over. Need something to address that. Pirates I dont care about.

Keep it up, +1