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Golem or Paladin for lvl 4s
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Boo X
Running with Dogs
Out of the Blue.
#1 - 2015-11-01 19:20:55 UTC
Hi guys

I have been mainly PVP orianteded in Eve, was wondering what be best option for running level 4s.

Both tank and dps are near maxed out.

With using the Golem I can supply a Tengu Booster, or would a Paladin be better with mid grade slaves.

Any advise be greatful
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#2 - 2015-11-01 21:23:13 UTC
mostly depends on what rats you are shooting. Angels and guristas aren't the best news for a paladin, although most of the gurista missions are blitzable enough that you can get by. For the most part I prefer the paladin mostly due to turret advantages. Higher base dps and instant hits with insane range.

although lately I've left my paladin to collect dust and have been flying a machariel. there are a few posts on or near the front page about blitzing.

as for the implants I'd just go with ascendancy implants. warp speed is way more important than a little bit of armor HP. although tengu boosts would help out most mach fits rather nicely.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Anize Oramara
WarpTooZero
#3 - 2015-11-01 21:31:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Anize Oramara
Boo X wrote:
Hi guys

I have been mainly PVP orianteded in Eve, was wondering what be best option for running level 4s.

Both tank and dps are near maxed out.

With using the Golem I can supply a Tengu Booster, or would a Paladin be better with mid grade slaves.

Any advise be greatful

If you\re talking Hi-Sec, Machariel Blitzer with ascendancies implants and Burner missions (check sig). Burners are also a lot more exciting and PvP like than normal Lv4 missions. You should make around double with Mach/Burners than you can possibly ever make with a marauder.

If you're absolutely dead set on a marauder and only making half of what you could be it would depend on what space you're running in. Paladin is better in Amarr space while Cruise Golem is good anywhere.

Edit: Changed wording in first paragraph so it's more clear what I meant lol.

A guide (Google Doc) to Hi-Sec blitzing and breaking the 200mill ISK/H barrier v1.2.3
Boo X
Running with Dogs
Out of the Blue.
#4 - 2015-11-01 21:38:16 UTC
Cool, thanks for the advice
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#5 - 2015-11-01 23:06:36 UTC
Polarized Torpedo Golem. There is no substitute.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#6 - 2015-11-02 02:08:29 UTC
I guess the first real question should have been what do you want in your missions?

Are you looking for max ISK / LP per hour?
Are you looking for something different to do?
Do you want to take time to salvage / loot just because you want to?
Improve standings?
After that what area of space do you plan to fly in, or alternatively what are the most common NPC you would be fighting?
Boo X
Running with Dogs
Out of the Blue.
#7 - 2015-11-02 09:25:51 UTC
Donnachadh wrote:
I guess the first real question should have been what do you want in your missions?

Are you looking for max ISK / LP per hour?
Are you looking for something different to do?
Do you want to take time to salvage / loot just because you want to?
Improve standings?
After that what area of space do you plan to fly in, or alternatively what are the most common NPC you would be fighting?




Isk be nice with the lp
Yeah looking for something different, that I can do on my own
Not to fussed about loot/salvage
Standings be good (no level 4 agents with my main) got them on my alt
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#8 - 2015-11-05 00:52:53 UTC
Anize Oramara wrote:

If you're absolutely dead set on a marauder and only making half of what you could be it would depend on what space you're running in. Paladin is better in Amarr space while Cruise Golem is good anywhere.

Yeah, but you make so much more ISK/LP with the Burner fits that your main ship doesn't really matter to the same extent...

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Daniela Doran
Doomheim
#9 - 2015-11-05 09:57:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Daniela Doran
Boo X wrote:
Donnachadh wrote:
I guess the first real question should have been what do you want in your missions?

Are you looking for max ISK / LP per hour?
Are you looking for something different to do?
Do you want to take time to salvage / loot just because you want to?
Improve standings?
After that what area of space do you plan to fly in, or alternatively what are the most common NPC you would be fighting?




Isk be nice with the lp
Yeah looking for something different, that I can do on my own
Not to fussed about loot/salvage
Standings be good (no level 4 agents with my main) got them on my alt


Overall and only if you're intending to shoot angel rats, I'd say the Golem. If you're not shooting at angel rats then I say Paladin all the way. If you can fly Vargurs they're also a very solid choice.

If you can fly 2 or more Marauders, then Paladin all the way non-stop.
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#10 - 2015-11-05 15:20:18 UTC
Daniela Doran wrote:
Overall and only if you're intending to shoot angel rats, I'd say the Golem. If you're not shooting at angel rats then I say Paladin all the way. If you can fly Vargurs they're also a very solid choice.

If you can fly 2 or more Marauders, then Paladin all the way non-stop.

The resist charts would argue with this and would point to the Golem as a far better all around choice than the Paladin, why?
The laser common on a Paladin are essentially limited to EM with varying degrees of thermal chaser added into the mix.
So the Paladin is clearly the superior choice for Blood Raiders, Drones and Sanshas - because weakness to EM.
Mercenaries are a toss up, paper based statistics favor the Golem, but my personal real game experience say this may not be true so your mileage may vary.
The Golem would be a clear favorite against
Angels - because weak to explosive, laser have no explosive output.
EoM, Guristas, Serpentis - because weak to kinetic, lasers have no kinetic output.
aldhura
Blackjack and Exotic Dancers
Top Tier
#11 - 2015-11-05 19:32:13 UTC
I have used them all, but find the golem works best overall, if you only want one, get a golem. I don't even change ammo and blaster everything with fury cruise missiles. You do not need a booster, rather make it an afk salvager. People underestimate the value of salvage. Drop mtu, mission for an hr or so, the go back with noctis with 8 salvages and claen it up.
Using what I call an afk salvager also works. Warp it in when mission done, release salavage drones, move to next room/mission forget about it till its time to move on.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#12 - 2015-11-05 21:25:35 UTC
aldhura wrote:
Using what I call an afk salvager also works. Warp it in when mission done, release salavage drones, move to next room/mission forget about it till its time to move on.

Don't the drones stop salvaging as soon as you move off-grid?

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#13 - 2015-11-05 21:51:31 UTC
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
aldhura wrote:
Using what I call an afk salvager also works. Warp it in when mission done, release salavage drones, move to next room/mission forget about it till its time to move on.

Don't the drones stop salvaging as soon as you move off-grid?


He's referring to the alt salvager. He warps in his alt after the mission is finished, alt releases salvage drones while his main warps to the next room or mission.
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#14 - 2015-11-05 22:02:12 UTC
Donnachadh wrote:
Daniela Doran wrote:
Overall and only if you're intending to shoot angel rats, I'd say the Golem. If you're not shooting at angel rats then I say Paladin all the way. If you can fly Vargurs they're also a very solid choice.

If you can fly 2 or more Marauders, then Paladin all the way non-stop.

The resist charts would argue with this and would point to the Golem as a far better all around choice than the Paladin, why?
The laser common on a Paladin are essentially limited to EM with varying degrees of thermal chaser added into the mix.
So the Paladin is clearly the superior choice for Blood Raiders, Drones and Sanshas - because weakness to EM.
Mercenaries are a toss up, paper based statistics favor the Golem, but my personal real game experience say this may not be true so your mileage may vary.
The Golem would be a clear favorite against
Angels - because weak to explosive, laser have no explosive output.
EoM, Guristas, Serpentis - because weak to kinetic, lasers have no kinetic output.


EM is EoM's primary or secondary hole on shields, and they don't usually have enough armor HP I'm worried about 60% resists. Anything smaller than a BS and it almost doesn't matter, and on the BS it might mean an extra shot. Plus therm is tied for secondary hole on armor (with kinetic), and EXP is the armor hole. Oh yea and most of that mission is in perfect tachyon range.

pure kinetic is probably the best damage type, but delivery by missiles, meh.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#15 - 2015-11-05 22:21:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Estella Osoka
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Donnachadh wrote:
Daniela Doran wrote:
Overall and only if you're intending to shoot angel rats, I'd say the Golem. If you're not shooting at angel rats then I say Paladin all the way. If you can fly Vargurs they're also a very solid choice.

If you can fly 2 or more Marauders, then Paladin all the way non-stop.

The resist charts would argue with this and would point to the Golem as a far better all around choice than the Paladin, why?
The laser common on a Paladin are essentially limited to EM with varying degrees of thermal chaser added into the mix.
So the Paladin is clearly the superior choice for Blood Raiders, Drones and Sanshas - because weakness to EM.
Mercenaries are a toss up, paper based statistics favor the Golem, but my personal real game experience say this may not be true so your mileage may vary.
The Golem would be a clear favorite against
Angels - because weak to explosive, laser have no explosive output.
EoM, Guristas, Serpentis - because weak to kinetic, lasers have no kinetic output.


EM is EoM's primary or secondary hole on shields, and they don't usually have enough armor HP I'm worried about 60% resists. Anything smaller than a BS and it almost doesn't matter, and on the BS it might mean an extra shot. Plus therm is tied for secondary hole on armor (with kinetic), and EXP is the armor hole. Oh yea and most of that mission is in perfect tachyon range.

pure kinetic is probably the best damage type, but delivery by missiles, meh.


OP, you need to look at how missile damage is applied.

https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Missiles

Pure kinetic may be great, but you are not going to hit for max damage every single time. And unlike with turrets, you can't use piloting ability to negate the effects. For instance, In a Mach I can at least set a keep at range distance so I can control the transversal and get max damage with my autos cannons (minus resists). Or if I have a MJD I can just jump 100km and destroy the frigs as they rush headlong at me head on with 0 transversal.
Bobinu
Unsober
Last Picks
#16 - 2015-11-06 15:24:24 UTC
Golem

Have flown both, Golem precisions FTW, if anything its too easy.
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#17 - 2015-11-06 18:16:48 UTC
Bobinu wrote:
Golem

Have flown both, Golem precisions FTW, if anything its too easy.

precision dps isn't winning Sad

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
BirdStrike
Doomheim
#18 - 2015-11-06 19:07:25 UTC
Just don't use this guy's fit.

https://zkillboard.com/kill/50018241/

Daniela Doran
Doomheim
#19 - 2015-11-07 04:07:45 UTC
Donnachadh wrote:
Daniela Doran wrote:
Overall and only if you're intending to shoot angel rats, I'd say the Golem. If you're not shooting at angel rats then I say Paladin all the way. If you can fly Vargurs they're also a very solid choice.

If you can fly 2 or more Marauders, then Paladin all the way non-stop.

The resist charts would argue with this and would point to the Golem as a far better all around choice than the Paladin, why?
The laser common on a Paladin are essentially limited to EM with varying degrees of thermal chaser added into the mix.
So the Paladin is clearly the superior choice for Blood Raiders, Drones and Sanshas - because weakness to EM.
Mercenaries are a toss up, paper based statistics favor the Golem, but my personal real game experience say this may not be true so your mileage may vary.
The Golem would be a clear favorite against
Angels - because weak to explosive, laser have no explosive output.
EoM, Guristas, Serpentis - because weak to kinetic, lasers have no kinetic output.




The sheer destructive power of Tachyons + Navy Multi tears through every single rat that you'll encounter in Lev 4 missions including the ones with high EM and Therm resist. The only exception are the angels rats that'll take a noticeably longer time to kill than the others but it still gets the job done. The instant damage application combined with non-reload times more than makes up for non-selectable damage capability in my opinion, especially if you're using 2 or 3 Paladins.