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EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
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How Do I Deal With Ninja Salvagers?
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Axel Korgain
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#41 - 2012-01-05 21:31:16 UTC
They are really doing you a favour. Teaching you game mechanics. Open your mind learn some Russian and meet them.

Stop being so greedy.

(I'm not actually very wealthy)
SnowxCrash
Perkone
Caldari State
#42 - 2012-01-05 21:41:24 UTC
Axel Korgain wrote:
They are really doing you a favour. Teaching you game mechanics. Open your mind learn some Russian and meet them.

Stop being so greedy.

(I'm not actually very wealthy)


I'm curious what game mechanics you thought they were teaching? About how people can scan for me, warp to my locations, and attack in low/null? I already knew that, taking note of convos in SWA chat had quite a few benefits, as does occasionally tuning into the Help channel and sometimes some information in ER chat teaches new things as well. However, if you meant something else entirely I'd really like to know what it is.
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#43 - 2012-01-05 21:42:29 UTC
SnowxCrash wrote:
Nowhere in my suggestion does it prevent ninjaing loot/salvage, it simply changes it from griefing to real conflict with consequences, which you seem to have completely ignored in your post.


Yep, ignored you just because to be honest your have no other choice but deal with this little thing called CORE GAME MECHANICS which says SALVAGING WRECKS IS NO STEALING.

Or you can whine a little more like all small boys do when mommy says "no candy before dinner".

Or you can quit.

Invalid signature format
SnowxCrash
Perkone
Caldari State
#44 - 2012-01-05 21:53:58 UTC
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
SnowxCrash wrote:
Nowhere in my suggestion does it prevent ninjaing loot/salvage, it simply changes it from griefing to real conflict with consequences, which you seem to have completely ignored in your post.


Yep, ignored you just because to be honest your have no other choice but deal with this little thing called CORE GAME MECHANICS which says SALVAGING WRECKS IS NO STEALING.

Or you can whine a little more like all small boys do when mommy says "no candy before dinner".

Or you can quit.



Good to know you ignore what you can't dispute, and accept what you don't care to change. Seeing as you care so little about this topic, perhaps you'd care to just leave, as you're so focused on being of as little help as possible.
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#45 - 2012-01-05 22:14:38 UTC
SnowxCrash wrote:
Good to know you ignore what you can't dispute, and accept what you don't care to change. Seeing as you care so little about this topic, perhaps you'd care to just leave, as you're so focused on being of as little help as possible.


You asked "How do I deal with ninja salvagers?" and we all answered: you can ignore them and just blitz your mission which is in fact more profitable to you, you can warp out leaving ninja open to rats aggro and come back in moments later to continue your mission, you can take somebody else with you to handle your looting and salvage.

Unfortunately you chose to complain about game mechanics regarding right to salvage which is in my humble opinion worst way of dealing with ninjas. You provide tears to their amusement if any of them ever happen to stumble upon your thread.

There is so much complaining around these forums regarding almost every aspect of Eve: hisec, lowsec, nullsec, gankers, blobs, ice miners, ice miners gankers, russians, goons... Seems like it is very very weak game both in ideas and execution. By you and all other whiners keep paying subscriptions and keep loggin in and keep doing what they do. And complain more.

I repeat, you got answers for your question. Why don't you think about your options and decide for yourself what to do? Doesn't it make more sense than just dragging this any longer?

And above all just try to find fun in a game that costs you money and your time.

Invalid signature format
SnowxCrash
Perkone
Caldari State
#46 - 2012-01-05 22:22:31 UTC  |  Edited by: SnowxCrash
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
SnowxCrash wrote:
Good to know you ignore what you can't dispute, and accept what you don't care to change. Seeing as you care so little about this topic, perhaps you'd care to just leave, as you're so focused on being of as little help as possible.


You asked "How do I deal with ninja salvagers?" and we all answered: you can ignore them and just blitz your mission which is in fact more profitable to you, you can warp out leaving ninja open to rats aggro and come back in moments later to continue your mission, you can take somebody else with you to handle your looting and salvage.

Unfortunately you chose to complain about game mechanics regarding right to salvage which is in my humble opinion worst way of dealing with ninjas. You provide tears to their amusement if any of them ever happen to stumble upon your thread.

There is so much complaining around these forums regarding almost every aspect of Eve: hisec, lowsec, nullsec, gankers, blobs, ice miners, ice miners gankers, russians, goons... Seems like it is very very weak game both in ideas and execution. By you and all other whiners keep paying subscriptions and keep loggin in and keep doing what they do. And complain more.

I repeat, you got answers for your question. Why don't you think about your options and decide for yourself what to do? Doesn't it make more sense than just dragging this any longer?

And above all just try to find fun in a game that costs you money and your time.


I suppose I was just really disappointed in that no one offered an answer, a solution, which I hadn't already considered prior to making this thread. The idea that I, as a new player, saw all the solutions offered here by vets, or overheard them in various chats over the course of the last few weeks, was really a let down. So I proceeded to enter a discussion of the value concerning altering this flawed mechanic to which the solutions to are mediocre and in no way fun. To which most simply say to accept it because it's just how it is, or proceed to talk about CONCORD policies as if they're a real entity I should accept rather than a fiction open to changes based upon improving gameplay, all of which do not in any way truly answer. or refute, what I've suggested. You speak of tears, I speak of vets who seem incapable of change, simply from the standpoint that they accept how things are with little to no reason other than that that's how it's been, which is, quite frankly, really lame.
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#47 - 2012-01-05 22:33:35 UTC
Sorry mate, 3 months old newbie here, no vet at this keyboard.

But I take the game as it is and I am having fun. Do I like all rules and activities? Not really, but I don't waste my time flapping my mouth about my wishes what changes should be introduced. I just accept current state of things and try to learn how to deal with them. And whatever changes will come I will try them out and than decide if I like them or not. And once again will learn how to deal with areas I don't like.

Because I want to play this game. You seem to play just because you can't quit or admit that you have no power over current situation.

If I were you I would just finished this thread after first few posts, you got your answers there. And to be honest by this post I finish my participation in this pointless discussion.

Invalid signature format
SnowxCrash
Perkone
Caldari State
#48 - 2012-01-05 22:40:01 UTC
I've considered doing as you suggest of letting things just die down in this thread, but I find a certain draw to forums, nearly as much as to games. Also, the minute I encountered this problem I already proceeded implementing many of the solutions that have been offered so far, so to see only those offered here was as I said a post ago, a major let down. In any case, good day to you, and fly safe!
Dust Fourtwenty
Doomheim
#49 - 2012-01-05 22:40:28 UTC
if there was a sudden mechanic of adding ownership of wrecks, it should be the pilots who lost their ships if anyone at all.
which puts you in the same position as the 'ninja salvager' tbh, maybe even worse, because you killed to produce that wreck, but the salvager only found it.
SnowxCrash
Perkone
Caldari State
#50 - 2012-01-05 22:57:50 UTC  |  Edited by: SnowxCrash
Dust Fourtwenty wrote:
if there was a sudden mechanic of adding ownership of wrecks, it should be the pilots who lost their ships if anyone at all.
which puts you in the same position as the 'ninja salvager' tbh, maybe even worse, because you killed to produce that wreck, but the salvager only found it.

Someone cannot own what is taken from them by force without using force to reclaim it. I'm saying that when someone disputes my ownership over what I've taken by force I should be allowed to defend what I've taken by force with force, which is really one of the 'core' principals in Eve. To take with force, and defend what you have with force. I'm suggesting that go over to this situation as if any concept should be taught to new players like myself it should be that one rather than just pointless griefing.
Malamber
Venomous Cloud
#51 - 2012-01-05 23:28:51 UTC
I tend to agree with the OP - while it's CCP's stance that it's intended and won't change - I still think it SHOULD be considered stealing.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#52 - 2012-01-06 00:13:25 UTC
Malamber wrote:
I tend to agree with the OP - while it's CCP's stance that it's intended and won't change - I still think it SHOULD be considered stealing.


Basically comes down to this. CCP wants to keep salvaging random stuff as a newbie profession. If salvaging caused aggro, that's one less things newbies can do for meager amounts of ISK.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)
Kessiaan
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#53 - 2012-01-06 01:49:07 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Malamber wrote:
I tend to agree with the OP - while it's CCP's stance that it's intended and won't change - I still think it SHOULD be considered stealing.


Basically comes down to this. CCP wants to keep salvaging random stuff as a newbie profession. If salvaging caused aggro, that's one less things newbies can do for meager amounts of ISK.


This has always been my opinion as well. Ninja salvaging is one of the most profitable activities a rookie player can engage in.

Also, highsec is full of little 'gotcha' game mechanics that seem to me to be designed to encourage players to spread out instead of piling up in a few key systems, or maybe move out to nullsec if they get sick enough of it.

KB Link
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#54 - 2012-01-06 05:09:30 UTC
SnowxCrash wrote:
Is there something I don't know about, a way to deal with these parasites efficiently?

When I get visited in a mission, I deal with it by abandoning all nearby wrecks.

I mean, if they've gone to all the trouble to find me, they really must need the salvage.

There is nothing more sad than a little salvage ship moving about my mission without even an afterburner. I've sent them ISK to help buy little Timmy some magic legs. It really breaks my heart. As I'm often being followed around by my alt in a Noctis (usually in the previous room), I try to tractor all the abandoned wrecks together so they don't have to travel so far.

Strangest part is, I find they are often confused by the blue abandoned wrecks. They don't always loot them or salvage them. Poor Timmy must have tritanopia or tritanomaly (blue-yellow color blindness).

I'm only one player, but I do what little I can to help.
Axel Korgain
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#55 - 2012-01-06 07:24:46 UTC
I am of the completely OPPOSITE opinion to the OP.

I remember being shocked completely when concord destroyed my shiny new cruiser when I fired on a wreck to test its missiles.

OWN A WRECK?? Oh right.. yeah of course you got shot and you still own your wreckage... NO?? They own the wreck. How odd.

What then of wrecks in 0.0?

Should Concord have little wreck observer ships that tag along in your mission to tag electronically who owns what space garbage.

It's ludicrous that anyone but the original owner should own the wreck. If the original owner was an outlaw then it's fair game.

Isn't picking over wreckage a little ghoulish anyway?

I say to hell with the topic and remove wreck ownership entirely and let the fastest ant win.
Axel Korgain
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#56 - 2012-01-06 07:32:05 UTC
SnowxCrash wrote:
Axel Korgain wrote:
They are really doing you a favour. Teaching you game mechanics. Open your mind learn some Russian and meet them.

Stop being so greedy.

(I'm not actually very wealthy)


I'm curious what game mechanics you thought they were teaching? About how people can scan for me, warp to my locations, and attack in low/null? I already knew that, taking note of convos in SWA chat had quite a few benefits, as does occasionally tuning into the Help channel and sometimes some information in ER chat teaches new things as well. However, if you meant something else entirely I'd really like to know what it is.


Ok then if you are so up to date and learned you should then be totally aware of how all your long winded well written arguments amounts to...

Waaaaghh My salvage...Lol

Hey I don't even do missions I just buy mission loot and salvage from who ever wants to sell it to me. Lol
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#57 - 2012-01-06 08:13:27 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
SnowxCrash wrote:
Is there something I don't know about, a way to deal with these parasites efficiently?

When I get visited in a mission, I deal with it by abandoning all nearby wrecks.

I mean, if they've gone to all the trouble to find me, they really must need the salvage.

There is nothing more sad than a little salvage ship moving about my mission without even an afterburner. I've sent them ISK to help buy little Timmy some magic legs. It really breaks my heart. As I'm often being followed around by my alt in a Noctis (usually in the previous room), I try to tractor all the abandoned wrecks together so they don't have to travel so far.

Strangest part is, I find they are often confused by the blue abandoned wrecks. They don't always loot them or salvage them. Poor Timmy must have tritanopia or tritanomaly (blue-yellow color blindness).

I'm only one player, but I do what little I can to help.


Well you are a trooper....

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny
Dust Fourtwenty
Doomheim
#58 - 2012-01-06 13:50:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Dust Fourtwenty
SnowxCrash wrote:
Someone cannot own what is taken from them by force without using force to reclaim it

Possession is not ownership, you are taking possession by force which should be unlawful and thus concord should protect the ownership of the true owner (in spite of your violence) and thus punish you for looting any wrecks, unless they are the wrecks of outlaws (fair game for everyone). A sec status hit in lowsec and npc response in hisec would be ok.

.. or maybe make it so that whichever NPC empire that controls the system the wreck spawns in will have jurisdiction over the wreck, and you get a standings hit for unlawful salvaging in their space.


the reason i am proposing mentlly challenged mechanics is so that you percieve how your proposal is percieved by others.
Orlacc
#59 - 2012-01-06 16:55:03 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
SnowxCrash wrote:
Is there something I don't know about, a way to deal with these parasites efficiently?

When I get visited in a mission, I deal with it by abandoning all nearby wrecks.

I mean, if they've gone to all the trouble to find me, they really must need the salvage.

There is nothing more sad than a little salvage ship moving about my mission without even an afterburner. I've sent them ISK to help buy little Timmy some magic legs. It really breaks my heart. As I'm often being followed around by my alt in a Noctis (usually in the previous room), I try to tractor all the abandoned wrecks together so they don't have to travel so far.

Strangest part is, I find they are often confused by the blue abandoned wrecks. They don't always loot them or salvage them. Poor Timmy must have tritanopia or tritanomaly (blue-yellow color blindness).

I'm only one player, but I do what little I can to help.



Listen to Tau. Bottom line is anyone taking the time to scan you down and salvage is probably poor. Anyone tipping your wrecks is looking for trouble. Like Tau, I just abandon my wrecks. But honestly I can not remember the last time I saw a ninja in my mission.

Just mission in a less populated system.

It is a game mechanic that is not going to change so quit tilting at windmills and have fun.

"Measure Twice, Cut Once."
Riedle
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#60 - 2012-01-06 17:19:59 UTC
Quote:
Well, first off, almost all of the 'solutions' you've all given assume a single pocket mission, so giving solutions which are contingent upon that situation is hardly a solution.



Learn to use your scanner.
There are multiple solutions to your question you are simply saying that you are not willing to do them.
Fine, but stop the whining already.