EVE New Citizens Q&A

Great points. I agree with all of them. I suppose it depends on your definition of how "extreme" is "extreme".

That's what happens when you respond to trolls instead of actually answer the OPs questions...

Anyway...the main thing to consider when fitting a ship is what is it naturally good at and how can you exploit it further? For instance the oracle fit above is naturally fast (for a BC), and has good projection and DPS. So to really take advantage of the ship we further increase those qualities with the modules. Basically, abuse your strengths and be aware of your weaknesses (in the case of the oracle, poor tank and tracking).

Is it extreme? Maybe not...you aren't using every single slot to increase a single attribute (and stacking penalties make this a poor idea). However, it is above average in those categories. And if you a start with a ship that is naturally one of the best (ie I take a garmur which is very fast for a frigate and fit it to enhance speed) you'll get a ship that is "extreme" for it's class.

This concept is particularly important in solo pvp, where a lot of the time winning a fight comes down to the planning you did during the fitting stage. Taking a ship which is good at something and pushing it past the "normal" limits is a great way to throw people off guard and pull out an unexpected win. Flying cookie cutter well-rounded fits makes it too easy for your opponent to estimate your abilities. Pulling out something extreme that makes your opponent say "wow...they're tanky" or..."argh I can't keep them in range" or...."holy crap that dps" is how you win fights.

Edit:

I found this page helpful when starting out, and this explanation of the market graph in particular

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Okay so... I tend to break down the ship fitting paradigm into 4 "aspects." As a bonus... I'll even do a quick and dirty rundown of each one.


Tank - you have several forms of tanks;
-------- buffer tanking (high resistances AND raw HP)
-------- active tanking (high resistances and armor/shield repairer to regenerate damage)
-------- hybrid tanking (also called "bleeder tanks", they mix buffer and active tanking styles... not recommended)
-------- passive tanking (shields only, basically you are increasing the native regeneration of shields to a level where you can literally absorb damage... not recommended outside of niche PvE situations).
-------- "mixed tanking" (aka: "nubbin tank"... this is when you fit shield mods, armor mods, hull mods at the same time. Never. Ever. Do. This. What you are doing is expending precious ship fitting resources to split your defenses... making each one mediocre and none of them sufficiently "good." Pick shields OR armor OR hull and focus on that).

Example modules: Armor Plate, Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane, Trimark Armor Pump, Armor Repair, Shield Extender, Shield Hardener, Core Defense Field Extender, Shield Booster, etc.

Gank - comprises both volley damage and damage per second. You can have high volley damage, but low DPS and vice versa. Both are viable but require different tactics and target selection. This group also includes modules that enhance damage application too.
Example modules: guns, launchers, Magnetic Field Stabilizers, Heat Sinks, etc.

Speed - comprises both agility/acceleration and top speed (no, they are not the same thing in EVE). Agility and acceleration will get you into warp and/or hit top speed faster. Top speed means you can dictate range better in engagements.
Example modules: 5/50/500 MW MIcrowarpDrive, Inertial Stabilizers, Nanofiber Internal Structure, etc.

Utility/ Electronic Warfare (see: debuffs) - This pretty much encompasses all modules that help enhance ship aspects or even the aspects covered above. We are talking about things like Cap Boosters, Cap Rechargers, Target Painters, Warp Disruptors, Stasis Webifiers, Tracking Enhancers/Computers, etc.
These things will either be more or less necessary depending on what your role is on the field.


Now here is the big thing: you generally can't fit / focus on more than 2.5 of the above "aspects" without making DEEP tradeoffs to all the aspects (remember, you only have so much CPU and Powergrid you can use).

Moreover... you have to choose "aspects" that synergize well with each other (some don't because they possess inherent tradeoffs).

For example:
Speed tends to synergize well with gank and shields.
Armor tends to synergize well with Electronic Warfare and utility.
Gank tends to synergize well with speed.



Another thing to consider is that min/maxing one aspect, while viable in some situations, will not be in others. Take the "gank Catalyst" for example.

Fit up a Gallente Catalyst destroyer with the biggest frigate-sized guns, load up the low-slots with Magnetic Field Stabilizers, and add whatever else you desire.
This ship can pump out about 400 damage per second (that is around 6000 damage in about 15 seconds). However, the ship has limited mobility (you can't fit a Microwarpdrive or Afterburner because you do not have the CPU or PG... it all went into the guns) and no defenses (it has less HP than a tanked frigate).
This means anything that the destroyer can't kill in less than 15 seconds will be able to easily kill it.

The same applies for pretty much a super-tanked ship. You can fit it to tank "everything" (which is impossible because there are hard counters available to prevent this kind of thing)... but if you do not have the Speed, Electronic Warfare, or Gank to evade / fend off your attacker... well... the best you can hope for is that your attacker runs out of ammo (fat chance!).


Level 4 missions have traditionally been the realm of battleships... with anything that can't tank or deal damage like a battleship being fairly pointless.
Burner Missions are there to "change things up" and offer more variety to people who don't want the same thing mission after mission.

By the way... do not limit your choices. Keep in mind that your battleship, while it has "sexy stats" and has a lot of fitting options, is a metaphorical "hammer."
If you are presented with a situation where a metaphorical "screwdriver" is needed... your "hammer" will not be sufficient (in fact, it might even be a liability).

I can't tell you the number of times I have seen a single frigate grind down a battleship.


(btw... in EVE, the bigger a ship is, the more reliant it is on other players to support it... this was a gameplay decision to enforce the need for more experienced players to rely on younger players (who typically fly smaller ships))

The biggest problem using BSes (read non frigiated ships) is I cant run burner missions with my corp mates. Im afraid Im locked into the choice. Why the obsesion for just one ship class, just to make socializing more difficult, I will never know or understand.

Thanks for the articles.

Its nice to know Bses are versatile.

EVE has had an issue for some time with new players being obsessed with battleships. The logic seems to be "lowsec and null are scarey so I am limited to sub-caps and battleships are the biggest scariest sub-caps so I will train for them". This is partly driven by the fact hat level IV missions and Incursions are the traditional hisec ISK makers.

In some ways battleships are seen by newer players as the end game they need to achieve before they start "really playing" in EVE but this is totally untrue.

The introduction of Burners was a very good thing as they give people a reason to flesh out their frigate/fitting/ewar skills in PvE among other things making it easier later to move into PvP if they ever want to.

That said people have always run normal BS based level IVs in smaller ships. Taking on standard level IVs with a small gang of assault frigates can be quite a fun thing. If your wanting to help at team mates in BS level IVs a torpedo bomber or a logi comes to mind.

Regardless of the actual speed at which skills train, people will continue to get stuck in the mental loop of not being "Ready for PVP". It's a problem partially derived from PVP in other MMORPGs being an end-game only activity when EVE has no end-game. It's also exacerbated by PVP in highsec being considered an abnormal occurrence by a lot of highsec inhabitants. The only way to actually resolve that would be to push for coincidental PVP to be a frequent occurrence that players see and deal with routinely as soon as they start playing the game.

Anyway that's very much a different subject.

Good examples of "extreme" ships are ships with a highly specialized purpose, such as good-old armor buffer bait ships fit for nothing but armor EHP and maybe a couple of scrams. Also gank catalysts for suicide ganking and polarized bombers/Attack Battlecruisers/Vindicators for structure bashing are examples of damage output focused "Extreme ships".

I don't know if it has been mentioned yet, but Polarized Weaponry comes to mind when "extreme" is mentioned.

https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/new-exploration-sites-new-modules/

It is so extreme that is hard to find a usage case for it (aside from offline POS assaults).

The accepted fit to blitz the team burners is a Garmur with Polarised Rockets.

I was thinking that for a long time. It is a form of support, yet not in a positive sense.

I have time to time, upped my gunnery and installed an over sized gun on such a hull. A glass cannon to be sure.

It is possible.

Glass cannon means polarised.

With all V skills a T2 polarised Velator would look like this:

Tackle:
1 x Stasis Webifier II
1 x Warp Scambler II
Drones:
2 x Hobgoblin II
Turrets:
2 x Polarised 200mm Autocannon - Hail S ammo
Damage Mods:
2 x Gyrostabiliser II



EFT says that is 161 DPS which is in assault frigate territory. ( Alpha is 202 turret plus 190 drones)

Short range guns but in theory people ignore Velators so you can sneak up close. No tank cos polarised.



If you see 9 or 10 Velator hanging around a gate be wary that is 1600 DPS and 20 drones and 10 velator to take out :D