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What are your fraternization policies for your crews?
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Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#61 - 2015-10-17 17:34:15 UTC
I appreciate the input very much. The policies shared are widely varied and they have provided me with new perspective of my own attitude toward disciplinary policy.

I've had some interesting suggestions from my crew as well, and the common thread between their ideas seems to be the cost. It's practically nothing. I've instructed every member of my crew to purchase whatever they would like for morale on board, including people.

In anticipation of this Tengu becoming a hedonistic luxury yacht that sometimes shoots things, I'm hiring additional maintenance staff as well as a police force.

This could be a very bad move that causes my crew's performance to worsen. If it ends in a ball of fire, oh well I get to try again with a new crew.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#62 - 2015-10-17 21:07:58 UTC
Elmund Egivand wrote:

Why, this is exactly what you are doing to others. Shall I search through this entire IGS board for every single thing you had ever said and shove them all right into your face until you like it?

I think you have demonstrated already quite a lot that you can't operate neither facts, nor 'search' button. Your incompetence is annoying. Cease this at once.

Elmund Egivand wrote:

I see I really got under your skin, so much so you can't even spell my name right. Mission accomplished. I am going to wait and see what kind of motley fleet you can put together to hunt me down.

I suspect the answer is there won't be a fleet.

You are too insignificant and coward for me to 'hunt' you down. I am hunting those, who can do at least something except blabbering with lies against Caldari officers with foam at their mouth.
So. Yes. Please do wait. And do it silent.
Thanks in advance.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Tabris Katz
The Forgotten Children
#63 - 2015-10-18 13:12:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Tabris Katz
My rules for fraternization varies from each of my ships. These rules are based type of ship and expected missions that ship will be undertaking. With that noted there are a few universal rules.

1) No fraternization between managers and subordinates in the same command structure.
2) No fraternizing while on duty.
3) Refrain from public displays of affection in public areas such as commissary.

Disciplinary actions for violation of these rules: Verbal warning to dismissal based on the situation.

Here are my rule for the ships I most commonly use.

Faith(Stratios/Cruiser)
Expected missions types: Exploration, pirate combat, asset recovery, transportation of goods, humanitarian relief.
Additional rules:

  • No fraternizing with refugees.
  • All crew is considered active during combat situations

Disciplinary actions: Verbal warning to dismissal based on the situation.

Wyld(Proteus/Strategic Cruiser)
Expected missions types: Wormhole exploration, sleeper combat, asset recovery
Additional rules:

  • No fraternization of any type with fellow crew members.
  • Crew is considered on duty from time ship leave space dock till ship returns to dock.

Disciplinary actions: Confined till ship enters space dock followed by instant dismissal.

Mithril(Prospect/Expedition Frigate)
Expected missions types: Mining in hazardous areas.
Additional rules:

  • No fraternization of any type with fellow crew members.
  • Crew is considered on duty from time ship leave space dock till ship returns to dock.

Disciplinary actions: Confined till ship enters space dock followed by instant dismissal.

Shadow Runner(Viator/Blockade Runner), White Whale(Obelisk/Freighter) and Stone Eater(Skiff/Exhumer)
Expected missions types: Mining and transportation.
Additional rules: None
Disciplinary actions: No additions

Rotten Potato(Dominix/Battleship)
Expected missions types: Intense pirate combat, asset recovery
Additional rules:

  • Crew may fraternize while ship is in stand-by mode.
  • Ship is considered in stand-mode while not in combat.
  • All crew is active during combat situation.

Disciplinary actions: Demotion in position/pay to dismissal based on situation.
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#64 - 2015-10-18 16:37:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Aria Jenneth
To the OP (and I do apologize for contributing to the derailment):

I haven't been sure how to reply, or whether I should, but, mostly, I leave my crew alone.

Relatively speaking, I don't spend a whole lot of time in space at a stretch. My times in space tend to be only a few hours long at most, and those times are usually very dangerous for both ship and crew.

Not so much for me. Even if I get my ship blown up and my pod smartbombed, I'll just wake up a few implants lighter. I'm not the one who's risking my life. That's debatable, I know, but it's how I feel.

So: I make sure in my recruitment documentation that the crew is fully informed and aware that we might need to undock at any time, even if their ship has been shut up in a hangar for months, and that once we do their lives will be in immediate peril whether or not things go wrong, but especially if they do.

As long as they know the situation, I kind of feel like their private lives are just that.

I do see myself as a human being, a person, but, to my crews, I'm a harbinger, a bad omen of the worst sort. My arrival on the ship augurs death. So, as much as I can, I leave them in peace. I inflict myself on them as little as possible. Nothing I put at stake compares to what they risk. If they're going to do silly things that put them at additional risk of getting their blood and viscera boiled away and their carbonized remains fused to the deck plate-- what do I really have to say about it?

How they organize themselves and how they live their lives, knowing that they could die at any time with very little warning, isn't really my affair.

I preside over their deaths. How they live is up to them.
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#65 - 2015-10-18 18:01:35 UTC
I... could not have said it better... Suuolo.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#66 - 2015-10-19 15:44:14 UTC
In the eyes of Death we are all equal. We might hide in capsules, we might transfer consciousness, or lie to ourselves that we will still be alive after our clone dies, but the Death always takes what is due. Does it matter, if we end as a frozen corpse or carbonized remain? Dead bodies don't feel anymore.

I often meet them in person, as a commander would meet subordinates. I show them that I am not different of them.I even brawl with some of them, and would readily double their wage if they beat out at least one of my teeth. Not a lot have succeeded though, because ship crewman training program is way too different from navy marine, and usually I have way upper hand in such brawls. But regardless, I show them that I am made from the same blood and flesh. And that I will gladly sacrifice my own life in the name of the State and I require from them the same. For if they aren't ready to sacrifice their lives and fight to the death, I won't consider them Caldari and won't require their presence on my ship anymore.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#67 - 2015-10-19 16:53:24 UTC
Aria Jenneth wrote:
To the OP (and I do apologize for contributing to the derailment):

I haven't been sure how to reply, or whether I should, but, mostly, I leave my crew alone.

Relatively speaking, I don't spend a whole lot of time in space at a stretch. My times in space tend to be only a few hours long at most, and those times are usually very dangerous for both ship and crew.

Not so much for me. Even if I get my ship blown up and my pod smartbombed, I'll just wake up a few implants lighter. I'm not the one who's risking my life. That's debatable, I know, but it's how I feel.

So: I make sure in my recruitment documentation that the crew is fully informed and aware that we might need to undock at any time, even if their ship has been shut up in a hangar for months, and that once we do their lives will be in immediate peril whether or not things go wrong, but especially if they do.

As long as they know the situation, I kind of feel like their private lives are just that.

I do see myself as a human being, a person, but, to my crews, I'm a harbinger, a bad omen of the worst sort. My arrival on the ship augurs death. So, as much as I can, I leave them in peace. I inflict myself on them as little as possible. Nothing I put at stake compares to what they risk. If they're going to do silly things that put them at additional risk of getting their blood and viscera boiled away and their carbonized remains fused to the deck plate-- what do I really have to say about it?

How they organize themselves and how they live their lives, knowing that they could die at any time with very little warning, isn't really my affair.

I preside over their deaths. How they live is up to them.


So you will let them endanger your ship and their colleagues over some petty personal drama?

It's one thing to be aware of the risk, and an entirely different thing to wilfully put everyone at risk over some squabble about who laid with who.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
Yusef Brion
Big Yellow Pidgeon Inc.
#68 - 2015-10-19 21:03:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Yusef Brion
Elmund Egivand wrote:
If your crew can't sort out their problems amongst themselves outside their jobs like adults I suggest that you just fire them.


For offlining a subsystem? Yeah, fire them out an airlock. The rest will learn quickly.

Edit:
Elmund Egivand wrote:

Personally, I would be very tempted to sent 'saboteurs' out of the airlock.


Pardon me, I replied before I read. Carry on.

The more I read the forums over the years, the more I swear. To god. That the typos are intentional mistakes. Part o f the encryption.
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#69 - 2015-10-19 23:59:13 UTC
Elmund Egivand wrote:
So you will let them endanger your ship and their colleagues over some petty personal drama?

It's one thing to be aware of the risk, and an entirely different thing to wilfully put everyone at risk over some squabble about who laid with who.


If they're foolish enough to do so, and allow each other to do so? Yes.

As I see it, my crew is made up of adult human beings who have a job. It's not an ambiguous job. It's not a difficult job to understand. And the likely consequences of breach are less for me than they are for, well, anyone on board.

I'm not normally aboard any single ship very much. There are other people who know my crews much better than I do, ship's officers whose business it is to look after things like this. If they can't, I have no reason to think I will do better.

I have other concerns that are often just as important to the health and well-being of the crew. Probably moreso. They're usually shaped like hostile, capsuleer-piloted ships.

In the end, I'm okay with assuming that I am working with adults who can see to their own affairs. Maybe I'm sometimes wrong, and adults can do foolish things. But, again, for me, it's more like I'm stepping into someone else's community and flying it around for a couple hours than like I'm really leading people.

I guess it's more like doing business with outside contractors than leading people. But I do tend to assume that they'll do so competently and dependably.

Their lives depend on it, after all.
Rayne Soomer Evingod
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#70 - 2015-10-21 16:15:41 UTC
SEX DRUGS and ROCK & ROLL
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#71 - 2015-10-22 02:17:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Elmund Egivand
Aria Jenneth wrote:
Elmund Egivand wrote:
So you will let them endanger your ship and their colleagues over some petty personal drama?

It's one thing to be aware of the risk, and an entirely different thing to wilfully put everyone at risk over some squabble about who laid with who.


If they're foolish enough to do so, and allow each other to do so? Yes.

As I see it, my crew is made up of adult human beings who have a job. It's not an ambiguous job. It's not a difficult job to understand. And the likely consequences of breach are less for me than they are for, well, anyone on board.

I'm not normally aboard any single ship very much. There are other people who know my crews much better than I do, ship's officers whose business it is to look after things like this. If they can't, I have no reason to think I will do better.

I have other concerns that are often just as important to the health and well-being of the crew. Probably moreso. They're usually shaped like hostile, capsuleer-piloted ships.

In the end, I'm okay with assuming that I am working with adults who can see to their own affairs. Maybe I'm sometimes wrong, and adults can do foolish things. But, again, for me, it's more like I'm stepping into someone else's community and flying it around for a couple hours than like I'm really leading people.

I guess it's more like doing business with outside contractors than leading people. But I do tend to assume that they'll do so competently and dependably.

Their lives depend on it, after all.


You will be surprised about how immature many of the supposed 'adults' can be. It's pretty much why we had rules and SOPs in place, you just can't expect people to do the right thing all the time. Occasionally, arguments get heated and people do something really stupid and you have to unleash the disciplinarians upon them and get them to the time-out room to sit in a corner with a dunce hat on.

There are already examples on this forum.

In fact, there are things from my childhood I haven't grown out of. For example, chanting "Dakka dakka dakka" when firing projectile weapons.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#72 - 2015-10-22 03:00:02 UTC
Elmund Egivand wrote:
You will be surprised about how immature many of the supposed 'adults' can be. It's pretty much why we had rules and SOPs in place, you just can't expect people to do the right thing all the time. Occasionally, arguments get heated and people do something really stupid and you have to unleash the disciplinarians upon them and get them to the time-out room to sit in a corner with a dunce hat on.


Respectfully, Mr. Egivand, I doubt I'd be surprised.

Are you really okay with disciplining people who'll probably die under your command whether they do their jobs or not?

I think I'd have trouble being that hard on them. Or on me. There are other people who can do such things.

When the time comes, I am the ship. That's all. I issue no commands. I set no schedules. I discipline no one. The ship is my flesh and blood, for as long as I am aboard, which is normally brief.

There's no time for disciplining my internal organs. They need to have things worked out, themselves, or the body will fail-- and, infomorph that I am, I'll move to a different body.

Often, the body wakes only to die. That seems to be the way it is for us, whether the body is a clone or a ship.
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#73 - 2015-10-22 03:16:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Elmund Egivand
Aria Jenneth wrote:
Elmund Egivand wrote:
You will be surprised about how immature many of the supposed 'adults' can be. It's pretty much why we had rules and SOPs in place, you just can't expect people to do the right thing all the time. Occasionally, arguments get heated and people do something really stupid and you have to unleash the disciplinarians upon them and get them to the time-out room to sit in a corner with a dunce hat on.


Respectfully, Mr. Egivand, I doubt I'd be surprised.

Are you really okay with disciplining people who'll probably die under your command whether they do their jobs or not?

I think I'd have trouble being that hard on them. Or on me. There are other people who can do such things.

When the time comes, I am the ship. That's all. I issue no commands. I set no schedules. I discipline no one. The ship is my flesh and blood, for as long as I am aboard, which is normally brief.

There's no time for disciplining my internal organs. They need to have things worked out, themselves, or the body will fail-- and, infomorph that I am, I'll move to a different body.

Often, the body wakes only to die. That seems to be the way it is for us, whether the body is a clone or a ship.


Yes, I am okay with disciplining people who'll probably die under my command.

First, every little bit that adds to the probability of surviving is to be encouraged. These people can use every help they can get to make it back to safety where they can go back to their homes and spend their hard-earned money. If it means that they must not do anything stupid that will end up killing themselves through no fault of the red flashy on the overview window, then so be it.

Second, if they died because of something stupid they did, how am I supposed to explain that to their next-of-kin? Send them a condolence letter that read, "Sorry that your husband died because he was stupid enough to kick the nuclear fission reactor out of frustration due to losing all his hard-earned money on the tarot table. P/s: His kicking of the reactor also killed twenty of his fellow crewmates"?

Besides, having my ship explode during a milk run because a crew member got into a squabble with another crew member that resulted in them punching each other and throwing flammable objects in the gunnery deck is just too stupid and didn't have to happen.

And no, you can't discipline your body organs since they are non-sentient. They can, however, be fixed. If it means that we can all come back after an hour, so be it.

Perhaps my insistence for discipline and not-do-the-stupid-thing so we may be able to come back somewhat intact and able to enjoy the spoils is part of my cultural upbringing. We are not raised to lie down and weep before certain doom. We are brought up to fight for our survival tooth-and-nail. If we fight, we have a certain probability of surviving. If not, then the probability of surviving is zero.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#74 - 2015-10-22 03:42:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Aria Jenneth
Elmund Egivand wrote:
Yes, I am okay with disciplining people who'll probably die under my command.

First, every little bit that adds to the probability of surviving is to be encouraged. These people can use every help they can get to make it back to safety where they can go back to their homes and spend their hard-earned money. If it means that they must not do anything stupid that will end up killing themselves through no fault of the red flashy on the overview window, then so be it.

Second, if they died because of something stupid they did, how am I supposed to explain that to their next-of-kin? Send them a condolence letter that read, "Sorry that your husband died because he was stupid enough to kick the nuclear fission reactor out of frustration due to losing all his hard-earned money on the tarot table. P/s: His kicking of the reactor also killed twenty of his fellow crewmates"?

And no, you can't discipline your body organs since they are non-sentient. They can, however, be fixed. If it means that we can all come back after an hour, so be it.

Perhaps my insistence for discipline and not-do-the-stupid-thing so we may be able to come back somewhat intact and able to enjoy the spoils is part of my cultural upbringing. We are not raised to lie down and weep before certain doom. We are brought up to fight for our survival tooth-and-nail. If we fight, we have a certain probability of surviving. If not, then the probability of surviving is zero.


Respectfully, Mr. Egivand, this this strikes me as being a product of your upbringing in a completely different way: you're functioning like a traditional commanding officer.

Getting to know your people; taking responsibility for their lives as well as their deaths; writing letters of condolence: hallmarks of a naval commander. I can nearly see the words, "Choose the lesser evil," etched behind your eyes.

With the greatest respect, you play the part as though you still sat upon a bridge, giving orders and receiving reports.

There may be a place for that kind of approach, but I am not that kind of creature. I was born into this life.

I came into this existence the intellectual heir to a being who self-identified as an interstellar predator. The best way I know how to pilot is to inhabit the ship entirely; to forget the lives within me, and the lives within others around me; to let the small group, village, or city within me look after itself, while I look after my own affairs.

Though I'm confident that it is best for me to think of myself as human, I understand people who insist that I am not. I don't weep for the dead. I also don't write letters of condolence. Mass death is a byproduct of my work, which, grim as it is, I recognize as necessary. I'm comfortable with that.

Sometimes compassion consists in forgetting someone exists. It's this sort of compassion I extend to my crews, and to the crews of my opponents.

I'm not a military commander, Mr. Egivand. As a capsuleer, I am a bad thing that happens to people.

The least I can do for the ones I am most directly responsible for is to leave them in peace.
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#75 - 2015-10-22 03:59:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Elmund Egivand
Aria Jenneth wrote:
Elmund Egivand wrote:
Yes, I am okay with disciplining people who'll probably die under my command.

First, every little bit that adds to the probability of surviving is to be encouraged. These people can use every help they can get to make it back to safety where they can go back to their homes and spend their hard-earned money. If it means that they must not do anything stupid that will end up killing themselves through no fault of the red flashy on the overview window, then so be it.

Second, if they died because of something stupid they did, how am I supposed to explain that to their next-of-kin? Send them a condolence letter that read, "Sorry that your husband died because he was stupid enough to kick the nuclear fission reactor out of frustration due to losing all his hard-earned money on the tarot table. P/s: His kicking of the reactor also killed twenty of his fellow crewmates"?

And no, you can't discipline your body organs since they are non-sentient. They can, however, be fixed. If it means that we can all come back after an hour, so be it.

Perhaps my insistence for discipline and not-do-the-stupid-thing so we may be able to come back somewhat intact and able to enjoy the spoils is part of my cultural upbringing. We are not raised to lie down and weep before certain doom. We are brought up to fight for our survival tooth-and-nail. If we fight, we have a certain probability of surviving. If not, then the probability of surviving is zero.


Respectfully, Mr. Egivand, this strikes me as being a product of your upbringing in a completely different way: you're functioning like a traditional commanding officer.

Getting to know your people; taking responsibility for their lives as well as their deaths; writing letters of condolence: hallmarks of a naval commander. I can nearly see the words, "Choose the lesser evil," etched behind your eyes.

With the greatest respect, you play the part as though you still sat upon a bridge, giving orders and receiving reports.

There may be a place for that kind of approach, but I am not that kind of creature. I was born into this life.

I came into this existence the intellectual heir to a being who self-identified as an interstellar predator. The best way I know how to pilot is to inhabit the ship entirely; to forget the lives within me, and the lives within others around me; to let the small group, village, or city within me look after itself, while I look after my own affairs.

Though I'm confident that it is best for me to think of myself as human, I understand people who insist that I am not. I don't weep for the dead. I also don't write letters of condolence. Mass death is a byproduct of my work, which, grim as it is, I recognize as necessary. I'm comfortable with that.

Sometimes compassion consists in forgetting someone exists. It's this sort of compassion I extend to my crews, and to the crews of my opponents.

I'm not a military commander, Mr. Egivand. As a capsuleer, I am a bad thing that happens to people.

The least I can do for the ones I am most directly responsible for is to leave them in peace.


Your hypothesis about me being a commanding officer is untrue but it does have a valid basis. I was military and I picked up alot of nuances from my XO. We are trained to treat our bodies as finely honed machines that will only function as well as we treat them (hence all that running laps throughout the length of the Typhoon-class battleship). We also mingle alot with our fellow comrades. It has become a habit to quickly come into an understanding that we are all in this together and we gotta be scratching each other's backs if we want to see shore leave.

Hence why I just can't quite leave behind the idea that there's people besides myself in the bowels of my ship and my actions will impact their lives. Thinking of the crew as people, getting to know them and knowing where they are coming from has all become second nature.

Yes, I understand that people will die aboard my ship, and that it is my job to make sure that they will always have a way out. If I have to change the entire ship architecture for them to have safe spots to hole up and wait for rescue, then I will do it. If I have to drill them on how to save their lives if combat goes south, so be it. If I can cut down the crew requirements and delegate simple tasks that do not require creativity to machines, then so be it. If I must suck less to preserve my crew, then yes, I will work on sucking less.

Every time I look at the D-scan for targets of opportunity, I always look at the ship name, utilise my knowledge about said ship, think about the crew, estimate the chances of success and, if the chance of success is anywhere within 50%, the AI will sound the combat alert (and I damn well hope the crew heed that alert and go to places they ought to be going) then I warp in and engage.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#76 - 2015-10-22 04:34:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Aria Jenneth
Elmund Egivand wrote:
Your hypothesis about me being a commanding officer is untrue but it does have a valid basis. I was military and I picked up alot of nuances from my XO. We are trained to treat our bodies as finely honed machines that will only function as well as we treat them (hence all that running laps throughout the length of the Typhoon-class battleship).

Also, I just can't quite leave behind the idea that there's people besides myself in the bowels of my ship and my actions will impact their lives. I understand that people will die under my command, and that it is my job to make sure that they will always have a way out. If I have to change the entire ship architecture for them to have safe spots to hole up and wait for rescue, then I will do it. If I have to drill them on how to save their lives if combat goes south, so be it. If I can cut down the crew requirements and delegate simple tasks that do not require creativity to machines, then so be it. If I must suck less to preserve my crew, then yes, I will work on sucking less.

Every time I look at the D-scan for targets of opportunity, I always look at the ship name, utilise my knowledge about said ship, think about the crew, estimate the chances of success and, if the chance of success is anywhere within 50%, the AI will sound the combat alert (and I damn well hope the crew heed that alert and go to places they ought to be going) then I warp in and engage.


Sometimes I see things like this and wonder whether, maybe, I should be more careful about people's lives, even if it makes me a little less effective.

It's not a simple question for me.

People die in our line of work. A lot. For the most part, we're not paid to fight, but to exterminate. That's not a kind of mercenary I can bring myself to be-- an executioner of fleets.

But that also means I can't be the sort of captain who gets attached to my crew. If I could just slaughter people, if I didn't insist on facing other capsuleers, I could be the sort of pilot who really gets to know my crew. I could afford to care. I might be with them for months, maybe longer.

If I did that, though, I'd be slaughtering that many more people I didn't know, by orders of magnitude. Against a fully armed and equipped capsuleer vessel, what is a conventional warship? It's not even really a fight.

There's really no getting away from the bloodshed if I want to play my part, to be useful as a capsuleer. Our whole economy is soaked in it. I'm a killer, but I can't bring myself to just be a butcher.

So ... the only prey I'm happy hunting is a peer. Another capsuleer. That means that my own ship is vulnerable, too. Sometimes I lose. Pretty often, really.

How can I look my crew in the eye and tell them that they're very likely to die because I have no interest in killing people who can't fight back? That I don't even really care whether we win or lose?

I'm a killer, not a commander.

I'm in no position to discipline anyone.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#77 - 2015-10-22 04:48:40 UTC
I'm beginning to have doubts about this arrangement, but I'm sticking to the plan as a little experiment.

Most of my crew returned, but some are missing and there's still things being loaded on board as well as a ton of renovations for the additional hands. I left it in place and linked up with a fleet in another ship.

I had that crew for about an hour between purchase and loss. Everything worked, though, so I might be going backwards here.

Aria to be quite honest I can't fathom permanent death anymore, and I never had to, so to say I'm out of touch is an understatement. I've died through two clones in as many hours just now, and here I am wondering what might improve my crew's performance.

Are we gods? I don't feel like one.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#78 - 2015-10-22 05:10:07 UTC
I'm a god. I don't know about you all..... As for the matter of death, my crews know what they're getting into. I even have the notification of next of kin letter in their contracts, they have to both sign it and provide a legal last will and testament before being accepted for duty aboard one of my ships. I try not to get blown up as often as possible, but, no plan survives the undock....

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#79 - 2015-10-22 05:21:02 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
I'm beginning to have doubts about this arrangement, but I'm sticking to the plan as a little experiment.

Most of my crew returned, but some are missing and there's still things being loaded on board as well as a ton of renovations for the additional hands. I left it in place and linked up with a fleet in another ship.

I had that crew for about an hour between purchase and loss. Everything worked, though, so I might be going backwards here.

Aria to be quite honest I can't fathom permanent death anymore, and I never had to, so to say I'm out of touch is an understatement. I've died through two clones in as many hours just now, and here I am wondering what might improve my crew's performance.

Are we gods? I don't feel like one.


Me neither, and I really don't think we are. We're human, just more apes who've bootstrapped our tool use up to somewhere really strange.

Permanent death ... I wonder whether baseliners see it clearly, either. We're not really immune to it, you know. Maybe I'm more aware of it than most because my infomorph got damaged, but, yeah.

Some day, we, also, will come to a stop.

Respectfully, that's something it's probably not healthy to lose sight of. It seems like the kind of thing that makes it likelier to happen sooner, for one thing.

About personnel, my antecedent's approach has worked pretty well for me: hire experts on setting up operations and let them handle it. I'm probably even more hands-off than she was.
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#80 - 2015-10-22 05:54:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Elmund Egivand
Aria Jenneth wrote:
Elmund Egivand wrote:
Your hypothesis about me being a commanding officer is untrue but it does have a valid basis. I was military and I picked up alot of nuances from my XO. We are trained to treat our bodies as finely honed machines that will only function as well as we treat them (hence all that running laps throughout the length of the Typhoon-class battleship).

Also, I just can't quite leave behind the idea that there's people besides myself in the bowels of my ship and my actions will impact their lives. I understand that people will die under my command, and that it is my job to make sure that they will always have a way out. If I have to change the entire ship architecture for them to have safe spots to hole up and wait for rescue, then I will do it. If I have to drill them on how to save their lives if combat goes south, so be it. If I can cut down the crew requirements and delegate simple tasks that do not require creativity to machines, then so be it. If I must suck less to preserve my crew, then yes, I will work on sucking less.

Every time I look at the D-scan for targets of opportunity, I always look at the ship name, utilise my knowledge about said ship, think about the crew, estimate the chances of success and, if the chance of success is anywhere within 50%, the AI will sound the combat alert (and I damn well hope the crew heed that alert and go to places they ought to be going) then I warp in and engage.


Sometimes I see things like this and wonder whether, maybe, I should be more careful about people's lives, even if it makes me a little less effective.

It's not a simple question for me.

People die in our line of work. A lot. For the most part, we're not paid to fight, but to exterminate. That's not a kind of mercenary I can bring myself to be-- an executioner of fleets.

But that also means I can't be the sort of captain who gets attached to my crew. If I could just slaughter people, if I didn't insist on facing other capsuleers, I could be the sort of pilot who really gets to know my crew. I could afford to care. I might be with them for months, maybe longer.

If I did that, though, I'd be slaughtering that many more people I didn't know, by orders of magnitude. Against a fully armed and equipped capsuleer vessel, what is a conventional warship? It's not even really a fight.

There's really no getting away from the bloodshed if I want to play my part, to be useful as a capsuleer. Our whole economy is soaked in it. I'm a killer, but I can't bring myself to just be a butcher.

So ... the only prey I'm happy hunting is a peer. Another capsuleer. That means that my own ship is vulnerable, too. Sometimes I lose. Pretty often, really.

How can I look my crew in the eye and tell them that they're very likely to die because I have no interest in killing people who can't fight back? That I don't even really care whether we win or lose?

I'm a killer, not a commander.

I'm in no position to discipline anyone.


Quite frankly, I couldn't give a furrier's buttocks about the well-being of anyone who happened to be on the wrong end of my weapons. The only people I am responsible for are the thrill-seekers, adventurers and money- and blood-starved mercenaries who came to my ship for work. The lives of whoever's on the other ship is the responsibility of whoever's commandeering their ship. If they made the decision to stand between me and my crew and what we want, then we are going to be lobbing munitions at one another until one of us dies.

Yes, my crew are aware that my quarries are other capsuleers. Yes, they know I have a propensity for battlelust and that is just as much a motivating factor as ISK for engaging in starship violence. Yes, I told them, very plainly, right in the eye, that their chance of survival is low, and the steps I'm taking and the steps they are taking will only slightly improve their chances.

If I don't inform them of what they are getting into and offer them the opportunity to seek a living elsewhere then I am not fulfilling my responsibilities as a combat pilot and the brain of the warship.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.