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Crime & Punishment

 
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Hyperdunking nerf on sisi, to the battlements!

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Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#161 - 2015-10-12 13:16:06 UTC
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Mag's wrote:
But that still doesn't exclude the other options open, such as avoiding systems and the time of your move.


So choosing choke point systems like Uedama and Niarja negate that argument, who would have thunk that...


There are plenty of quiet lowsec routes that bypass those systems, and that a freighter with a scout will safely pass through.

Plus there's other options to consider. I have moved over a quarter trillion worth of goods in the last year without loss, via courier contracts, at absolutely no risk to myself and at very low cost (probably paid about 2 billion total, after accounting for the modest profits from the two failed contracts).


There is no low sec route around Niarja, and if you think moving a freighter through the two low sec systems near Sivala with 431 jumps in the last 24 hours is quiet then you are off your rocker.

Courier contracts is of course one way, but DST's are currently a good bet if properly fitted and piloted.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
ArmyOfMe
Stay Frosty.
A Band Apart.
#162 - 2015-10-12 13:43:22 UTC
Faylee Freir wrote:
Well, it was fun while it lasted. Shame to see a tactic that is easy to stop being curbstomped by CCP. Check out my killboard and look at my glorious kills... Multiply that amount by 2 and that's how many ganks have been prevented by simply one person in a T1 logi.

CCP, we will continue to find ways to make your changes benefit us and our emergent gameplay. So keep breaking our ****, and the lame and weak will continue to cry. Lets see how much you can actually ruin your game.

If its you causing them to make changes, isnt that just as much you ruining their game, as it is themselfs?

GM Guard > I must ask you not to use the petition option like this again but i personally would finish the chicken sandwich first so it won´t go to waste. The spaghetti will keep and you can use it the next time you get hungry. Best regards.
Faylee Freir
Abusing Game Mechanics
#163 - 2015-10-12 14:21:52 UTC
ArmyOfMe wrote:
Faylee Freir wrote:
Well, it was fun while it lasted. Shame to see a tactic that is easy to stop being curbstomped by CCP. Check out my killboard and look at my glorious kills... Multiply that amount by 2 and that's how many ganks have been prevented by simply one person in a T1 logi.

CCP, we will continue to find ways to make your changes benefit us and our emergent gameplay. So keep breaking our ****, and the lame and weak will continue to cry. Lets see how much you can actually ruin your game.

If its you causing them to make changes, isnt that just as much you ruining their game, as it is themselfs?

I don't think so, because I'm playing their game within the rules. I'm not cheating, exploiting, or doing anything that is breaking the game. If hyperdunking has been such a plague to the game and it's playerbase, then I imagine they would have made these changes back in January.

Rham, I agree with you to an extent. There's a lot of hypocrisy on both sides of this fence. Specifically pertaining to the contents on this thread, there's sufficient risk on both sides which is why I see this change as a bit silly. I agree with you a bit about bumping... I remember you coming to WK me the first time I started bumping in Madi... I was bad at it, you called me bad, and it was funny. A good solid week of practice and now the only thing that slips by me is a freighter with webs (I'm never prepared). I can perform each part of a hyperdunk 100% solo on a live target and the only way to stop me is logi. With that said, I think bumping is pretty strong.

HTFU
Noragen Neirfallas
Emotional Net Loss
#164 - 2015-10-12 14:34:08 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Gank the bumping mach...


Sounds easy when you say it as a throw away line, doing it is however not an easy matter, a fast moving Macherial set up for bumping is not an easy target, its not at all like a freighter..

Tell you what I'll do it some time in a few weeks for you and just pay my way outta the kr if it goes public

Member and Judge of the Court of Crime and Punishment

Noragens basically the Chribba of C&P - Zimmy Zeta

Confirming that we all play in Noragen's eve. - BeBopAReBop

ISD Buldath favorite ISD

'"****station games" - Sun Tzu' - Ralph King Griffin
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#165 - 2015-10-12 14:46:06 UTC
Faylee Freir wrote:
ArmyOfMe wrote:
Faylee Freir wrote:
Well, it was fun while it lasted. Shame to see a tactic that is easy to stop being curbstomped by CCP. Check out my killboard and look at my glorious kills... Multiply that amount by 2 and that's how many ganks have been prevented by simply one person in a T1 logi.

CCP, we will continue to find ways to make your changes benefit us and our emergent gameplay. So keep breaking our ****, and the lame and weak will continue to cry. Lets see how much you can actually ruin your game.

If its you causing them to make changes, isnt that just as much you ruining their game, as it is themselfs?


I don't think so, because I'm playing their game within the rules. I'm not cheating, exploiting, or doing anything that is breaking the game. If hyperdunking has been such a plague to the game and it's playerbase, then I imagine they would have made these changes back in January.


well seems ccp think otherwise, maybe it wasnt such a plague in january as it is now? end of the day ccp think your tactic is wrong so they are nerfing it

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Faylee Freir
Abusing Game Mechanics
#166 - 2015-10-12 15:10:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Faylee Freir
Lan Wang wrote:
Faylee Freir wrote:
ArmyOfMe wrote:
Faylee Freir wrote:
Well, it was fun while it lasted. Shame to see a tactic that is easy to stop being curbstomped by CCP. Check out my killboard and look at my glorious kills... Multiply that amount by 2 and that's how many ganks have been prevented by simply one person in a T1 logi.

CCP, we will continue to find ways to make your changes benefit us and our emergent gameplay. So keep breaking our ****, and the lame and weak will continue to cry. Lets see how much you can actually ruin your game.

If its you causing them to make changes, isnt that just as much you ruining their game, as it is themselfs?


I don't think so, because I'm playing their game within the rules. I'm not cheating, exploiting, or doing anything that is breaking the game. If hyperdunking has been such a plague to the game and it's playerbase, then I imagine they would have made these changes back in January.


well seems ccp think otherwise, maybe it wasnt such a plague in january as it is now? end of the day ccp think your tactic is wrong so they are nerfing it

Yeah no doubt there's more people doing it now. If they see fit to change it, it's fine. People that would bother to even go through hyperdunking a freighter are the kind of people that can adapt and move on. My point is that you can't fault players for using mechanics in a creative way, especially in a game like EVE. The facts are out there in that regular freighter ganking is more op than hyperdunking. So its for these reasons that I think it's silly to remove hyper dunking. The only thing that might be a bit imbalanced is that there's literally no ceiling on the amount of isk some of these idiots will haul around in an expanded freighter. Every gate flash and every cargo scan in the next albino mega-whale waiting for me to murder him and mount on my wall.

These opinions I've expressed arent going to be popular, but if you've hyperdunked you know it to be true. So I will adapt and instead of hyperdunking, I will train up a small legion and achieve the same result, but with less risk of interference from white knights. CCP is doing nothing but making people adapt. When was the last time a pvebear had to adapt like content creators have had to consistently do?

HTFU
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#167 - 2015-10-12 15:28:41 UTC
i agree with that point, carebears never have to adapt and maybe thats the problem with them getting bored of the game Pirate

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Nighthawk The Assassin
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#168 - 2015-10-12 16:55:40 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
i agree with that point, carebears never have to adapt and maybe thats the problem with them getting bored of the game Pirate


Why should PvE players adapt to your version of eve?

Why can't you just fight in low/null/wh's?

Why do you have to war deck PvE players?

Why can't you just go PvP in dangerous areas?

Or will you spout "Risk Vs Reward" rubbish as a shield?

Every time you are challenged by PvE players it's the same excuse.

"It's A Sandbox" "Risk Vs Reward" "Nerf PvE"

But when it's turned back on you, omg thread nought, all of you spamming a forum thread, crying like little girls because CCP changed summit you don't like.

It's pathetic, you, the griefers, are the reason EvE doesn't grow, end of story, period, no arguments.
Faylee Freir
Abusing Game Mechanics
#169 - 2015-10-12 17:03:00 UTC
Nighthawk The Assassin wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
i agree with that point, carebears never have to adapt and maybe thats the problem with them getting bored of the game Pirate


Why should PvE players adapt to your version of eve?

Why can't you just fight in low/null/wh's?

Why do you have to war deck PvE players?

Why can't you just go PvP in dangerous areas?

Or will you spout "Risk Vs Reward" rubbish as a shield?

Every time you are challenged by PvE players it's the same excuse.

"It's A Sandbox" "Risk Vs Reward" "Nerf PvE"

But when it's turned back on you, omg thread nought, all of you spamming a forum thread, crying like little girls because CCP changed summit you don't like.

It's pathetic, you, the griefers, are the reason EvE doesn't grow, end of story, period, no arguments.

Eve is a niche mmo that will always appeal to a small share of the market. Were just playing the game that CCP created. Why do you want to change what is one of eves core values and pillars?

HTFU
Mag's
Azn Empire
#170 - 2015-10-12 18:17:25 UTC
Nighthawk The Assassin wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
i agree with that point, carebears never have to adapt and maybe thats the problem with them getting bored of the game Pirate


Why should PvE players adapt to your version of eve?

Why can't you just fight in low/null/wh's?

Why do you have to war deck PvE players?

Why can't you just go PvP in dangerous areas?

Or will you spout "Risk Vs Reward" rubbish as a shield?

Every time you are challenged by PvE players it's the same excuse.

"It's A Sandbox" "Risk Vs Reward" "Nerf PvE"

But when it's turned back on you, omg thread nought, all of you spamming a forum thread, crying like little girls because CCP changed summit you don't like.

It's pathetic, you, the griefers, are the reason EvE doesn't grow, end of story, period, no arguments.

Why do you play a game, you obviously don't like? I say obviously because if you did like it, you wouldn't be wanting the core of the game changed to suit you.

But then you may be like this with any game who's rules you don't like.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Mag's
Azn Empire
#171 - 2015-10-12 18:21:49 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Mag's wrote:
But that still doesn't exclude the other options open, such as avoiding systems and the time of your move.


So choosing choke point systems like Uedama and Niarja negate that argument, who would have thunk that...

Glad you see I'm right and they were wrong. Thanks.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Rhamnousia Nosferatu
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#172 - 2015-10-12 19:12:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Rhamnousia Nosferatu
Nighthawk The Assassin wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
i agree with that point, carebears never have to adapt and maybe thats the problem with them getting bored of the game Pirate


Why should PvE players adapt to your version of eve?

Why can't you just fight in low/null/wh's?

Why do you have to war deck PvE players?

Why can't you just go PvP in dangerous areas?

Or will you spout "Risk Vs Reward" rubbish as a shield?

Every time you are challenged by PvE players it's the same excuse.

"It's A Sandbox" "Risk Vs Reward" "Nerf PvE"

But when it's turned back on you, omg thread nought, all of you spamming a forum thread, crying like little girls because CCP changed summit you don't like.

It's pathetic, you, the griefers, are the reason EvE doesn't grow, end of story, period, no arguments.


There is no PvE or PvP version of EVE, there is only EVE with its mechanics. You should understand the very nature of the game you signed up to play for starters and then think about what you don't like about your PvE EVE experience and how it could be improved while keeping the risky nature of the game. Believe it or not, that very nature is probably the only reason this game lasted so long and it should be preserved.
Admittedly, some tweaks are needed to various aspects of the game, but that's a whole different story. In order to construcively contribute to discussion you need to start with understanding and accepting the nature of the game.
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#173 - 2015-10-12 19:43:06 UTC
Nighthawk The Assassin wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
i agree with that point, carebears never have to adapt and maybe thats the problem with them getting bored of the game Pirate


Why should PvE players adapt to your version of eve?

Why can't you just fight in low/null/wh's?

Why do you have to war deck PvE players?

Why can't you just go PvP in dangerous areas?

Or will you spout "Risk Vs Reward" rubbish as a shield?

Every time you are challenged by PvE players it's the same excuse.

"It's A Sandbox" "Risk Vs Reward" "Nerf PvE"

But when it's turned back on you, omg thread nought, all of you spamming a forum thread, crying like little girls because CCP changed summit you don't like.

It's pathetic, you, the griefers, are the reason EvE doesn't grow, end of story, period, no arguments.


1. Why should everyone have to adapt to satisfy you? why do the rules have to change to suit your playstyle? hypocrite

2. I do, i live in nullsec

3. i dont wardec, if i want to shoot you, i will an nothing will stop me

4. yes i fly shiney stuff in nullsec to make my isk and accept tthe risk, even when i pve in highsec i also treat the area like nullsec and take the relevant precautions. its not really hard is it?

5. im not a griefer i just look at things from both sides of the fence, take some precautions and accept the way the game is played and stop trying to change things to suit your own playstyle because you are too lazy to take some precautions in the game where you can be killed anywhere.

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Siegfried Cohenberg
Cohenberg's Ethical Hauling
Freighter Friends
#174 - 2015-10-12 19:58:12 UTC
Rhamnousia Nosferatu wrote:

Let’s not forget - if you have two bumping machs, there is no counter, whatsoever. How’s that for good mechanics?



I, the KING bumper siegfried cohenburger, could easily out bump any two pleb bumpers and save that freighter. The better bumper will always control the situation.

Rhamnousia Nosferatu wrote:
Oh and when I say that the fact that you can gank those bumpers cannot be considered an acceptable reliable counter, I get flamed, but let me repeat it – ganking bumpers cannot be considered a legitimate counter. Why? Well ganking bumper is a consequence-laden act (loss of ship, sec status and providing a killright) countering something which can be done without any consequence at all while still acting in an aggressive role (aggression-free warp disruption).



Jennifer en Marlend is probably giggling at how naive this portion is.
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#175 - 2015-10-12 19:59:42 UTC
Mag's wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Mag's wrote:
But that still doesn't exclude the other options open, such as avoiding systems and the time of your move.


So choosing choke point systems like Uedama and Niarja negate that argument, who would have thunk that...

Glad you see I'm right and they were wrong. Thanks.


I wondered if you would do the misunderstand trick, CODE has chosen those choke points to do their ganks because there is no real way to avoid them which makes you comment just avoid them rather a moot one...

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#176 - 2015-10-12 20:11:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Dracvlad
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Gank the bumping mach...


Sounds easy when you say it as a throw away line, doing it is however not an easy matter, a fast moving Macherial set up for bumping is not an easy target, its not at all like a freighter..

Tell you what I'll do it some time in a few weeks for you and just pay my way outta the kr if it goes public


I went out to gank two Macherials, KR's would not have bothered me, the first warped away when I scanned him and came back with a better tank and I could not get another person to help me to get enough DPS, so did not follow through on it, the second attempt was alongside Jennifer en Marland, but as we were also trying to drive them off to save the freighter it was rather difficult as they made it too difficult to get on them and we needed 3 Talos to do it as they had fitted a tank so needed to be perfect.

Of course the way to do it was to wait until the gank fleet is incoming, because most of the time the Macherial sits still next to the freighter, at least they did that while I was involved in AG activities, but that is going just for the kill rather than trying to save the freighter, which was our primary aim. They have such deep pockets that a Macherial loss bothers them not at all..., though some did cry when Jenn got them!

But do it will be fun...

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Paranoid Loyd
#177 - 2015-10-12 20:44:25 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Mag's wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Mag's wrote:
But that still doesn't exclude the other options open, such as avoiding systems and the time of your move.


So choosing choke point systems like Uedama and Niarja negate that argument, who would have thunk that...

Glad you see I'm right and they were wrong. Thanks.


I wondered if you would do the misunderstand trick, CODE has chosen those choke points to do their ganks because there is no real way to avoid them which makes you comment just avoid them rather a moot one...

Yes there is.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#178 - 2015-10-12 20:52:33 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Mag's wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Mag's wrote:
But that still doesn't exclude the other options open, such as avoiding systems and the time of your move.


So choosing choke point systems like Uedama and Niarja negate that argument, who would have thunk that...

Glad you see I'm right and they were wrong. Thanks.


I wondered if you would do the misunderstand trick, CODE has chosen those choke points to do their ganks because there is no real way to avoid them which makes you comment just avoid them rather a moot one...

Yes there is.


Emphasis on the word REAL...

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Rhamnousia Nosferatu
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#179 - 2015-10-12 21:15:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Rhamnousia Nosferatu
Sigfried Cohenberg wrote:
Rhamnousia Nosferatu wrote:
Oh and when I say that the fact that you can gank those bumpers cannot be considered an acceptable reliable counter, I get flamed, but let me repeat it – ganking bumpers cannot be considered a legitimate counter. Why? Well ganking bumper is a consequence-laden act (loss of ship, sec status and providing a killright) countering something which can be done without any consequence at all while still acting in an aggressive role (aggression-free warp disruption).



Jennifer en Marlend is probably giggling at how naive this portion is.


I doubt it.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#180 - 2015-10-12 21:24:29 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:

Yes there is.


Emphasis on the word REAL...


I went through Kubinen just last week. Seemed pretty real to me.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.