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It's been 285 days since the Fanfest Factional warfare round table.

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Lyrrashae
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#41 - 2012-01-04 14:32:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyrrashae
Jowen Datloran wrote:
The "love" is probably allowing alliances to sign up for FW.

Those guys are bored out of their skull having nobody to fight in blue, I mean, zero sec.


Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand, once again:

Null trash who do everything they can to break this game get their hand held, their "win" handed to them by CCP, and the rest of us get screwed into paying for it.

Business as usual, nothing to see here, moving right along.

FW either needs a massive and complete re-invention, or it needs to be binned.

Ni.
Lyrrashae
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#42 - 2012-01-04 14:35:51 UTC
Jowen Datloran wrote:
[...]

Those guys are bored out of their skull having nobody to fight in blue, I mean, zero sec.


They shat their beds, why should the rest of us sleep in them?

Ni.
Tiberius Murderhorne
CONTRATTO
#43 - 2012-01-04 14:48:31 UTC
CCP Guard wrote:

There are also some important changes to Factional Warfare coming even sooner than that and we are actually making a video in the next days that should cast a light on those, among other things.


now this sounds promising :D I await the video!

Cheers
Tib

Disclaimer : My posting does not always reflect my Corps views or my allience views.... Infact sometimes it does not even reflect my views!

Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#44 - 2012-01-04 15:50:11 UTC
Sorry I missed this thread and couldnt respond sooner!!

Just so you know, we've been working hard to ensure that Faction Warfare gets the attention it deserves. I've been managing this thread, to keep all the feedback about FW in one place, and made sure the CSM had all the information they needed to discuss this at the recent summit, and it appears our efforts have finally paid off...

To all those saying "FW is dead, move along, nothing to see" I'm terribly sorry, but that just isn't the case. In addition to a community that has kept the feature alive for years now by their own efforts, we have finally gained momentum within the CSM and CCP developers themselves and put FW back on the roadmap for development. Our time and patience has paid off.

As Guard said, its been well discussed now that CCP is actively working on FW iterations - not just speculating or theorizing, but actually programming stuff. I, and many others here who have been championing the cause, can't wait to see the fruits of all our pitchfork labor!!

And yes, it has been ENTIRELY too long. But we have their attention now, lets keep things respectful, and productive. The time for rabble-rousing is over, we have an audience, time to use it and keep up the constructive feedback so that the FW improvements that roll out over the next few months are community-approved.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Arjola Elongur
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#45 - 2012-01-04 17:40:54 UTC
CCP Guard wrote:
It's not unlikely that Factional Warfare will get some love and tender care along the way.


Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
CCP is actively working on FW iterations - not just speculating or theorizing, but actually programming stuff.


Somehow I don't think those two statements are really compatible.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#46 - 2012-01-04 18:02:32 UTC
Arjola Elongur wrote:
CCP Guard wrote:
It's not unlikely that Factional Warfare will get some love and tender care along the way.


Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
CCP is actively working on FW iterations - not just speculating or theorizing, but actually programming stuff.


Somehow I don't think those two statements are really compatible.


CCP Guard wrote:
There are also some important changes to Factional Warfare coming even sooner than that and we are actually making a video in the next days that should cast a light on those, among other things.


Stop being dense and twisting words. CCP Guard talking about tender lovemaking love and care to FW was on the topic of the summer expansion. They are iterating and will release more stuff before then, too. So yes, those statements are compatible.

Looking forward to incoming FW improvements!

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)
ShipToaster
#47 - 2012-01-04 19:32:46 UTC  |  Edited by: ShipToaster
CCP Guard wrote:
oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:
CCP Guard wrote:
We will be doing a war themed expansion in the first half of this year as stated by CCP Unifex, the new Senior Producer of EVE, in this recent blog. It's not unlikely that Factional Warfare will get some love and tender care along the way.

There are also some important changes to Factional Warfare coming even sooner than that and we are actually making a video in the next days that should cast a light on those, among other things.


well , you could cast some light on other topics as well.


I'm open to suggestions :)


Wardecs and well any other little crumbs of joy you want to throw our way.

(cunningly he camouflaged his sig to lure the unsuspecting prey into the open)

.
Arjola Elongur
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#48 - 2012-01-04 19:45:01 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Stop being dense and twisting words. CCP Guard talking about tender lovemaking love and care to FW was on the topic of the summer expansion. They are iterating and will release more stuff before then, too. So yes, those statements are compatible.

Looking forward to incoming FW improvements!


I was neither dense nor twisting words, but quoting two statements and voicing my concern that there might be some "we could have communicated better (again)" coming.

And you did nothing to show that the two statements I mentioned were compatible.
You merely came up with a third one that suits your expectations.

I guess if someone tells you that oil and water don't go together you quickly reply "water and salt do" and actually believe you proved the other guy wrong.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#49 - 2012-01-04 19:49:58 UTC
Arjola Elongur wrote:
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Stop being dense and twisting words. CCP Guard talking about tender lovemaking love and care to FW was on the topic of the summer expansion. They are iterating and will release more stuff before then, too. So yes, those statements are compatible.

Looking forward to incoming FW improvements!


I was neither dense nor twisting words, but quoting two statements and voicing my concern that there might be some "we could have communicated better (again)" coming.

And you did nothing to show that the two statements I mentioned were compatible.
You merely came up with a third one that suits your expectations.

I guess if someone tells you that oil and water don't go together you quickly reply "water and salt do" and actually believe you proved the other guy wrong.


"Water and salt go together" disproves that an oil/salt mixture won't mix at all with water.

Taken out of context, you are correct that the statements are not compatible, but seeing as how CCP Guard went on to clarify in the same post, there is no sense in pegging him or Hans for inconsistency.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)
Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#50 - 2012-01-04 20:56:00 UTC
It's been one week since you looked at me
Cocked your head to the side
and said I'm angry
Five days since you laughed at me saying
Get that together come back and see me
Three days since the living room,
I realized it's all my fault, but couldn't tell you
Yesterday you'd forgiven me
But it'll still be two days till I say I'm sorry

Hold it now and watch the hoodwink
As I make you stop, think
You'll think you're looking at Aquaman
I summon fish to the dish,
Although I like the Chalet Swiss
I like the sushi
Cause it's never touched a frying pan

Hot like wasabe when I bust rhymes
Big like Leann Rimes
Because I'm all about value
Bert Kaempfert's got the mad hits
You try to match wits
You try to hold me but I bust through

Gonna make a break and take a fake
I'd like a stinkin, achin shake
I like vanilla, It's the finest of the flavors
Gotta see the show,
Cause then you'll know
The Vertigo is gonna grow
Cause it's so dangerous,
You'll have to sign a waiver

How can I help it if I think you're funny when you're mad
Trying hard not to smile though I feel bad
I'm the kind of guy who laughs at a funeral
Can't understand what I mean?
Well, you soon will
I have a tendency to wear my mind on my sleeve
I have a history of taking off my shirt

It's been one week since you looked at me
Threw your arms in the air and said you're crazy
Five days since you tackled me
I've still got the rug burns on both my knees
It's been three days since the afternoon
You realized it's not my fault not a moment too soon
Yesterday you'd forgiven me
And now I sit back and wait till you say you're sorry

Chickity China the Chinese chicken
You have a drumstick and your brain stops tickin'
Watchin X-Files with no lights on,
We're dans la maison
I hope the Smoking Man's in this one
Like Harrison Ford I'm getting Frantic
Like Sting I'm Tantric
Like Snickers, guaranteed to satisfy

Like Kurosawa I make mad films
Okay I don't make films
But if I did they'd have a samurai
Gonna get a set of better clubs
Gonna find the kind with tiny nubs
Just so my irons aren't always flying off the back swing
Gotta get in tune with Sailor Moon
Cause that cartoon has got the boom anime babes
That make me think the wrong thing

How can I help it if I think you're funny when you're mad
Trying hard not to smile though I feel bad
I'm the kind of guy who laughs at a funeral
Can't understand what I mean?
You soon will
I have a tendency to wear my mind on my sleeve
I have a history of losing my shirt

It's been one week since you looked at me
Dropped your arms to your sides and said I'm sorry
Five days since I laughed at you and said
You just did just what I thought you were gonna do
Three days since the living room
We realized we're both to blame, but what could we do?
Yesterday you just smiled at me
Cause it'll still be two days till we say we're sorry

It'll still be two days till we say we're sorry
It'll still be two days till we say we're sorry
Birchmount Stadium, home of the Robbie
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#51 - 2012-01-04 21:03:37 UTC
Arjola Elongur wrote:

Somehow I don't think those two statements are really compatible.


No, but these two are:

CCP Guard wrote:

There are also some important changes to Factional Warfare coming even sooner than that and we are actually making a video in the next days that should cast a light on those, among other things.
(emphasis mine)

Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:

As Guard said, its been well discussed now that CCP is actively working on FW iterations - not just speculating or theorizing, but actually programming stuff.


How could they have a video blog that would shed light on upcoming Faction Warfare changes that are coming out SOONER than summer expansion, if they still don't know whether they are going to be changing up Faction Warfare??

Guard's statement about "not unlikely" was referring to summer expansion, which yes, could very well be up in the air. However, plenty of other CCP execs and the CSM alike have all mentioned that its one of the items at the top of their list for an overhaul with the summer "war" expansion.

The tentative-sounding language is simply PR inoculation against something catastrophic happening that would prevent them from following through with any plans talked about so far. I can't blame them for not wanting to promise anything at this point, and being purposely vague in how much they'll say is definitely coming. As to whether or not FW is on their fix list for summer expansion, I have no doubt about that. Faction Warfare was the first and only specific thing Soundwave mentioned in his interview when he said that the summer expansion would be about iterating upon old, broken systems.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
#52 - 2012-01-04 21:15:34 UTC
WARNING: Niceness Alert! (Bile being shunted to storage ... for now Smile)

In the aftermath of the Incarna debacle they have shown renewed interest in FW and other space stuff.
They did manage to add something in the 10 minutes they had set aside for 'us' in the recent Crutch patch, albeit a tad wide of the mark in my opinion.

Until further data is presented I am willing to give them the benefit of a doubt.
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#53 - 2012-01-04 21:24:50 UTC
Lyrrashae wrote:
Jowen Datloran wrote:
[...]

Those guys are bored out of their skull having nobody to fight in blue, I mean, zero sec.


They shat their beds, why should the rest of us sleep in them?


Because its not their fault. Nullsec dwellers didn't shat their beds, CCP did. Actually, if you want to be really specific, it was all the highsec and lowsec dwellers that cried foul over people being able to make more isk in nullsec than in highsec (which is insane, because things SHOULD be more lucrative the more dangerous space gets).

Thus, all the havens and Sanctums were nerfed to the point where literally you can make the same isk in either highsec or nullsec, essentially removing ANY incentive to live and fight over territory out there at all.

On top of that, the sovereignty system in nullsec has been broken since Dominion, which was a set of overhauls that were quickly abandoned and now are about as arcane and boring and pointless as the Faction Warfare system is.

Really, nullsec and Faction Warfare share a lot of the same predicaments - not enough rewards to encourage warfare, and a boring and/or meaningless system for holding territory. Stagnation has grown in both areas subsequently.

The end result is bored nullsec Alliances encroaching more and more upon highsec and lowsec areas to get kills and have fun, and how can you blame them?

The sooner nullsec is revamped, the better off highsec and lowsec will be as well. These regions are all interconnected. Once the sov system in nullsec is fixed, you'll see a lot less of Pandemic Legion puppy-kicking in Amamake, or the Goon embargo on Oxytopes. Those shenanigans are symptoms of unhealthy and broken gameplay mechanics, not simply "nullsec trash" shatting around.

Lasting improvements to EvE should be approached holistically, and those of us providing feedback will have to shed our stereotypes and prejudices against players who live and play in a different area than our own if we want to be respected and heard.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Xuko Nuki
Heralds of Darkness
White Sky.
#54 - 2012-01-04 21:38:03 UTC
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
[quote=Lyrrashae]

Actually, if you want to be really specific, it was all the highsec and lowsec dwellers that cried foul over people being able to make more isk in nullsec than in highsec



Implying there are human beings in 0.0

I don't know why large alliances need to farm more ISK with their vast, hidden bot networks. They already have moons and if you don't see any of the profit then maybe you're living the peasant life under a feudal lord and should speak with your union rep.
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#55 - 2012-01-04 23:38:54 UTC
Xuko Nuki wrote:

Implying there are human beings in 0.0

I don't know why large alliances need to farm more ISK with their vast, hidden bot networks. They already have moons and if you don't see any of the profit then maybe you're living the peasant life under a feudal lord and should speak with your union rep.



Moons are an even worse form of income than botting, they are essentially endless oil wells and are akin to Tech 2 BPO's in terms of overall lameness. Even the Mittani himself says moon goo is bullshit and should be eliminated.

The whole point of Dominion was to allow Alliances to entice people to move to nullsec by upgrading the value of the space - through means that have nothing to do with moons. If your average player wants to live in nullsec there has to be more for them to do than find an empty moon to put a POS up at.

Once the work that got started in Dominion was thwarted by the sanctum nerfs, there just was little left after that to entice people to go out there, or for them to fight over the territory they already had. The pain of dreadnoughting sov structures (thing POS shoots but even more boring) far outweighs any benefit of having the space. This is borked and needs to be fixed.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Draco Rosso
State War Academy
Caldari State
#56 - 2012-01-05 14:45:43 UTC
We changes to FW now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Mentorm
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#57 - 2012-01-05 15:07:05 UTC
286 days and...

Alliances can join FW...
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#58 - 2012-01-05 15:26:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Indahmawar Fazmarai
CCP Guard wrote:
Gilbaron wrote:
just give a clear statement about the future of WiS


We can't really give a clear statement on the future of WiS because at this time because we have no updated plan, and only have some ideas rolling around.

WiS is not our top priority for us at the moment at least, while we re-organize everything and sort out some other things, but as soon as we know more, you'll know more (or you know...really soon after as it always takes a little bit of time to write dev blogs and stuff).


Woah, has taken long, huh? Can you say something like this in the abandoned WiS thread?

Would be nice to get some interlocutors (a couple devs?) to listen to and discuss with us what do we want for WiS, while everybody else buzzes around fixing FiS and making life even more miserable to hiseccers, soloers, casuals and the rest of uncool players.What?
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#59 - 2012-01-05 15:35:47 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:


Woah, has taken long, huh? Can you say something like this in the abandoned WiS thread?

Would be nice to get some interlocutors (a couple devs?) to listen to and discuss with us what do we want for WiS, while everybody else buzzes around fixing FiS and making life even more miserable to hiseccers, soloers, casuals and the rest of uncool players.What?


Why are you flying a spaceship game to walk in a station? Also, FIS gets work done on it because: CCP knows how to do it; It was here first and thus gets to be iterated on first; It's the focus of the game. I'm not even going to dignify the idea that CCP has been anything but kind to Hisec, Casual players (*cough*Incursions). As for solo, remind me what the two Ms in MMO stand for.

If you want Eve without other people, Elite is probably better. In fact, Elite + IRC Client probably gives EVE a halfway decent run for it's money Idea

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
CeneUJiti
Doomheim
#60 - 2012-01-05 15:37:08 UTC
1st
This is not WiS thread

2nd
Anyone who argues for WiS argues for microtransactions and death of EVE. Or is a clever troll. There is no middle ground here; whatever ideas about WiS CCP from 2007 had; CCP from 2012 is not that CCP.