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Setting up a Research POS
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Tralminia
All Good CO2 Inc.
#1 - 2015-09-26 22:06:08 UTC
I need some help about setting up POS in hi-sec, cause I never did it before.

Currently I research low tier BPOs in hi-sec stations, and I'm limited to 10 jobs, due to my skills, though I belive the max I can get is 11 jobs

My idea is to set up a research POS in hi-sec. Please help me out:

- From what I read, in a POS, I won't be limited to my 10 jobs, but instead I'll be paying more for each research job, or am I mistaken?

- What do I need for a research POS. A corporate hangar and Reseach lab is enough?

- If I get wardeced and my POS reinforced, can I still remove my BPOs fom inside?

- What's a good tool to project a POS (kind alike EFT) and it's expenses.

Any other tips people might suggest, I'd appreciate!

Thks!
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2015-09-26 22:50:41 UTC
The 10 jobs is a character limit, imposed by your skills. It has no relation to where you research.

Probably best just to research in station these days. With the station research slots gone, there's no longer a compelling reason to have a POS for research, except maybe the improved speed, and you have to be turning a lot of BPOs over in a month to really benefit from that improved speed.
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
#3 - 2015-09-27 09:26:32 UTC
A POS is usually not economically viable nowadays for industry use in high sec unless you are doing jobs 24/7 and it becomes a second job. Just look at office charges at NPC stations which are usually needed to run POSes - they use to be in the millions of ISK per month but are now in the tens of thousands. POSes in high sec are mostly now used either to compress ore/act as mining support, or to enable ganking of freighters by small numbers of pilots.

In short using NPC stations with the lowest tax rates will be your best option. In addition it is the safest option as well.

" They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. " Rick. " Find out what ? " Abraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. " Rick. Season four.   ' The Walking Dead. ' .
Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#4 - 2015-09-27 09:27:35 UTC
Research lab at a POS will give you a 30% bonus to time required for ME/TE research compared to a station. It will not give you any additional slots.

Plan to cancel jobs, take the POS down and store it in a station if you are wardecced. Otherwise, let CONCORD defend it for you. You have 24 hours to save your stuff from the time was is declared until fighting begins. If the POS is reinforced you will not be able to access the lab (or any module that uses CPU).

If you have several ALTS using the POS and are also using it for invention and copying, it might make sense but, for 1 character, it isn't cost effective.
Tralminia
All Good CO2 Inc.
#5 - 2015-09-27 14:31:07 UTC
Thks for the replies fellas!

I did not about the reinforced mechanics, so, ok, 24 hours to bring all down or might as well count it as lost. Too bad about jobs still being a hard limit
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2015-09-27 14:58:07 UTC
Seriously if it's just you (one char) using it, it's not worth it. A small POS costs around 100 mil a month. Unless you're making over 100 mil *extra* profit because of using the POS, it's a net loss
warren Arzi
LoGisTicAl ERr0R
#7 - 2015-09-27 15:52:47 UTC
Train a couple more characters to research on the same account
Tralminia
All Good CO2 Inc.
#8 - 2015-09-27 23:27:02 UTC
I actually have 4 toons doing research of low tier BPOs. The bottleneck is indeed not the research, but selling all that stuff in contracts, so I don't really know if I need to research faster for low tier stuff.

Idea was to use the POS to research more lenghty BPOs like Cruisers ot BCs, because -35/40 % depending on POS structure and implants, would be very nice boost.

Still, a POS is indeed 150mil per month and I'm completely dark when it comes to jobs costs in a POS... Is there any site where I can check the cost of a job I set up in a POS?
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
Goonswarm Federation
#9 - 2015-09-28 01:05:30 UTC
I still use a hisec POS for my blueprint research, inventing, and copying. My bottleneck is improvement time on large-item blueprints, and I have three high-skill managing the POS research lines.
I've had this running for several years and have never had a wardec problem.
I do not know about relative job-costs but understand my POS to be faster for all the non-manufacturing jobs. I do my hisec and nullsec manufacturing in stations / outposts.

The POS has risks (e.g. wardec and missing a refueling schedule) but it does do things quicker, so I'm planning to keep on using it for the time being.

I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2015-09-28 07:56:10 UTC
Tralminia wrote:
Still, a POS is indeed 150mil per month and I'm completely dark when it comes to jobs costs in a POS... Is there any site where I can check the cost of a job I set up in a POS?



Job costs in a POS follow the same formula as job costs in a station, you just don't get the 10% NPC tax.
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/the-price-of-change/ (don't think they've changed it since this dev blog, other than removing teams)
Hochopepa
Creative Research and Production Services
#11 - 2015-09-28 15:46:23 UTC
If you have several characters able to do the research, you can easily setup a small pos or any size for that matter. The only things you need are:

A) Pos size you want
B) Research Lab
C) Design Lab (if you make copies)
D) Hangar array (can be useful, not necessary for research)
E) Strontium bay filled (important if you do get wardec'd, buys time)
F) Weapons (some will argue not to worry, but I find that you will not use all the power and CPU and it's far better to have and not need than to not have at all.
G) Starbase Charters (cheap to buy from agents
H) Fuel (preferably 30 days at a time)





The important things I would like to point out here:

No matter what anyone else says, equip your pos with defenses, and vary them by range and types. This provides not only defense if you are dec'd, but also provides a massive disincentive to those who would want to dec you to knock off your pos.
You want to be able to do upclose damage as well as be able to reach out to the 250KM mark to stop snipers.

  • Caldari - Torps, cruise, EW, scrams, webs
  • Gallente - (sm/md/lg)Rails/Blasters, EW, scrams, webs
  • Minmatar - (sm/md/lg) Autocannons/Artillery, EW, scrams, webs
  • Amarr - (sm/md/lg) Beams/Pulse Lasers, EW, scrams, webs
  • FILL THE AMMO BAYS UP



If you need any help with tips and setup, let me know in game with PM or joing channel PCGLLC
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#12 - 2015-09-28 19:34:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Hochopepa wrote:
The important things I would like to point out here:

No matter what anyone else says, equip your pos with defenses, and vary them by range and types. This provides not only defense if you are dec'd, but also provides a massive disincentive to those who would want to dec you to knock off your pos.
You want to be able to do upclose damage as well as be able to reach out to the 250KM mark to stop snipers.

  • Caldari - Torps, cruise, EW, scrams, webs
  • Gallente - (sm/md/lg)Rails/Blasters, EW, scrams, webs
  • Minmatar - (sm/md/lg) Autocannons/Artillery, EW, scrams, webs
  • Amarr - (sm/md/lg) Beams/Pulse Lasers, EW, scrams, webs
  • FILL THE AMMO BAYS UP


If you need any help with tips and setup, let me know in game with PM or joing channel PCGLLC

If you are using a small POS -- that's all I'd recommend for hisec these days, unless your corp gets a lot of wardecs -- there is no need, nor fitting room for defenses.

Otherwise:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4952242#post4952242

EDIT: Note that resists displayed on the tower are a lie. They don't take into account stacking penalty, which is applied. So don't bother using more than 3 hardeners on a single resist.
Tralminia
All Good CO2 Inc.
#13 - 2015-09-28 21:44:36 UTC
Thks for the info on POS, I truly never used one.


Also I noticed something that might be a bug or me doing something wrong. I ask for a researched blueprint to be "outputed" to a different corp subdivision, but they don't go there...

What am I missing?
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
Goonswarm Federation
#14 - 2015-10-01 02:11:08 UTC
I am not in a position to test it right now (oog) but my understanding is that -
1. For manufacturing jobs: The source BPO or BPC returns to where it started out (Perhaps to prevent people from stealing BPOs by outputting them to a different room); Unused and partly used components (minerals RAMs etc) stay where they started; the product item can be delivered to any room or container accessible to the user.
2. For research jobs: The source BPO returns to where it started out.
3. For copying jobs: The source BPO returns to where it started out; The copies can be delivered to any room or container accessible to the user.
4. For inventing jobs: The source BPC returns to where it started out; Unused and partly used components stay where they started; the product T2 BPC can be delivered to any room or container accessible to the user.
If a destination container is not large enough for the product item then the job fails to deliver. Repackaging the container allows the job then to deliver to the room that the container was within.

I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.
Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries
#15 - 2015-10-01 08:34:50 UTC
Substantia Nigra wrote:

If a destination container is not large enough for the product item then the job fails to deliver. Repackaging the container allows the job then to deliver to the room that the container was within.

That last one is important to remember.
It had me stumped some time ago when I forgot to change 'output' and tried to deliver a ship into a small container ;)

CCP Greyscale: As to starbases, we agree it's pretty terrible, but we don't want to delay the entire release just for this one factor.
Hochopepa
Creative Research and Production Services
#16 - 2015-10-01 16:52:04 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Hochopepa wrote:
The important things I would like to point out here:

No matter what anyone else says, equip your pos with defenses, and vary them by range and types. This provides not only defense if you are dec'd, but also provides a massive disincentive to those who would want to dec you to knock off your pos.
You want to be able to do upclose damage as well as be able to reach out to the 250KM mark to stop snipers.

  • Caldari - Torps, cruise, EW, scrams, webs
  • Gallente - (sm/md/lg)Rails/Blasters, EW, scrams, webs
  • Minmatar - (sm/md/lg) Autocannons/Artillery, EW, scrams, webs
  • Amarr - (sm/md/lg) Beams/Pulse Lasers, EW, scrams, webs
  • FILL THE AMMO BAYS UP


If you need any help with tips and setup, let me know in game with PM or joing channel PCGLLC

If you are using a small POS -- that's all I'd recommend these days, unless your corp gets a lot of wardecs -- there is no need, nor fitting room for defenses.

Otherwise:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4952242#post4952242

EDIT: Note that resists displayed on the tower are a lie. They don't take into account stacking penalty, which is applied. So don't bother using more than 3 hardeners on a single resist.


I agree on 3 hardeners, I do not, however agree with the weapons decision. Regardless of whether you get a lot of war decs, if your pos is not armed, you WILL get decs because griefers will want to take it down and capture your goodies. A properly armed POS is more of a deterrant to would be attackers.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#17 - 2015-10-01 19:53:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Hochopepa wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
If you are using a small POS -- that's all I'd recommend these days, unless your corp gets a lot of wardecs -- there is no need, nor fitting room for defenses.

Otherwise:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4952242#post4952242

EDIT: Note that resists displayed on the tower are a lie. They don't take into account stacking penalty, which is applied. So don't bother using more than 3 hardeners on a single resist.

I agree on 3 hardeners, I do not, however agree with the weapons decision. Regardless of whether you get a lot of war decs, if your pos is not armed, you WILL get decs because griefers will want to take it down and capture your goodies. A properly armed POS is more of a deterrant to would be attackers.

I challenge you to produce a defensive weapons fitting for a small tower that isn't just decorative.

They just don't have enough power grid available.

Hence I only recommend defenses on medium and large towers ... which I don't recommend unless you are manufacturing a lot (otherwise just offline the lab to online assembly array).
Hochopepa
Creative Research and Production Services
#18 - 2015-10-02 13:21:38 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Hochopepa wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
If you are using a small POS -- that's all I'd recommend these days, unless your corp gets a lot of wardecs -- there is no need, nor fitting room for defenses.

Otherwise:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4952242#post4952242

EDIT: Note that resists displayed on the tower are a lie. They don't take into account stacking penalty, which is applied. So don't bother using more than 3 hardeners on a single resist.

I agree on 3 hardeners, I do not, however agree with the weapons decision. Regardless of whether you get a lot of war decs, if your pos is not armed, you WILL get decs because griefers will want to take it down and capture your goodies. A properly armed POS is more of a deterrant to would be attackers.

I challenge you to produce a defensive weapons fitting for a small tower that isn't just decorative.

They just don't have enough power grid available.

Hence I only recommend defenses on medium and large towers ... which I don't recommend unless you are manufacturing a lot (otherwise just offline the lab to online assembly array).



Sure, for a small tower I agree, and it's all you need if you are only doing a little bit of research. I, however, like to have the ability to do whatever I like with my POS without having to deal with offlining/onlining or even having to upgrade to a larger POS.

If you are doing just a small POS, you're screwed and you will never have enough defenses on it, regardless of what type you use. At best, you can annoy your attackers with some ECM, but they are just going to get in there with smartbombs and take out the ECM anyhow.