Warfare & Tactics

Maybe I exaggerated by making it seem plural, but RvB is an alternative. Most newer players end up making highsec their primary area of operations by sticking to missions, jumping into a perpetual war only a few jumps out of the most popular trade hub seems natural. The only thing FW has over it seems to be that's mechanically easier to become a member of a militia thanks to the dedicated UI.

The misrepresentation is that by joining FW you are signing up to a mechanic which lets you PvP and earn wealth, both inclusive in one form of activity. The reality is that they are exclusive and two separate forms of activities. You don't find this counterproductive if as you say the primary reason to join FW is to PvP? I suppose the problem is difficult to perceive for well established players with countless assets at their disposal.

To elaborate, plexing isn't one form of activity. Sitting in one is a preamble, an opportunity to get a fight. Capturing it is the method of by which you fatten your wallet. For most players, it boils down to doing one or the other. It's not about having a simple life, but about optimising.You end up with people who want to PvP, join FW, and instead find themselves more focused on building financial capital that they can then burn on care free PvP. Of course then the parallel can be drawn to RvB, where you grind first and PvP later. If you find that OK that is...
Cakes are meant to be eaten. I want to have the cake and eat it too and I don't see why that shouldn't be a thing in FW.
Why should the bolded part even be a dilemma for FW participants, that's the point I'm trying to convey.
And why can it not be addressed with mechanics? Sounds like large leap in logic based on previous lack of spontaneous 10/10 ideas. We'll get there someday...I do not see how this relates to the potential of people being less averse to losing a plex fight and an actual PvP encounter (not a system wide conflict), on the simple premise that the value of each individual plex and the time invested would be much lower. You stand less to lose, in contrast to spontaneously devaluing the last X minutes you sat orbiting the beacon. Note I'm not talking about the first 2-3 minutes.

BTW I think Thanatos Marathon hit many of the quick fixes for new players.

One point I would make though is that instead of removing t3ds from smalls, I think making a rookie plex that only allows vanilla t1 frigates might be better.

The t3d is definitely the most powerful ship that can go in a small. It used to be assault ships were. But I do think it is closer in power to other destroyers and assault ships (smalls) rather than HACs and pirate cruisers(mediums).

At least there are 4 decent t3ds that have decent parity. Novices would be better if they buffed the pirate faction ships beside the Garmurs and worms. (or nerf those 2)

If I remember correctly my tax rate was about 1 ship per 5 plexes

They would if they knew what was best for them.

Also the ability to donate/contract/sell LP to other players because for new players without neutral alt, and not much liquid isk it's nearly as hard to liquidate lp as it is to earn it. I don't think anyone would miss the hassle of cashing out lp, most would be happy to sell it at a discount to a trader to get the isk.

The best way to balance fw missions is to delete them.

and this: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=447801&find=unread

The lp market crashed because CCP was and is very slow to tweak the faction war lp faucets. You are right that fw missions are a huge part of that faucet. But I do not think they should be deleted just have the level 4 mission amounts toned down.

I thought many corps are already offering an lp buy back plan for their players. And many corps already would help with logistics for new players. Although being able to give lp to another player or corp would be nice, I am not sure how taxing lp helps new players.

Legacy Code. Not happening anytime soon.

- Than

LP is legacy code? Care to provide a source on that claim?

How about civilian plexes for rookie ships only.

10mins capture time, 500LP in t1, and no effect on system control.

Came back from the dead so I could chime in my ten cents. Biggest problems I see (or saw) from new players is:

1) got killed in high sec at the nearest militia station to respective faction trade hub. 9 times out of 10 off the undock. Changes have been proposed. I would like to add that I access a murder nest of Norv./isho. for a few quick modules/rigs here and there. I will be sad to lose access to an enemy station in such cases.

2) awoxers. Best plan was to shift default overview tags to bump friendly associations higher than criminal status', imo. When awoxing occurs to the unsuspecting allied faction pilot, the heavy standings consequence for ally aggression seems like the best bet also.

3)isk generation in lowsec. Many new recruits have trouble understanding how to convert LP once they have it, or where, which leads them, naturally, to the closest 'safest' militia station, where much butthurt ensues as they attempt to undock with their new goodies. PI is actually very lucrative within lowsec and can generate enough for a single account to fly t1 frig-cruiser in a haphazard way. DED/anoms get cleared by proficient EU time zone minorities, in most cases. FW LP plexing is not so bad. FW missions...

4)FW missions have been the greatest flaw and boon. An expansive article can be made on its effects on tier swing, its manipulation for market scarcity price modulation for relevant navy ships/modules. The ships mostly responsible are stealth bombers, who, much like yore Entosis link interceptors of null, can exploit the system while doing so in a very proficient and safer way. Restrict t2&t3 from entering these missions and this will end with a horrible gasp. No need for reward calculation changes or added npc's/sentry turrets. Every faction can use its own respective navy cruiser to complete these solo, if uninterrupted. :) The payout is worth that risk. It is very high. It ultimately affects the poorest when their bread and butter LP items are devalued.

Lots of great ideas. It's is wonderful to see so many folks with a vested interest in making FW a better place in EVE. I can only add my perspective based on my experiences. FW is the reason I got back into EVE after a 4-year break and why I stay in EVE . Keeping it healthy is trough these ideas mentioned is great.

It would be nice if there was a capability for each NPC corp to have rotation assignments where veterans can take a month (or some other arbitrary time frame) and be on assignment to an NPC corp with the goal of teaching the newbros a specific skill in FW. This could include basics such as fitting a proper PvP ship, fleet mechanics and roles, tackling, etc. Eve-UNI does this for the general population but a capability for each faction to be able to do that would be great.

Make it so Missions need to be run in a PvP ship. Not sure how exactly to make that happen but the recent Blood Raider sites could probably form a good starting point.

I don't really see an issues with Garmurs and Worms. Yes, they are somewhat OP, but they are easily countered if you know what you are doing. T3D's are similar to Garmurs and Worms in that they are somewhat OP but easily countered in my opinion. For the newbros that counter primarily consists of forming a small fleet and using sheer numbers to overtake them. To that end forming fleets of noobs should be made easier. Perhaps that could be a part of the NPC corp thing where visiting FC's help the new bros go out and kill shinies.

The standing hit and suspect timer that you get to shooting a neutral that enters your plex is very annoying and very damaging to a new person getting into the spirit of FW. I am strongly of the opinion that entering a plex gives you a suspect timer unless in FW

I also don't see too much of an issue with the current state of high sec hunting except perhaps the distracting the Navy thing. Never done that so not sure how it works but the escalating effects on higher security systems works well enough that it can be a fairly risky proposition to camp.

Not going to address OGB's since that topic induces vomiting all over the forums and has been covered ad naseum.

+ most of what was already said.

Burt