These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Assembly Hall

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

[Proposal] Rebalance tag distribution in anti-faction missions

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#1 - 2015-09-17 18:59:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Bumblefck
Anti-Amarr missions from Gallente agents? No thanks, that doesn't make any sense (either logically or from an *shudder* RP perspective). I'm sure the other anti-faction missions bear scant resemblance to how things should be distributed.


While I'm not sure of CCP's original reasoning behind this - perhaps so as to not make LP store items incredibly easily accessible - it really doesn't make sense, especially after regular missions have been subject to a load of rebalancing in a hundred different areas. People can just pop down to Jita and throw up buy orders for the tags required.

Is there really any reason why the enemies presented in an anti-faction mission shouldn't reflect the actual enemies of the agent who gave you the mission? The downside of doing these missions has always been and will always be the trashing of your standings - a fair price to pay.


I suggested this years ago and I'm sure it crops up occasionally, but let's do this FTW!



E: argh! Hoisted by my own petard! I have reported it, don't worry M&Cers - it'll be gone soon Big smile

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#2 - 2015-09-17 21:32:52 UTC
the amarr and gallente don't exactly like each other. I'm not sure if it makes sense or not from the lore. That said as far as I'm aware the main way for minmatar tags to enter the game is enemies abound 5/5 which requires 3 fight gallente missions first. I'm not sure what the drops in FW are like, but I'm not sure too many people are killing all and looting in those missions. Same with level 5s. Sounds like most people are focused on blitzing those style missions.

That said the tag drops could use a bit of a rebalance as some you can buy for blow npc price, and others cost 10 times npc price because of the drop ratio. For instance enemies abound drops the battleship sized tags at a ratio of 14:41 A popular item such as the CN BCU BPC requires 49:74

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#3 - 2015-09-17 21:38:20 UTC
Yeah, that's the thing - Amarr and Gallente aren't buddy buddies, but the Gal LP stores demand Caldari tags vOv

Anyway, you're absolutely right about the massively disproportionate ratio of BS-to-other tags dropped - that at least needs a seeing-to :)

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Paranoid Loyd
#4 - 2015-09-17 22:09:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Paranoid Loyd
Fairly certain this is by design to create a reason for asset movement as well as create market price diversity, at least in theory.

Wanna cash in those tags? Move them to ammar space and risk getting them taken away if you do it foolishly.

To lazy or scared to move them and want instant isk? Sell them for under market value at your local trade hub allowing a trader to move them or resell them for profit.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#5 - 2015-09-17 22:28:48 UTC
Thread has been moved to Assembly Hall.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2015-09-17 23:57:58 UTC
Well, I haven't done Anti-Empire Encounter missions for a very long time so I could be wrong but if I recall correctly, I believe Gallente offer encounter missions against both Amarr and Caldari, basically it's like 'My allies enemy is my enemy too'.

I don't really see a problem with that. Hell, it's probably the same with all the other Empire Factions as well. However I do believe the amount of tags being dropped in those missions should be buffed and the amount of Tags required to purchase items in LP Stores should be nerfed.



DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#7 - 2015-09-18 03:27:40 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
the amarr and gallente don't exactly like each other. I'm not sure if it makes sense or not from the lore. That said as far as I'm aware the main way for minmatar tags to enter the game is enemies abound 5/5 which requires 3 fight gallente missions first. I'm not sure what the drops in FW are like, but I'm not sure too many people are killing all and looting in those missions. Same with level 5s. Sounds like most people are focused on blitzing those style missions.

That said the tag drops could use a bit of a rebalance as some you can buy for blow npc price, and others cost 10 times npc price because of the drop ratio. For instance enemies abound drops the battleship sized tags at a ratio of 14:41 A popular item such as the CN BCU BPC requires 49:74


Before they changed the FW plex capture mechanics circa 3 years ago (maybe 4), you could farm faction tags by staying out of capture range and killing the faction rat spawns.
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#8 - 2015-09-18 15:42:20 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Well, I haven't done Anti-Empire Encounter missions for a very long time so I could be wrong but if I recall correctly, I believe Gallente offer encounter missions against both Amarr and Caldari, basically it's like 'My allies enemy is my enemy too'.

I don't really see a problem with that. Hell, it's probably the same with all the other Empire Factions as well. However I do believe the amount of tags being dropped in those missions should be buffed and the amount of Tags required to purchase items in LP Stores should be nerfed.



DMC



Good point, however, looking at the list of anti-empire missions offered in Gallente space (my memory is failing so please excuse any omissions!):

- In the Midst (Amarr with a tiny Caldari contingent)
- Surprise Surprise (Amarr with a small Caldari contingent)
- Pot and Kettle (Amarr)
- Smash the Supplier (Amarr)

they seem to be primarily anti-Amarr. Logic would dictate that the Federation's second-tier enemies would appear in a secondary capacity, not primary.

Anyway, good points made by all :)

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
sero Hita
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#9 - 2015-09-24 07:15:39 UTC  |  Edited by: sero Hita
Bumblefck wrote:


Good point, however, looking at the list of anti-empire missions offered in Gallente space (my memory is failing so please excuse any omissions!):

- In the Midst (Amarr with a tiny Caldari contingent)
- Surprise Surprise (Amarr with a small Caldari contingent)
- Pot and Kettle (Amarr)
- Smash the Supplier (Amarr)

they seem to be primarily anti-Amarr. Logic would dictate that the Federation's second-tier enemies would appear in a secondary capacity, not primary.

Anyway, good points made by all :)


I think it is just fine. The confusing term here seems to be Ally :D When enlisting to faction warfare for Gallente you are also in war with Amarr (meaning caldari and Amarr are in war against Gallente and Minmatar). I think it is fine and reasonable that for example Gallente wants to throw some rocks in the machine of their enemies(Amarr and Caldari) by getting capsuleers to harass them even in non fw missions. Amarr is still an enemy even if they are not the arch enemy. In the second world war people were not like " we won't attack the ally Japan, because Germany is the main enemy".

What would be weird is if you got anti-minmatar missions as gallente, but you don't.

Another thing is that you can even bypass this by cancelling one mission per 4 hrs. If this is too much waiting for you, just live with the standings hit or get another career like exploration, where you hurt no one. This is a non-issue for me tbh.

"I'm all for pvp, don't get me wrong. I've ganked in Empire, blobed in low sec. Got T-shirts from every which-where.. But to be forced into a pvp confrontation that I didn't want is wrong ccp." RealFlisker
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#10 - 2015-09-24 15:22:22 UTC
In terms of lore and RP, however, the *direct* enemies are Gallente and Caldari, and Amarr and Minmatar. There are also the secondary enemies, but most of the in-game lore is centred around the conflicts between the primary ones.

Yes, I am aware of bypassing missions, but that's not what I'm looking for at all - in fact, I love anti-faction missions and grab them wherever I can (EA is my personal favourite :) ). Also, the suggestion of taking up another career is a complete non-sequitur, as there is an imbalance with LP tag requirements (particularly of the Captain or equivalent rank tags) and the actual distribution of said tags.

A proposal like this would go some way to rationalising things.

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
The Asteroid
Fuel Blocks for Dante
#11 - 2015-10-04 23:26:37 UTC  |  Edited by: The Asteroid
I think that the "anti-faction" missions should be more frequent in high-sec. I mean how are all of these supposed pirates safely setting up shop? Maybe shift the "kill pirate" missions to low sec, where there is less concord?