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Making Wormholes easier to Probe.
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Adarnof
Kingsparrow Wormhole Division
Birds of Prey.
#61 - 2015-09-16 17:05:25 UTC
Scanning is already too easy. If it's taking you "too long" to do it, you need to be more efficient.

A combination of proper probe formation, understanding strength bands, and 8AU sweeps can clean the garbage out of the system in a real hurry.

Stop catering to the lowest common denominator and let those who excel at scanning shine.
smokeAjoint
Catch And Release Privateering
#62 - 2015-09-16 17:05:28 UTC
-1

** legalize it**
Sundial Hakaari
Leshak Bros. Wrecking and Towing Inc.
#63 - 2015-09-16 17:15:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Sundial Hakaari
Its not currently hard to quickly assess which sigs are holes and which aren't if you are half decent at scanning. With max scanning skills (which you should have if want to most effectively get content in wormholes) it's close to trivial already.

I doubt this will result in more people utilizing wormholes, rather it will result in the same people using them having to do less work for their content.

Don't further trivialize an important role in wormhole space and what makes wormhole space unique itself...
Aanilye
The S-Parameter Impedance Matrix
#64 - 2015-09-16 17:21:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Aanilye
+1.

I love scanning....sincerely, i do. There's something soothing in it for me. Usually a 4AU around each planet will tell you what's what. It isn't particularly hard to get the WHs with 4s in all scanning skill and your typical cruiser. I enjoy mapping our static chain after a long day at work, and while i will occasionally scan all signatures for potential future ganks later, moving quickly through a chain can only be an asset.

Those times when you open a system with 15+ anomalies can drag on, especially if you're just looking for potential targets. Of course, sometimes there's 3 sigs...


As a lifelong wormhole resident (only 3 years but still), I see finding WHs (but whs only) faster as a significant improvement and QOL change. If i'm scanning a chain of 20 holes during a play session on a regular evening, a difference of maybe a minute in low sig count holes to several could make a huge difference for a seasoned player.

For a new resident, it may mean the difference between staying and going back to kspace.
Shagmar Gera
Gang of 4
#65 - 2015-09-16 17:26:52 UTC
+1

This would be a good QOL change for wormholers. Scanning down holes faster usually doesn't have a large influence on pvp, so this would just be nice for those of us that have to scan to find content.

A small buff like this after losing so many null connections in the last wh nerf would be nice.

Also we're open to getting more nulls back in c5's Big smile

And please decrease the amount of frigate holes while you're at it, or just change half of them to regular connections. Shocked
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#66 - 2015-09-16 17:28:28 UTC
Winthorp wrote:
Montgomery Black wrote:
GizzyBoy wrote:
Montgomery Black wrote:
Endorsed.

To many empty WH systems currently. A way to scan down WH chains more quickly to find content would be awesome.



Easier scanning will not populate wh's



No but it will make it quicker to scan that unpopulated wormhole and the next one til you find find a active wormhole that has ships in it to kill. .


Exactly this.

Do you ever wonder how much time you waste or potential targets you never see or even enter their home because you just spent 40mins in a massive chain finding and ignoring PVE sigs?

Are we lazy for asking this? Probably 5% but the other 95% sick of just wasting our ******* time night after night on unnecessary ****.


You won't really find more target. You will just get bored after going 15 holes deep instead of 10 because each takes less time to find among the clutter.
Thron Legacy
White Zulu
Scorpion Federation
#67 - 2015-09-16 18:39:31 UTC
wormholes are already the easiest sigs to scan
Lakshata Chawla
State War Academy
Caldari State
#68 - 2015-09-16 18:40:56 UTC
Really like this idea, would be great if wormholes were easily to distinguish from all other sigs, and it doesn't make sense that different wormholes are different signature sizes.
Athanor Ruthoern
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#69 - 2015-09-16 18:51:47 UTC
Thron Legacy wrote:
wormholes are already the easiest sigs to scan

nope
muhadin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#70 - 2015-09-16 19:18:02 UTC  |  Edited by: muhadin
Donnachadh wrote:
I don't care either way on the OP so just some observations.

Do you really think that scanning the entrances is even part of the things that keeps players out of WH?
In my experience the scanning portion is more of a hassle to the vet WH dwellers than it is to the newer players looking to move into WH life.

Living / playing in a WH is a game play style just like low and nul. And just like low and nul that game play style does not appeal to very many people, to change that you will have to change the game play style in significant ways that you WH players will not like.
So the real question becomes are you willing to support the changes that will really make a difference to the amount of players that venture into WH?


This is the interesting part, this is all going to change when citadels come out, the style of living in wspace is going to completely change. We are going to have a market, our own personal hangars and possible much more.

Also thank you to everyone who has responded.

"Love the Life you Live, Live the Life you Love"
Thron Legacy
White Zulu
Scorpion Federation
#71 - 2015-09-16 19:22:01 UTC
Athanor Ruthoern wrote:
Thron Legacy wrote:
wormholes are already the easiest sigs to scan

nope

then which one is easier?
well it certainly is the easiest sig to scan in a wh
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#72 - 2015-09-16 19:27:19 UTC
In K-space it can wildly vary, at least in my experience. There are some WHs (even high class ones) where I know that it's a WH with a 4 AU probe, and then there are some WHs (for some reason low class ones to c2/3 space) that are very hard to scan down, comparably hard to 8/10s).

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#73 - 2015-09-16 20:20:23 UTC
K162 whs are the easiest sigs to scan already, for out going whs it varies based on what kind it is.

PS: it should probably be added at this point that if you just use the default probe layouts, you really don't get a vote on this.

There is no Bob.

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Krops Vont
#74 - 2015-09-16 20:28:43 UTC
Athanor Ruthoern wrote:
The reaction from people is most interesting. When I suggested soemthing simalar of this half a year agoe I was meet with people cursing me and the idear. The same attitude has been in wormhole space the last min 4 years. Do not change anything. no easy mode. Change is bad. Wormholes aare only for pro players. I am happy to see people gotten a change of heart.

I support this idear Big smile


The lower the whole activity of new eden or anoikis leads to deprived players. Sometimes tedium needs to be adjusted to the amount of effort expended for a goal or reward.

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Iain Cariaba
#75 - 2015-09-16 21:27:01 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
K162 whs are the easiest sigs to scan already, for out going whs it varies based on what kind it is.

PS: it should probably be added at this point that if you just use the default probe layouts, you really don't get a vote on this.

Using default probe layout I find wormholes absurdedly easy to probe down. Using covops frig, sister's expanded launcher, sister's core probes, and all scanning skills at 3, I know it's a wormhole on an 8au scan, and have warp in on 2au scan. Scanning wormholes doesn't need to be made easier, proponents of this idea simply need to become less bad at it.
muhadin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#76 - 2015-09-16 21:30:19 UTC
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
K162 whs are the easiest sigs to scan already, for out going whs it varies based on what kind it is.

PS: it should probably be added at this point that if you just use the default probe layouts, you really don't get a vote on this.

Using default probe layout I find wormholes absurdedly easy to probe down. Using covops frig, sister's expanded launcher, sister's core probes, and all scanning skills at 3, I know it's a wormhole on an 8au scan, and have warp in on 2au scan. Scanning wormholes doesn't need to be made easier, proponents of this idea simply need to become less bad at it.


Not all wormholes are the same, some are much more difficult to find in ways that don't make any sense.

"Love the Life you Live, Live the Life you Love"
Max Kolonko
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#77 - 2015-09-16 21:35:20 UTC
Thron Legacy wrote:
Athanor Ruthoern wrote:
Thron Legacy wrote:
wormholes are already the easiest sigs to scan

nope

then which one is easier?
well it certainly is the easiest sig to scan in a wh


nope and yes at the same time

While K162 and Cx->Cx holes are easy to find, stuff like Cx -> Cx+/-3 or 4 are one of the most hard signatures to scan

To explain my wierd notation above: C6->C6 is as easy to scan as K162, but C6->C1 is as hard as best magneto/radar site (sorry - relic and data site)

Read and support: Don't mess with OUR WH's What is Your stance on WH stuff?
Max Kolonko
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#78 - 2015-09-16 21:38:59 UTC
muhadin wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
K162 whs are the easiest sigs to scan already, for out going whs it varies based on what kind it is.

PS: it should probably be added at this point that if you just use the default probe layouts, you really don't get a vote on this.

Using default probe layout I find wormholes absurdedly easy to probe down. Using covops frig, sister's expanded launcher, sister's core probes, and all scanning skills at 3, I know it's a wormhole on an 8au scan, and have warp in on 2au scan. Scanning wormholes doesn't need to be made easier, proponents of this idea simply need to become less bad at it.


Not all wormholes are the same, some are much more difficult to find in ways that don't make any sense.


Still, learn to use more efficient probe layouts andscan entire system much faster, including the hard to get signals - learn to eve instead of dumbing it down.

Read and support: Don't mess with OUR WH's What is Your stance on WH stuff?
muhadin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#79 - 2015-09-16 21:42:03 UTC  |  Edited by: muhadin
Max Kolonko wrote:
muhadin wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
K162 whs are the easiest sigs to scan already, for out going whs it varies based on what kind it is.

PS: it should probably be added at this point that if you just use the default probe layouts, you really don't get a vote on this.

Using default probe layout I find wormholes absurdedly easy to probe down. Using covops frig, sister's expanded launcher, sister's core probes, and all scanning skills at 3, I know it's a wormhole on an 8au scan, and have warp in on 2au scan. Scanning wormholes doesn't need to be made easier, proponents of this idea simply need to become less bad at it.


Not all wormholes are the same, some are much more difficult to find in ways that don't make any sense.


Still, learn to use more efficient probe layouts andscan entire system much faster, including the hard to get signals - learn to eve instead of dumbing it down.


Sorry, but if you think I'm not a very fast prober you are mistaken. This change is not for me, this change is for newer players, and for players who don't enjoy spending 30-60minutes of their 2-3 hours they have to play a night scanning.

W-space is already complex, this will barely touch the complexity of wspace.

"Love the Life you Live, Live the Life you Love"
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#80 - 2015-09-17 06:45:14 UTC  |  Edited by: FT Diomedes
muhadin wrote:


Sorry, but if you think I'm not a very fast prober you are mistaken. This change is not for me, this change is for newer players, andfor players who don't enjoy spending 30-60minutes of their 2-3 hours they have to play a night scanning.

W-space is already complex, this will barely touch the complexity of wspace.


I bolded the true part of your statement. This change is to make it easier for bored veterans to go find new targets.

It's like people living in Deklein complaining about a lack of content. To them, I say they should move somewhere more challenging or unblue some folks.

Stop crushing everyone else in WH space into renter status or go do something else.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.