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Module swop so PVErs can fight back.
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Jenshae Chiroptera
#21 - 2012-01-03 19:02:24 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
...
if you have to put a ton of conditions on something like this, odds are it was a bad idea in the first place and cannot be saved.


... or it is part of a refined system. All games are a "ton of conditions."

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#22 - 2012-01-03 19:27:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Scatim Helicon
Epofhis wrote:
Personally, if I rat in null, I do so in a fully pvp ready ship


Is the correct answer.

If you don't want to be ganked in your hilariously vulnerable PvE-optimised fit, don't use a hilariously vulnerable PvE-optimised fit.

Of course then you risk losing a few percent off your ISK/hr efficiency rating, almost as though this game had a notion of risk vs reward or something.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.
el alasar
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2012-01-03 19:43:28 UTC  |  Edited by: el alasar
isnt the correct question, why does pve allow you to use other than current pvp fits? or: why do pvp fits give you a higher chance to survive / win in pvp compared to pve fits?

check the moderated 10000 papercuts evelopedia page! http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Little_things_and_ideas_-_low_hanging_fruit_-_10000_papercuts comment, bump(!) and like what you like
Fidelium Mortis
Minor Major Miners LLC
#24 - 2012-01-03 19:45:27 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:

The second would be more AI changes so that NPCs behaved more like players.


So NPCs would stay docked until they have sufficient numbers and then blob players, followed by GF spam and trolling in local?

Personally I don't see a whole lot that is inherently broken in the game with this respect since fits and fleet composition can be tailored to the situation. This proposed change just seems to run counter to one of the core mechanics in EVE that makes the game interesting, that is, there always should be tradeoffs to any choice in the game.

ICRS - Intergalactic Certified Rocket Surgeon
Jenshae Chiroptera
#25 - 2012-01-03 20:26:13 UTC
Key example is worm holes. You either PVE fit or you can't tank them. Try to do them with PVP fits and logistics then you quickly have so many people it isn't worth doing them at all.

How broken is it that it is better to solo or small team them and just absorb the loss of the ship(s) than to try and prepare them for any PVP?

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#26 - 2012-01-03 23:56:07 UTC
Fidelium Mortis wrote:
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:

The second would be more AI changes so that NPCs behaved more like players.


So NPCs would stay docked until they have sufficient numbers and then blob players, followed by GF spam and trolling in local?

Hahaha, epic.

Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Key example is worm holes. You either PVE fit or you can't tank them. Try to do them with PVP fits and logistics then you quickly have so many people it isn't worth doing them at all.

How broken is it that it is better to solo or small team them and just absorb the loss of the ship(s) than to try and prepare them for any PVP?

Have an alt in the wh with you cloaked up in a falcon. There, now you're prepared for PvP.

Or, just do what other players do. When you're making money, don't kill people. You're running a wh site and you see combats out? Get the hell out of the site. Then when you're safe go swap in to a PvP ship and try and bait them again if you want to.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Jenshae Chiroptera
#27 - 2012-01-04 00:31:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenshae Chiroptera
Simi Kusoni wrote:
...
Have an alt in the wh with you cloaked up in a falcon. There, now you're prepared for PvP.

Or, just do what other players do. When you're making money, don't kill people. You're running a wh site and you see combats out? Get the hell out of the site. Then when you're safe go swap in to a PvP ship and try and bait them again if you want to.


... umm ... you do know that:


  • There is no announcement when a new worm hole opens into your system.
  • Covert ships can warp up cloaked then fly nice and close to you as "Warp To" points.
  • Due to API changes people can no longer track jumping in or out of a worm hole system.
  • You don't need probes to find combat sites.


Right?

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#28 - 2012-01-04 00:48:14 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:
...
Have an alt in the wh with you cloaked up in a falcon. There, now you're prepared for PvP.

Or, just do what other players do. When you're making money, don't kill people. You're running a wh site and you see combats out? Get the hell out of the site. Then when you're safe go swap in to a PvP ship and try and bait them again if you want to.


... umm ... you do know that:


  • There is no announcement when a new worm hole opens into your system.
  • Covert ships can warp up cloaked then fly nice and close to you as "Warp To" points.
  • Due to API changes people can no longer track jumping in or out of a worm hole system.
  • You don't need probes to find combat sites.


Right?

Covert ships can warp up cloaked then fly nice and close to you as "Warp To" points.

Really, I'd never heard of this tactic being used before. It must be new Lol

Keep your ship moving and they won't be able to slow boat over to get a warp in. Besides, most players do end up popping combats, it's pretty rare that they find you with d-scan unless they're good. And even then, if you're hitting d-scan regularly like you should chances are you or your alt will pick them up on d-scan as one of them enter the wh.

Between that, keeping a few e-war drones in your drone bay, and just not semi-afk running the sites you're pretty safe. And besides, even if you could pve in a fit that could fight back, people would just bring more ships to kill you.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Jenshae Chiroptera
#29 - 2012-01-04 01:00:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenshae Chiroptera
Simi Kusoni wrote:
...
Besides, most players do end up popping combats, it's pretty rare that they find you with d-scan unless they're good. ...


Forget D-scan. Without probes out, try hitting the scan button and see what happens. Roll

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#30 - 2012-01-04 02:56:07 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Forget D-scan. Without probes out, try hitting the scan button and see what happens. Roll

Herpin your derp, first thing you do when entering a system is use d-scan. You don't randomly warp site to site blindly hoping to find something unless you're a complete moron. The whole idea is to find people quickly.

Anyway, since how they find you (whether warping randomly or by sensibly d-scanning) has nothing to do with the points I made i'll reiterate them for you:

Simi Kusoni wrote:


  • Keep your ship moving and they won't be able to slow boat over to get a warp in.

  • If you're hitting d-scan regularly like you should chances are you or your alt will pick them up on d-scan as one of them enter the wh.

  • Keep a few e-war drones in your drone bay

  • Don't semi-afk run sites.

  • Even if you could pve in a fit that could fight back, people would just bring more ships to kill you.


There, made it easier for you.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
FlinchingNinja Kishunuba
Crunchy Crunchy
#31 - 2012-01-04 20:18:14 UTC
What I want is a "I win" button... I tried making it with my crayons, annoying thing is it doesn't "pin" on the GUI. I may upgrade to pre-printed explosion stickers so that I can really own Eve.
Jenshae Chiroptera
#32 - 2012-01-05 00:02:15 UTC
Simi Kusoni wrote:

Herpin your derp, first thing you do when entering a system is use d-scan. You don't randomly warp site to site blindly hoping to find something unless you're a complete moron. The whole idea is to find people quickly.
.


Take your time, you are in a covert ship after all ... unless you're ...

They have the time it takes for your fleet to warp to them, to spot your fleet on D-scan, alert everyone, align and warp out. That is all they get. If your new worm hole entrance come in close to the combat site they are doing then they are dead. There simply isn't enough warp time from the incoming enemies for them to see it and get out.

  • New WH entrance appears (does not appear on D-scan)
  • Covert ship has jumped through ( 1/1000 it appears on D-scan before cloaking)
  • Nothing appears through API ( 0 chance of knowing people are in the system)
  • Covert ship D-scans ( 0 chance of appearing on D-scan)
  • Covert ship scans for combat sites without probes ( 0 chance of appearing on D-scan)
  • Covert ship warps in and positions themselves as a warp to point ( 0 chance of appearing on D-scan)
  • Enemy fleet jumps in and warps to covert ship ( Very small chance they get spotted on D-scan and there is time to escape)
  • Wait for hours in POS because you don't have enough people online for revenge and you can't see via API if they have left yet.

There, made is simple for you.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
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