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Message to the Diciples of Ston and PIE Inc.

Author
Ahkran Zateki
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-01-03 22:28:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Ahkran Zateki
PUBLIC STATEMENT

The efforts of the corporation and 24th Imperial Crusade enlisted organisation PIE Inc. to force access into facilities and ships are immoral and illegal. PIE Inc. is not authorised by any legitimate authority within the empire to make such demands, and is attempting to exercise powers not granted to it by either Imperial Law or the CONCORD Emergency Militia War Powers Act. It is neither a law enforcement organisation nor the appropriate branch of the military to arbitrarily be given access to assets belonging to any organisation, facility, or ship other than its own, and has no power to detain citizens.

PIE Inc. does not have the legal backing to investigate any organistation within or outside Empire borders until official warrant is presented from any of the following authorities:
- Amarr Navy
- Ministry of War
- Ministry of Internal Order
- Court Chamberlain
- Imperial Chancellor
- Amarr Trade Registry
- Amarr Civil Service
- The Empress

Since no such warrant has been presented, as it stands PIE Inc. is violation of both Imperial and CONCORD law if it attempts to gain access by force to Disciples of Ston assets. Obviously attacks on their ships in secure space without a proper decleration of war are illegal. I remind the Disciples that even if put under war declaration they are within their full legal rights to refuse entry to their facilities and not to disclose any information regarding their operations to PIE Inc.

I am a qualified lawyer and authorise this statement to be used as the basis for any ensuing legal case.

Sincerely

Dr. Ahkran Mohal Zateki
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#2 - 2012-01-03 22:39:33 UTC
Ahkran Zateki wrote:

I am a qualified lawyer and authorise this statement to be used as the basis for any ensuing legal case.


You are nothing, and speak for no one.

Sabik now, Sabik forever

Gen Kumon
Naqam
#3 - 2012-01-03 22:53:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Gen Kumon
Silas Vitalia wrote:


You are nothing, and speak for no one.



Untrue. He is amusing, and he at least speaks for himself, for what little good it'll do anyone.

Doctor Zateki, you seem to be under the delusion that PIE actually cares about the law. They use it as a shield to hide behind, nothing more. The moment actually paying it more than lip service would cause them problems, they'll ignore it, all while pretending never to have done so. Then again, the same applies to all Amarr who swear themselves into the service of the the so-called Empress. They decry the progress of the Nation while they beat and drug their own slaves, treating them like animals. Why should they be any less hypocritical on this topic? It's fed to them in the cradle along with their milk, though I doubt you'll agree with me. Still, I can always hope you have an open mind, unlikely as that is.
Conventia Underking
Underking Family
Khimi Harar
#4 - 2012-01-03 23:06:42 UTC
The above piece of 'legal advice' seems to be lacking references to the alleged request by PIE Inc. to the Disciples of Ston. Perhaps readers are meant to find this evidence on their own?

For God; Salvation is Imperative, but not at the cost of our Humanity!

The Vitoc Problem - Conventia Underking

Terenia Alamonde
Doomheim
#5 - 2012-01-03 23:55:09 UTC
Conventia Underking wrote:
The above piece of 'legal advice' seems to be lacking references to the alleged request by PIE Inc. to the Disciples of Ston. Perhaps readers are meant to find this evidence on their own?


I've seen the 'request' PIE made. It's nothing more than an intrusion into affairs that are beyond their purview.

The Matriculation Center has been freeing and rehabilitating slaves for some time now; PIE made the demand that their doors be thrown open for an Imperial inspection, despite having no authority over the Matriculation Center or its staff.

In the guise of 'protecting Empire interests and materiel', PIE is undertaking a highly illegal search, which I fear will be used to undermine the interests of our allies and present a clear challenge to their sovreignty.

I don't speak for my government, but I will not stand by and ignore such a blatant attempt at power-mongering and bullying.
Ahkran Zateki
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-01-04 00:01:31 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:
Ahkran Zateki wrote:

I am a qualified lawyer and authorise this statement to be used as the basis for any ensuing legal case.


You are nothing, and speak for no one.




And you good madam should endeavour to educate yourself. Good day.
Ahkran Zateki
Doomheim
#7 - 2012-01-04 00:04:12 UTC
Conventia Underking wrote:
The above piece of 'legal advice' seems to be lacking references to the alleged request by PIE Inc. to the Disciples of Ston. Perhaps readers are meant to find this evidence on their own?


I had hoped readers would be keeping up to date with topics in the IGS should they seek to speak there, but then again it is the IGS so maybe I was too hopeful

For the benefit of yourself and others, this is the topic in question.
Conventia Underking
Underking Family
Khimi Harar
#8 - 2012-01-04 01:30:05 UTC
Ahkran Zateki wrote:
Conventia Underking wrote:
The above piece of 'legal advice' seems to be lacking references to the alleged request by PIE Inc. to the Disciples of Ston. Perhaps readers are meant to find this evidence on their own?


I had hoped readers would be keeping up to date with topics in the IGS should they seek to speak there, but then again it is the IGS so maybe I was too hopeful

For the benefit of yourself and others, this is the topic in question.


Thank you, it is always good to provide references for those with less free time than it takes to read everything in IGS.

For God; Salvation is Imperative, but not at the cost of our Humanity!

The Vitoc Problem - Conventia Underking

Karmilla Strife
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#9 - 2012-01-04 02:19:20 UTC
Dr. Ahkran Mohal Zateki,

You forgot the Theology Council.
Ahkran Zateki
Doomheim
#10 - 2012-01-04 02:32:42 UTC
Karmilla Strife wrote:
Dr. Ahkran Mohal Zateki,

You forgot the Theology Council.


Though their intervention on non-theological matters is rare (hence why the civic court was not included), they certainly would have the authority. Thank you for the addendum.
Graelyn
Aeternus Command Academy
#11 - 2012-01-04 03:02:28 UTC
Ironically, these organizations will be fully within the law if they declare war on you in an attempt to force you into compliance.

I don't think lawyering is going to save you in this instance.

Cardinal Graelyn

Amarr Loyalist of the Year - YC113

Thgil Goldcore
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2012-01-04 05:58:52 UTC
com·mo·dore   [kom-uh-dawr, -dohr]
noun
1.

Navy . a grade of flag officer next in rank below a rear admiral.
2.
Navy . the senior captain when two or more ships of war are cruising in company.
3
the senior captain of a line of merchant vessels.

My current rank with the 24th Imperial Crusade

Divine Commodore

My qualification's to act with minor impunity under the name of the 24th crusade is fairly solid in this case. After all, I am rank is more than enough to conduct major military operations under the name of the 24th... trivial inspections should be a non-issue.
Kentt Em'asep
Clone Red Creations
#13 - 2012-01-04 06:17:58 UTC
Thgil Goldcore wrote:
com·mo·dore   [koom-oh-dawer, -dohr]
...
Needless stuff about rank
...

My qualification's to act with minor impunity under the name of the 24th crusade is fairly solid in this case. After all, I am rank is more than enough to conduct major military operations under the name of the 24th... trivial inspections should be a non-issue.


Your qualification is to act under the name of your Empire... but not to barge into ordering a full inspection of a coorperation outside of Amarrian rule, which might be more then trivial. I am sure if you wish to do a trivial inspection, you can start by attempting to arrange an inspection of their carpets and checking for toxic stains. I would believe that anyone outside of your Crusade does not think twice about how high your rank is unless they work for or with you.

~"That's right. Today, tomorrow, the next day, and the day after that, and the day after that... from here on until forever, every time you look at my avatar - you'll see this scowl."~

~"Forever?"~

~"Yes - forever. It's what I do."~

Ciar Meara
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#14 - 2012-01-04 08:43:53 UTC
Gen Kumon wrote:

Doctor Zateki, you seem to be under the delusion that PIE actually cares about the law. They use it as a shield to hide behind, nothing more.


PIE inc. is the shield of the Empire itself, nothing more.

- [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow]

Arkady Sadik
Gradient
Electus Matari
#15 - 2012-01-04 09:01:35 UTC
Was this really that important that it couldn't have been posted in the already existing thread on the topic?
Conventia Underking
Underking Family
Khimi Harar
#16 - 2012-01-04 10:05:59 UTC
Arkady Sadik wrote:
Was this really that important that it couldn't have been posted in the already existing thread on the topic?


No, Mr Sadik, it was not.

For God; Salvation is Imperative, but not at the cost of our Humanity!

The Vitoc Problem - Conventia Underking

Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#17 - 2012-01-04 11:24:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Rodj Blake
Ahkran Zateki wrote:
PUBLIC STATEMENT

The efforts of the corporation and 24th Imperial Crusade enlisted organisation PIE Inc. to force access into facilities and ships are immoral and illegal. PIE Inc. is not authorised by any legitimate authority within the empire to make such demands, and is attempting to exercise powers not granted to it by either Imperial Law or the CONCORD Emergency Militia War Powers Act. It is neither a law enforcement organisation nor the appropriate branch of the military to arbitrarily be given access to assets belonging to any organisation, facility, or ship other than its own, and has no power to detain citizens.

PIE Inc. does not have the legal backing to investigate any organistation within or outside Empire borders until official warrant is presented from any of the following authorities:
- Amarr Navy
- Ministry of War
- Ministry of Internal Order
- Court Chamberlain
- Imperial Chancellor
- Amarr Trade Registry
- Amarr Civil Service
- The Empress

Since no such warrant has been presented, as it stands PIE Inc. is violation of both Imperial and CONCORD law if it attempts to gain access by force to Disciples of Ston assets. Obviously attacks on their ships in secure space without a proper decleration of war are illegal. I remind the Disciples that even if put under war declaration they are within their full legal rights to refuse entry to their facilities and not to disclose any information regarding their operations to PIE Inc.

I am a qualified lawyer and authorise this statement to be used as the basis for any ensuing legal case.

Sincerely

Dr. Ahkran Mohal Zateki


The fact that you missed multiple organisations from your list implies that your knowledge of the law isn't as good as you think it is. I'd ask for a refund of your tuition fees if I were you (which thankfully I'm not).

PIE (along with all capsuleer organisations) is perfectly entitled to submit questions to other capsuleers. It is also perfectly entitled to request co-operation from other groups. Such activities are normally referred to as diplomacy.

Furthermore, when we receive allegations of wrongdoing, we are entitled to investigate those allegations with or without the co-operation of the accused. We do this so that we can formulate the correct policies and avoid unnecessary unpleasantness. Rather than investigating the authenticity of allegations, should we instead simply take them at face value? Capsuleers are of course perfectly entitled to not co-operate with any investigations conducted by PIE officers, but PIE is also entitled to draw conclusions from that.

We have done this in the past (our investigation of No.Mercy is one example) and I'm sure that we will do so again in the future.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori

Ascentior
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#18 - 2012-01-04 12:37:27 UTC
Message Subject wrote:
Message to the Diciples of Ston and PIE Inc.


Ahkran Zateki wrote:
PUBLIC STATEMENT

Sincerely

Dr. Ahkran Mohal Zateki


Did he get your attention?

Admiral of PIE Inc., Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris (See 'PIE Public' for recruitment)

Honorary Fabricator-General of the Imperial Navy

Chosen by God to serve the Empire.

Lucius Vindictus
Arachnos
#19 - 2012-01-04 13:49:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucius Vindictus
Why is it always the unaligned capsuleers fresh in the pod that are most vocal?

Capsuleers are their own legal entities. They can claim sovereignty, declare wars, etc.. It is rare that capsuleers use those powers for the betterment of one of the major empires rather than themselves or their own corporations. But that is their right, and it's not up to any other authority to decide what they should or should not do. Although I believe that PIE would work with any Imperial authority, were they to speak out, voluntarily.

It is only to their credit that PIE would take up a task that the Empire can't do itself. They aren't acting against them, but try to assist them. Isn't that what loyalist do?
Ava Starfire
Khushakor Clan
#20 - 2012-01-04 13:59:27 UTC
I, too, like frosting on my cake that is soo sugary, it makes me light headed the instant it contacts my tongue.

That is all.

"There is no strength in numbers; have no such misconception." -Jayka Vofur, "Warfare in the North"