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What happened to player built stargates?
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Dunkle Lars
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#41 - 2015-08-30 18:49:04 UTC
Sarayu Wyvern wrote:
DaReaper wrote:
sigh...

work in progress. inorder to get new things old things need to be replaced. We are mid way or so through that.

Sov has been changed

Structures are coming soon

then Corp and alliance roles need a revamping

Then comes new stuff.

Welcome to a 'rebuild and restructure' phase.

Yes, not everything seen at FanFest comes out immediately after.Lol

I'm always confused as to how there are so many people that aren't familiar with that by now. They can't ALL be new players.



The problem is.. I don't think anything CCP announced on Fanfest have made it in game. Nothing.. in what? 12 years.. That's quite an impressive history of shitting on your costumers :)
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#42 - 2015-08-30 20:28:35 UTC
Dunkle Lars wrote:

The problem is.. I don't think anything CCP announced on Fanfest have made it in game. Nothing.. in what? 12 years.. That's quite an impressive history of shitting on your costumers :)

If you really think that.... I think you need a check.
Since the entire plan they outlined at Fanfest has been getting in game.
A few things they show at Fanfest are theories. Fanfest is not a 'These are upcoming updates' presentation all the time, some of it is 'We have some cool ideas to show you, and then we'll get a bunch of feedback on them'. The Perma death 20m SP clone was one where everyone pointed out exactly how abusable it was to create recyclable ganker alts and that there was no reasonable way for CCP to control said ganker alts. And so they appear to have shelved it as a bad idea.
Others such as 'Ring mining' will have been shelved for engine reasons, being utterly impractical to try and implement in the engine as it works.

But nearly everything they show at Fanfests has made the game.
Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#43 - 2015-08-31 00:43:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Webvan
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
I think player built gates is, and always was, a very bad idea.

Perhaps someone can enlighten me to something Ive missed, but to my mind it only provides means for a small minority to essentially exploitatively bypass the hard topography of EVE, for personal benefit, without contributing content to anyone else,

It "breaks" the map.

Id much rather see a project and direction to diversify the value of systems in EVE, thereby making topography along existing gate lines more strategically important.

I very much hope this is one among the many many ideas that though promised, worked on a bit, and seemed like a good idea at the time, never makes it into the live game.

Iirc, this was introduced alongside the speculations of Jovian space become accessible. At the time, I figured (probably wrongly) that it referred to building access gates to that new space, rather than internally.


Player built gates will lead to unknown space with special properties, what I call "new space" or N-space. It may be the formerly Jove space, or something never seen before. The gates will be player structures, with special fits, and has been hitned that they will require some kind of implant/module to be used by the player traversing them.

What player built gates will not do is to replicate the gate system.

Yeah but I thought I heard there was some bug they were trying to squash, with players going through the gates and winding up in Azeroth, then ragequitting when they realize they cant use flying mounts P
gotta be fixed..

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#44 - 2015-08-31 01:19:43 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
If Player Built Gates do become a reality, I highly doubt they will lead to new space or to Jove space.

Those gates when built probably can't be re-positioned or set up in another location. I believe they will only be able to lock onto one system of choice in known space, more than likely using Sansha Tech to generate a one way worm-hole. Basically bypassing the need for multiple jumps (Jump Fatigue) and allowing large invasion forces to infiltrate enemy territory rather quickly. It can also establish a supply line for reinforcements. After the area is secure, another gate can be built for a return trip or to strike at another location.

Course the enemy can also do the same thing ...........................



DMC


Sorry to disagree, but CCP's plans are completely different. There's two Chronicles and some fanfest talking about how the player bult gates lead to enormous distances never seen before, specifically they link to somewhere where there's no gates (so so far they're a one-way trip, at least from the Chronicles).

Also there's the Fanfest video where one such gate is activated and causes a massive EMP which disables a whole Amarran fleet tyring to destroy it since there's a prophecy that Something Bad will come through such a gate.

Definitively they're not Jumpbridges 2.0.

What we know:
- developed by Guristas using Wilard wheels.
- lead to massive distances beyond the New Eden cluster
- player built gates will be configurable through fitting (as the new structures)
- probably ships and capsuleers will require specific modules and implants to use them (maybe to be able to come back?)
- Amarran are convinced that something bad awaits behind those gates
- the new space will have unseen properties (new mechanics/gameplay/et cetera)
- the player built gates are a part of the Rubicon vision of players colonizing space
- the Rubicon development plan spans from late 2013 to late 2016/early 2017, so we should be roughly at 3/5 of it

Yeah no problem, I disagree with you on just about everything.

As for the Chronicles, CCP rarely adheres to what's presented in those stories.

Yes the gates are meant to jump enormous distances, which will basically bypass Jump Fatigue. Yes they won't link to another gate, they will form a one way worm hole, exactly like Sansha.

That video was over-sensationalized, an embellishment to generate a positive response from the fans. Rarely do those videos give an accurate account of what actually makes it into the game. By the way, the EMP blast was not a side effect of the gate being activated, it was a failsafe measure to stop the fleet from destroying the gate. Also I don't remember seeing anything said about Player Built Gates being developed from Guristas Tech.

Anyway, the Armarr view everything and everyone that doesn't conform to their beliefs as being bad and or dangerous. As such they were the perfect Empire Faction to add suspense and excitement to the video.

Very doubtful there will be special implants and modules needed to access those gates since that will defeat the chance of enemy forces taking control of it and using it against those who built it.

I believe the whole idea behind Player Built Gates is to promote open conflict in K-space, not for exploration into a new area of space. There's way too many empty systems in the game already. Player Built Gates, if added, will be to foster and encourage Null Sec Sov Warfare, which makes sense if you think about it.


DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Sarayu Wyvern
The Bosena Accords
Round Table Assembly
#45 - 2015-09-03 16:54:29 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Dunkle Lars wrote:

The problem is.. I don't think anything CCP announced on Fanfest have made it in game. Nothing.. in what? 12 years.. That's quite an impressive history of shitting on your costumers :)

If you really think that.... I think you need a check.
Since the entire plan they outlined at Fanfest has been getting in game.
A few things they show at Fanfest are theories. Fanfest is not a 'These are upcoming updates' presentation all the time, some of it is 'We have some cool ideas to show you, and then we'll get a bunch of feedback on them'. The Perma death 20m SP clone was one where everyone pointed out exactly how abusable it was to create recyclable ganker alts and that there was no reasonable way for CCP to control said ganker alts. And so they appear to have shelved it as a bad idea.
Others such as 'Ring mining' will have been shelved for engine reasons, being utterly impractical to try and implement in the engine as it works.

But nearly everything they show at Fanfests has made the game.

Uh, yeah. That wasn't the response I was expecting.

I mean, if he's talking about the really far out pipedream stuff, then yeah, some of that never made it in, but some of that stuff wouldn't have added much to the game anyway.

Alt of MidnightWyvern. (Mobius Wyvern in Dust 514)
Jax Kazen
Doomheim
#46 - 2015-09-03 21:01:40 UTC
Spookay wrote:
[quote=DaReaper][quote=Sobaan Tali]
at least we got skins.


Yep - it's awesome that they pitched a system to allow customization two years ago and have now figured out a way to charge us for it. Awesome.
45thtiger 0109
Pan-Intergalatic Business Community
#47 - 2015-09-03 23:47:40 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything has 23k likes which he should change his name to Successful At Everything because of his 23k likes lol

**You Have to take the good with the bad and the bad with the good.

Welcome to EvE OnLiNe**
stoicfaux
#48 - 2015-09-04 00:03:01 UTC
45thtiger 0109 wrote:
Unsuccessful At Everything has 23k likes which he should change his name to Successful At Everything because of his 23k likes lol

Pffffft! Have you seen his like to post ratio? Miners have better k/l ratios.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#49 - 2015-09-04 00:45:28 UTC
If CCP just wanted to give access to new systems outside K-Space it could be done with much less programming effort just by adding wormholes to the unknown systems.

You would then have wormholes (W-Space) linking known space (K-Space) and the new unknown space (U-space). You do not need player main gates to add more systems to the game.
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#50 - 2015-09-04 01:15:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Definitively they're not Jumpbridges 2.0.
...

Yeah no problem, I disagree with you on just about everything.

Ish's view seems to be more aligned with CCPs than not.

In the Fanfest keynotes last year and this year, CCP Seagull spoke of the gates opening up new parts of space:

2015: https://youtu.be/sOGnPAbHKDk?t=3862

2014: https://youtu.be/k07Uu7qUEa0?t=4978
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#51 - 2015-09-04 03:47:55 UTC  |  Edited by: DeMichael Crimson
Scipio Artelius wrote:

I'm on my phone at the moment so sorry for the long quote (I'll edit later)

Ish's view seems to be more aligned with CCPs than not.

In the Fanfest keynotes last year and this year, CCP Seagull spoke of the gates opening up new parts of space:

http://youtu.be/sOGnPAbHKDk

The relevant part starts at 1:04:25 (I'll edit the link later to go directly to the time).

Actually the only thing CCP Seagull said was that Player Built Stargates will take you to new parts of the Universe. Guess that's open to interpretation.

Later on at 1:08:35 CCP Nullarbor takes over and discusses all of the various structures currently available - POS, Outposts, Customs Offices, Infrastructure Hubs, Territorial Claim Units and Deployables. The main point is that they are all Player Built and able to be destroyed.

He then goes on to say CCP has plans to create and add 8 different classes of player built structures for the game :

1 - Assembly Array = Manufacturing Ships, Modules, Fuel Blocks, etc.
2 - Research Laboratory = BPO Research, Copy, Invention, Data Core Production, etc.
3 - Drilling Platform = Reprocessing, Moon Harvesting, Belt Mining, Reactions, Resource Acquisition, etc.
4 - Office & Market Hub = Player Market, Corporation Office, Cloning Service, Ship Insurance, etc.
5 - Observatory Array = Intelligence Gathering / Subterfuge, Map / Solar System Intel Interference, Locator Agent, etc.
6 - Administration Hub = Sovereignty, System Upgrades, NPC Interaction, etc.
7 - Gates = Facilitating / Disrupting Ship Movement - Jump Bridge / Cyno Jammer, etc.
8 - Advertisement Center = Propaganda Billboard / Monument, etc.

In my opinion the whole point is CCP will be putting control of structures and services into the hands of Capsuleers with ease of access, basically with the intention to foster / encourage a hostile environment for players.

Sorry but I just don't see anything here suggesting that Player Built Stargates are going to lead to brand new space to be explored. In my opinion these gates are for SOV Wars, to quickly move and or reinforce forces into specific locations far away, especially useful with the recent introduction of Jump Fatigue.


DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#52 - 2015-09-04 04:15:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Sorry but I just don't see anything here suggesting that Player Built Stargates are going to lead to brand new space to be explored.

DMC, I think you know my posting habits well enough that you can trust me when I tell you that something like that was indeed stated.

I don't remember when or by who for certain, but I do have a strong feeling it was Seagull at some time in the past. I think it was also later repeated, too.

Maybe when the idea was first floated, or perhaps even buried in CSM minutes (ya, I actually read those). I just don't remember at the moment.

EDIT: Found one...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXYu5oUc0p4&t=5151
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#53 - 2015-09-04 04:40:38 UTC  |  Edited by: DeMichael Crimson
CCP Ytterbium, Senior Game Designer, goes into more detail about the various player built structures including Gates.

https://youtu.be/Hen92QFrDUo?t=26m17s

He mentions something about the possibility of these gates affecting the spawning of w-holes within the system of the gate. That's it, nothing about the gates going to new areas of unexplored space.

Of course the main thing all players should remember is that every year at Fanfest CCP unveils new ideas which they always promote as a WIP = work in progress.

That means it may take years to develop and more importantly, may not even be added to the game due to unforeseen issues.

Anyway, I sincerely hope CCP does in fact add these structures to the game asap. If anything, just to shake the very foundations of those who hold Null Sec Sov.



DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#54 - 2015-09-04 05:25:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Former CCP marketing chief David Reid in a Forbes interview:

David Reid wrote:
Rubicon’s an interesting expansion for us. It comes at a unique time in the EVE universe. At FanFest in Reykjavik last year we announced that we were going to begin a multi-expansion arc giving players the resource and the blueprints to construct their own stargates, and go forth into new galaxies.

The EVE universe is already a pretty big place – 7,000 solar systems, more than 10,000 planets. We opened up wormhole space in an expansion called Apocrypha in 2009, but other than that there’s really been no new geography to the universe. And so with Rubicon we begin that process of giving players the ability to open up stargates to these new galaxies and to be the first to colonize them.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielnyegriffiths/2013/12/10/eve-online-crosses-the-rubicon-ccp-games-david-reid-speaks/

There are many articles around the Rubicon announcement, but I still swear there was a more recent mention on the topic. I remember, because it surprised me; that implies to me at the moment that it wasn't in a presentation where I'd expect it. It was also small, and I wondered to myself if anybody else caught it.

Still searching..

Of course, "WIP" still applies. Meaning everything, or nothing, is still possible.
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#55 - 2015-09-04 05:55:17 UTC
Spookay wrote:
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
What happened to that one thing they talked about years ago?



how in **** do u have 23,000 forum likes. u must shitpost on here every waking minute.


The some way the codies cheat:
There is a "Like and get Likes" thread in the forums where those ppl push their likes beyond believe.

Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#56 - 2015-09-04 06:17:24 UTC
La Rynx wrote:
Spookay wrote:
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
What happened to that one thing they talked about years ago?



how in **** do u have 23,000 forum likes. u must shitpost on here every waking minute.


The some way the codies cheat:
There is a "Like and get Likes" thread in the forums where those ppl push their likes beyond believe.

Lol. UaE doesn't post in LAGL.

He's as disillusioned as anyone about fake reputations. Likes are important business.
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#57 - 2015-09-04 07:14:09 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Former CCP marketing chief David Reid in a Forbes interview:

David Reid wrote:
Rubicon’s an interesting expansion for us. It comes at a unique time in the EVE universe. At FanFest in Reykjavik last year we announced that we were going to begin a multi-expansion arc giving players the resource and the blueprints to construct their own stargates, and go forth into new galaxies.

The EVE universe is already a pretty big place – 7,000 solar systems, more than 10,000 planets. We opened up wormhole space in an expansion called Apocrypha in 2009, but other than that there’s really been no new geography to the universe. And so with Rubicon we begin that process of giving players the ability to open up stargates to these new galaxies and to be the first to colonize them.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielnyegriffiths/2013/12/10/eve-online-crosses-the-rubicon-ccp-games-david-reid-speaks/

There are many articles around the Rubicon announcement, but I still swear there was a more recent mention on the topic. I remember, because it surprised me; that implies to me at the moment that it wasn't in a presentation where I'd expect it. It was also small, and I wondered to myself if anybody else caught it.

Still searching..

Of course, "WIP" still applies. Meaning everything, or nothing, is still possible.

Well, they might have been referring to the 'Shattered Worlds' systems as new space.

Anyway, 'Emergent Threats' shows the entire Stargate System in Jove Space going offline. That new space would definitely need Player Built Stargates. Probably have Drifters as the NPC Pirate Faction with the Jove holding Sov there.

Course that would mean more PvE content being added to the game which is fine by me.


DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#58 - 2015-09-04 08:27:32 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Actually the only thing CCP Seagull said was that Player Built Stargates will take you to new parts of the Universe. Guess that's open to interpretation.

I guess.

Then comes the 2014 Keynote where it was first outlined:

2014: https://youtu.be/k07Uu7qUEa0?t=5049

The relevant quote from CCP Seagull:

"
But, what about these stargates then?
If the capsuleers manage to construct some new technology with the potential of breaking out of the known universe.
What is it that we want to give you there beyond the gates?
Well, we want to give you something new to explore.
A new frontier, a new experience in Eve online.
A place you can choose to go where you and everyone else have to figure things out again.
Where you can encounter new challenges and new types of game mechanics in Eve.

"

Seems pretty clear that breaking out of the known universe to find something new to explore in a new frontier - is not referring to the existing areas of New Eden we can reach.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#59 - 2015-09-04 10:03:59 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Actually the only thing CCP Seagull said was that Player Built Stargates will take you to new parts of the Universe. Guess that's open to interpretation.

I guess.

Then comes the 2014 Keynote where it was first outlined:

2014: https://youtu.be/k07Uu7qUEa0?t=5049

The relevant quote from CCP Seagull:

"
But, what about these stargates then?
If the capsuleers manage to construct some new technology with the potential of breaking out of the known universe.
What is it that we want to give you there beyond the gates?
Well, we want to give you something new to explore.
A new frontier, a new experience in Eve online.
A place you can choose to go where you and everyone else have to figure things out again.
Where you can encounter new challenges and new types of game mechanics in Eve.

"

Seems pretty clear that breaking out of the known universe to find something new to explore in a new frontier - is not referring to the existing areas of New Eden we can reach.


A cigar for the sir! That's what I remembered, not just the chronicle dealing with research of the gates, but the "totally new space".

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#60 - 2015-09-04 11:36:20 UTC
OK, old stuff previewed in past Fanfest. Atmospheric Flight, Ambulation, Modular POS, Avatar Exploration Sites, Ring Mining, etc. The list goes on. Most of that is CCP's wish list for the game.

I already conceded that Jove Space could be viewed as new space where Player Built Stargates would actually be needed due to the Emergent Threats trailer showing their entire Stargate system going offline. If not used there then the only other viable usage for Player Built Stargates would be for Sov Wars.

By the way, that chronicle doesn't say much despite all of the text contained within it.

Anyway, until it's actually in game, it's nothing more than promises in the dark ...............



DMC


'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle