Player Features and Ideas Discussion

No.

While it surely is not a nice thing to lose a ship during a "sockt closed" situation, a complete rollback of the loss would only needlessly punish the person on the other end in case of PvP.

If it happens in a PvE Situation you can get the dropped modules back anyway.

Let´s have a little look at this situation:

Player A goes out PvPing with some more expensive mods on his ship.

Player A get´s into a fight with Player B and gets disconnected.

Player B who is not very rich gets some nice modules and decides to run to the next trade hub to sell the loot. Now he uses a large portion of the ISK to buy some replacement ships and hess less ISK left in his wallet than the looted modules have been worth.

Now if CCP would reimburse the loss the way you want it to be done they have to invest a lot more time tracing your modules and has to put Player B´s wallet into the negative area. Player B has done nothing wrong and now is in a really bad situation.

Sure a lot of players could work around that problem if they have multiple accounts. But especially for newer players who do not have lot´s of ISK sitting around and can not just move some stuff over to another account / character to sell it, this could be really bad.

Let´s take this scenario even further:

Player B trusts a "friend" to sell some stuff for him and gives it to him through direct trade and ends up getting scammed. He was forced into that situation without having done anything wrong at all.

This is just one of many scenarios I could imagine where people who had nothing to do with your connection problem get punished while doing nothing wrong at all.

And it seems that you have been playing long enough to know that as soon as you undock a ship you take the risk of losing it, no matter what the circumstances are.

I was here back in those days and was denied tons of kills thx to the logoffski. This however does not have anything to do with the issue you are discussing. Btw... ships still emergency warp unless you are pointed.

The point here is: there is no way for ccp to know if your connection dropping had any influence on the result of the fight. No matter if it was CCP´s fault or the fault of your connection. Why should the player who got the kill, who had no influence on your connection problems or ccps connection problems get punished.

Hell I lost ships do disconnects as well and I don´t care. I write a petition and either get my ship back or I don´t. If I get the hull back: great... If I don´t I don´t care, because the moment I undocked I was willing to lose the ship anyway.

And no matter what has been the reason for me getting killed in the end. The person who was there to take me down, deserves to get my loot.

All you are doing here is screaming around: "Wha, wha! My precious modules!" and "Whaaa my killboard stats!!!!".

Nobody cares about your stupid killboard stats and if you are that attached to your space pixels you have bigger issues than getting a few modules back.

How is it for everyone when the proposed changes punish people and even have the potential to completly screw some people over who have not done anything wrong?

It´s for the benefit of people who were unfortunate to get disconnected in the wrong moment, but it is punishing people on the other side -> not for everyone.

Why are you so damn worked over by a KM not dissapearing after a kill was reimbursed?

Why are you putting so much effort into this?

You crying over a kill mail? Same thing, you know…

And yes, your idea punishes people: it means that they'll be robbed of stuff they've earned for no good reason. Your not wanting to appear on a kill mail when, in fact, you were killed is not a good reason.

Counterfactual reasoning doesn't prove anything, which is a huge part of why your idea has no sane or sensible foundation to build on for the kind of consequences you want to impose on everyone.


e: Swype is bad for you.

People, this already exists. I once lost a ship due to the controls locking up and my not being able to do anything for a bit. I sent a support ticket to CCP, they looked into it, and they Reimbursed my ship.

They only do so as long as there is a legitimate reason.

So my two cents on this. OP no you are not entitled to anything, all of your rights / laws only apply because:

1) you have enough people backing the rule
2) you have a body that enforces that rule

In the case of you DCing and losing your ship I don't see either of the above two things there. In fact doing what you ask and returning lost modules potentially negatively affects more CCP customers than your original ship loss did. There is no reason why CCP should even return anything to you, yes you pay them for access to the game but things happen. All CCP can do is try make things right by you by offering you what they can - replacing your lost ship.

I read, I thought about it, and my opinion remains the same.

What the opening post is suggesting is that a loss of a ship due to technical issues be erased from the in-game reality, and it is heavily slanted towards one direction. Let me break down the points one by one:



No, it is an equivalent exchange. The insurance is paid out because you lose your ship. What the CCP does, if they find that you lost your ship through technical issues or the like, they return your ship to you along with the modules that were destroyed with the ship, so you are essentially paying your insurance back to them in exchange for your ship being reimbursed.



And how unfair would this be to the pilot who destroyed your ship in the first place? Being reimbursed by CCP means that you get your ship back, and that should be enough for most players. What point would there be in the person who destroyed your ship losing the loot they collected, the salvage they claimed, the bounty payout (if you have one), AND THEIR KILL-MAIL?

If they kill you, they kill you. If you lost the ship due to technical issues, then you can get it back from CCP through reimbursement. What you are suggesting is that CCP shows favoritism - not only do you want them to reimburse your ship, but you essentially want them to corner the guy(s) who destroyed your ship in a dark alley, mug them and take away all the stuff they got from destroying your ship.

They only destroyed your ship. It is not their fault that your game experienced technical issues on your end. It is not their fault if unusual circumstances on your end led to your ship being destroyed, so why should they lose what they gained from destroying your ship? What you are proposing is counter-productive and hurts other players.



This is the only thing that would be worth considering, since the skill point reimbursement only affects you, and not the people who destroyed your ship.

Every other point you brought up is essentially demanding that CCP unfairly punish other players by taking away the rewards they gained from destroying your ship upon your ship's reimbursement. It's not their fault that cyber-gremlins messed with your control over your ship, so why should they "punished" for it by having their loot, ISK reward, and kill-mail taken away?

What was it you said, "YOUR SHIP WAS NEVER DESTROYED"? If that is what you think of reimbursement as, then you are sorely misunderstanding the concept. In-game, your ship is salvaged by CCP, fixed and returned to you, which includes the modules that were destroyed along with the ship. In exchange, you return the insurance pay-out you got from the ship being destroyed to balance things out.

It is simple and fair logic as a compensation to the player by CCP for the loss of one's ship through unusual circumstances (i.e. game bugs, glitches, etc.), and such an event should be kept purely internal and personal with the player. It would be unfair to demand that the loots, bounty award and kill-mail of the people who destroyed your ships to be taken away from them and erased.

rules can be, and have been, changed.
1) you can no longer join a war fleet to become a temporary war target.
2) you cannot log off to save yourself
3) you cannot eject from a ship to deny a kill mail
4) an entire squad of logistic ships can no longer become suspects when one does become a suspect.
5) neutral RR is now attackable by everyone (instead of just war targets).

CCP will re-evaluate "rules" as needed if they feel those changes have benefits to the masses.


my final comment:
i am a VERY experienced PvP pilot. enjoy an incredible combat record.
i never undock something i cannot afford to lose. i take my lumps when i've made a mistake and learn from the experience.

there are 2 instances where i was reimbursed for ship loss.
i won't discuss the details.
what i will say, the server "malfunction" was the root cause for both losses.
without a server malfunction, neither ship is lost.

when neither ship is lost, there cannot be a loot drop, bounty payout or a kill mail.

i could easily provide an example where i could waste your time and ammo, create frustration and deny you of a km.
i'd be safer than safe. laughing at you the entire time.
but when the server takes control away from me (in that situation) and provides you with a kill mail, loot and bounty then CCP needs to "own up" and remove the bounty payout, the loot drop and the loss mail.
you cannot be denied what wouldn't have happened had the server functioned as intended.

again, op, #NOPOORSPLS!!!!