EVE General Discussion

Because back then, people actually liked to play a PVP game and have fights.

Now it's all about dotage on piles of moon goo and (was - before jump fatigue) cap hot drops on cruiser roams, mixed with a lot of risk aversion.

You see if you go into goonie space you will see a lot of farming going on. How do you become a big coalition? You have to "sell" the nullsec experience as being just as, if not more, profitable than highsec. The means to that is to use (before Fozzie SOV) a ring of renters in the intel channel as a means of keeping people out with NBSI doctrines. This means that deep into your terrirtory, the carebears you recruited can farm and grind to their heart's content. Only now they are nullbears and allegedly more superior than highsec carebears for reasons unknown.


And that's why they don't fight so much. Most of them have highsec incursion alts (because nullsec still lacks payout) or highsec gank alts.


If resources were finite there would be conflict. But if all one needs is to establish treaties and rake in the ISK, that's what they will do.


CPP is making efforts to mix things up a bit, but if they really want to throw a wrench in the status quo, they would make resources finite such that belts and moons can be mined out and take time to replenish (if at all?). Then you would have conflict. The number of capitals that have been built would imply that entire systems could have been picked clean by now. THAT alone could have been the limitation (lacking stupid arbitrariness) on caps. Anybody would have predicted that building PWNmobiles with infinite resources was going to be an issue.

that doesn't really explain it, the old sov system still would have easily allowed a blue donut, finite resources actually sounds like a good idea, although it would have to be implemented carefully. But it still doesnt answer why the old groups didnt blue up, if the people like to pvp, why did they stop pvping? how was the fun in pvp taken out or what killed it? surely with all the farming they could afford a constantly supply of pvp goods wouldnt you think?

From what I understood specifically about BOB, they had built a feudalistic system.

Basically BOB had vassals rather then allies. They let other alliances rent space, scooped in some money and had more people who could join fleets if a system needed to be defended. Those alliances where mostly not considered equals by BOB, to a point where they were comonly called BOB pets by other non-BOB alliances.

BOB thought they were above everyone else due to their industrial and financial strength. Instead of partnering on equal terms they subcontracted wars to MC (Mercenary Coalition) and upkeep of non-core systems to pet alliances (the renters).

That doesn't explain the blue balling of today, but it explains why nobody would be allied with BOB unless they were ready to submit to BOB s decisions.

Before sov and alliance mechanics, corporations formed their own unofficial alliances. These alliances made names for themselves by claiming certain space and making sure nobody else was in it.

It was a hilariously convoluted player system, and made it almost impossible for even renters to happen, because everyone was too busy trying to remember who was in their own alliance. Coalitions never lasted long, until alliances became a game mechanic.

"Humans tend to seek safety and cooperation" does not mean "humans never take risks and always cooperate".

Well the path forward is obvious now, isn't it....

my guess is that people were too busy learning stuff and trying to claim greatness, and had yet to get complacent and comfortable. Plus no one had near endless stocks of ships, and/or the blob to fly them all, so the fear of getting instablobbed wasn't there.

They did.

Wars happened back then for the same reasons they happen now (we hate those guys/we want their stuff), and didn't happen back then for the same reasons they don't happen now (ugh, no point, and it's just not worth it). Not coincidentally, blue lists happened back then for the same reasons they do now, which is how the alliance concept was brought into the game.

The only thing that has changed is what stuff there is to want and that CCP has played around a bit with the threshold of “worth it”.

No, it's a serious answer. Most major wars involving goons have been decided by a betrayal by a director who just happened to defect to the goons or retire very shortly afterwards, or a highly coincidental 'mistake' which happened to only affect the biggest target it could possibly have done so on.
I.E. Use of multi spies and saboteurs has gone up significantly.

Once one group starts using this, all groups have to fight like this in order to survive, so everyone uses it.
And thus everyone is paranoid and not wanting to get into a fight in case they have one in their ranks, so everyone blues up.

Bullshit.

You're skipping years of gametime.

For one there was tons of regional wars before the power blocs got created. Because simply the game was fresh, most people in 0.0 were there to fight, and attacking your neighbor or w/e didn't result in everyone dogpiling on, simply because most alliances weren't allied to much if anyone else.

People started grouping together in late 04. The north,(west and north of venal) allied together all the way to Fade. Ex-BoB space allied together. Both of these groups and many of the corps have since become who makes up the North of today.

The great northern war, saw what would become BoB knock down that group of players. Soon the people of Cloud/Outer Ring came and pushed BoB out. These were the Germans, a predecessor to d2.

BoB went to Delve and tore that group of alliances down. Many of those displaced moved north.

Curse Alliance falls opening up much of Angel space.

Lots of land grabs.

06' BoB invades Ascendent Fronteir, topples them, kills Steve. Continues rampaging East knocking down every alliance. Rus and Goons call for help, North gets involved, the great war starts.

Great war ends.

08' Calm for a short period before Max1. Goon drops some sov in south, Max1 ends immediately and BoB coalition immediately invade Goons in Angel space.

09' BoB is disbanded and the war in Goon space is a mad dash for Delve. Atlas and Co vs RUS in angel space.

10' BoB now IT invading Goon space in Delve. Goon loses sov and runs north. Max2

11' North invades IT, and installs TEST

This is where I leave 0.0. But there's still the PL and co invasion of the north aswell as the NC/RUS war, and the whole PL+NC take over the south aswell. There was little time that major wars weren't going on in the past and I'm not even touching on many others that I wasn't directly involved in that were going subsequently. The idea that you guys in 0.0 are still wanting to fight is laughable. The only people who bring consistent largescale content to this game is BoB and the entities that spawned from it, i.e PL and NC. But yes, keep sitting in the North saying come get us. Same as it's been since 04.