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Decline in numbers... starting to turn into RAPID!!!

First post
Author
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#341 - 2015-08-28 12:46:01 UTC
Kaivar Lancer wrote:
Mount & Blade: Warband, a sandbox medieval RPG, is going for $6.80 on Steam. In conjunction with free mods, that is unbelievable value. And it's a one-time purchase only, so it's yours forever. This is the marketplace that CCP is competing in in 2015.

Oh yeah warband, not bad~~

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#342 - 2015-08-28 13:17:16 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Kaivar Lancer wrote:
Mount & Blade: Warband, a sandbox medieval RPG, is going for $6.80 on Steam. In conjunction with free mods, that is unbelievable value. And it's a one-time purchase only, so it's yours forever. This is the marketplace that CCP is competing in in 2015.

Oh yeah warband, not bad~~

Does it haz lazors?

*looks it up
Meh 64 player max network.
No lazors.
Even arma 3 haz lazors, and better network.
Guess you get what you pay for.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12

Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#343 - 2015-08-28 13:25:51 UTC
Webvan wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Kaivar Lancer wrote:
Mount & Blade: Warband, a sandbox medieval RPG, is going for $6.80 on Steam. In conjunction with free mods, that is unbelievable value. And it's a one-time purchase only, so it's yours forever. This is the marketplace that CCP is competing in in 2015.

Oh yeah warband, not bad~~

Does it haz lazors?

*looks it up
Meh 64 player max network.
No lazors.
Even arma 3 haz lazors, and better network.
Guess you get what you pay for.



Eve players crack me up...

"We need to get rid of blobs and make smaller groups viable in pvp"

ten seconds later

"64 player combat limit... oh heck no"

I get it, but I don't. Oh well. Everyone must just mean that they don't want to GET blobbed, they just want to BE the blob.

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.

Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#344 - 2015-08-28 13:31:20 UTC
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Webvan wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Kaivar Lancer wrote:
Mount & Blade: Warband, a sandbox medieval RPG, is going for $6.80 on Steam. In conjunction with free mods, that is unbelievable value. And it's a one-time purchase only, so it's yours forever. This is the marketplace that CCP is competing in in 2015.

Oh yeah warband, not bad~~

Does it haz lazors?

*looks it up
Meh 64 player max network.
No lazors.
Even arma 3 haz lazors, and better network.
Guess you get what you pay for.



Eve players crack me up...

"We need to get rid of blobs and make smaller groups viable in pvp"

ten seconds later

"64 player combat limit... oh heck no"

I get it, but I don't. Oh well. Everyone must just mean that they don't want to GET blobbed, they just want to BE the blob.

But lazors...

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12

Gillia Winddancer
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#345 - 2015-08-28 13:33:50 UTC
Webvan wrote:
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Webvan wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Kaivar Lancer wrote:
Mount & Blade: Warband, a sandbox medieval RPG, is going for $6.80 on Steam. In conjunction with free mods, that is unbelievable value. And it's a one-time purchase only, so it's yours forever. This is the marketplace that CCP is competing in in 2015.

Oh yeah warband, not bad~~

Does it haz lazors?

*looks it up
Meh 64 player max network.
No lazors.
Even arma 3 haz lazors, and better network.
Guess you get what you pay for.



Eve players crack me up...

"We need to get rid of blobs and make smaller groups viable in pvp"

ten seconds later

"64 player combat limit... oh heck no"

I get it, but I don't. Oh well. Everyone must just mean that they don't want to GET blobbed, they just want to BE the blob.

But lazors...


Wouldn't surprise me if there was a mod for your "lazors". Am pretty sure there was at least one Star Wars mod for it anyway.

And as for that 64 player limit - that could be bypassed. I used to play on a 200+ player server that was constantly full. Sure, it got slightly laggy then but oh lords, the amount of fun it was cannot be surpassed by most multiplayer games even today.
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#346 - 2015-08-28 13:34:41 UTC
Webvan wrote:

But lazors...


Now that, I have no rebuttal for.

As you were

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.

Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#347 - 2015-08-28 13:42:59 UTC
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Webvan wrote:

But lazors...


Now that, I have no rebuttal for.

As you were

Well, when you get tired of that, look up arma 3. It's the adult version of minecraft. NATO's training sim, too, a version of it.
Sure, I play games like that, but I play mmo's too. Mostly old-school mmo's. I can do both.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12

Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
Goonswarm Federation
#348 - 2015-08-28 13:54:18 UTC
Are you all ready for the incline in plex prices after the holidays?

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP

Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#349 - 2015-08-28 14:23:43 UTC
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Webvan wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Kaivar Lancer wrote:
Mount & Blade: Warband, a sandbox medieval RPG, is going for $6.80 on Steam. In conjunction with free mods, that is unbelievable value. And it's a one-time purchase only, so it's yours forever. This is the marketplace that CCP is competing in in 2015.

Oh yeah warband, not bad~~

Does it haz lazors?

*looks it up
Meh 64 player max network.
No lazors.
Even arma 3 haz lazors, and better network.
Guess you get what you pay for.



Eve players crack me up...

"We need to get rid of blobs and make smaller groups viable in pvp"

ten seconds later

"64 player combat limit... oh heck no"

I get it, but I don't. Oh well. Everyone must just mean that they don't want to GET blobbed, they just want to BE the blob.

Because in EVE there should be place for everyone. Theoretically.
Jenshae Chiroptera
#350 - 2015-08-28 14:53:56 UTC
Jill Xelitras wrote:
Kaivar Lancer wrote:
...But with Eve, $15 just buys you the same experience. Meh.
Yes and no ... the 15$ you pay for: ....
Solid post. It is sad that EVE players need these sort of things explained to them. I always keep fooling myself into believing that our community has a higher standard.
I guess EVE needs more Darwin steps to filter people out more.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.

Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#351 - 2015-08-28 15:13:11 UTC
Why is it people mix up disliking blob warfare for disliking large fights. I love large fights. But I dislike press F1. Increasing smaller ships that go boom usage with changes to make pvp squad vs squad possible. Then big fights win.

To quote Lfod Shi

The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#352 - 2015-08-28 15:23:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Jill Xelitras wrote:
Kaivar Lancer wrote:
I stopped playing Eve for awhile. My main reason:

- Steam just makes alternative games so much cheaper. For $15, you can grab yourself a few cheap games that can entertain you for a month. You can buy $3 bundles from discounters outside of Steam. Basically your library grows every month, and thus your entertainment options. And lets not forget the F2P AAA MMOs that have saturated the market (like SWTOR or LOTRO).

But with Eve, $15 just buys you the same experience. Meh.


Yes and no ... the 15$ you pay for:

- Server upkeep. If EvE was run by EA, Ubisoft ... it would have been shut-down a long time ago.
- Continuous bug-fixing. Major publishers don't like spending money on bug-fixing.
- "Free expansions". Other publishers choose paid expansions, DLC, micro-transaction pay-walls ...
- Ongoing support. Yeah, we know CCP is slow ... but they do offer support. Sometimes they even help on the forum ... 12 years after the game was released.
-edit: - CCP hunting down and banning cheaters
- additional services: VoIP, streaming of the alliance tournament, o7 web-show, moderated forum ...

additional benefits you get:
- players who actually want to play EvE ... why would you pay a monthly sub or work ingame towards a PLEX if it wasn't because you like playing EvE.
- No little kiddies (This alone is worth the money)
- the feeling that the ship you just lost or made somebody else lose is actually meaningful / painful. Recently again somebody got his ship blown up with 30 PLEX inside, which dropped btw.
I just bought the lifetime expansion pass for Elite. Now I get all the support, bugifxes, expansions and such with no monthly cost.

The only additional cost will be a HTC vive when it comes out (and is confirmed compatible) so I can splode people in VR too.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

xxxTRUSTxxx
Galactic Rangers
#353 - 2015-08-28 15:54:13 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
I just bought the lifetime expansion pass for Elite. Now I get all the support, bugifxes, expansions and such with no monthly cost.


oh no,,, you mean you hope you'll get all that support and bugfixes and expansions and such with no monthly fee,, you hope you'll get it Roll

Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#354 - 2015-08-28 15:59:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Market McSelling Alt
Markus Reese wrote:
Why is it people mix up disliking blob warfare for disliking large fights. I love large fights. But I dislike press F1. Increasing smaller ships that go boom usage with changes to make pvp squad vs squad possible. Then big fights win.



Because smaller easier to kill ships means players stop PVPing when used in context of large fleet fights.

No one in their right mind is going to stage, plan, wait, move, wait, wait some more and three hours later get a fleet fight between hundreds of destroyers that instapop before even 1/10 the other fleet gets a lock on it.

3 hours of waiting and comms for 3 seconds of pvp... no thanks

At least with Capitals it takes a bit of time, there is a change of logistics and each boom is "special" and worth something.

Besides, ever tried to fight in TiDi in a Vengeance?

Make the fights smaller, then you can make the ships smaller in the fight.

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.

Jill Xelitras
Xeltec services
#355 - 2015-08-28 16:01:48 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
I just bought the lifetime expansion pass for Elite. Now I get all the support, bugifxes, expansions and such with no monthly cost.

The only additional cost will be a HTC vive when it comes out (and is confirmed compatible) so I can splode people in VR too.


The thing with money is that people and companies prefer to have money now, rather then a promise to get paid later. It's even sensible because inflation devalues your currency: 100$ today buys you more than 100$ in a year will. You could also earn interest on the 100$, so you would have more money at the end of the year. Basically you're just paying up front instead of partial payments.

To Frontier Development this is money that they can invest in the expansions they are planning without having to borrow. It's also advantageous to get paid up front because it makes financial planning easier. Players on a monthly subscription fee can leave your game anytime and stop their payments any month. Players who paid up-front, have already given you 12 months worth of subscrition fee.(Elite doesn't have a subscription fee afaik. So bad example. I should have said that youre paying the expansions up-front.) You may have noticed that for Elite this offer was limited in time, so only a small chunk of players would commit to this deal. What you got is a sort of discount. Nothing magical there.

Sorry I'm rambling. My point is. Somebody always pays the bill. There is no such thing as a free ride. You get free fries with a menu only ? Guess where the price of the fries is hidden.

Don't anger the forum gods.

ISD Buldath:

> I Saw, I came, I Frowned, I locked, I posted, and I left.

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#356 - 2015-08-28 16:02:12 UTC
xxxTRUSTxxx wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I just bought the lifetime expansion pass for Elite. Now I get all the support, bugifxes, expansions and such with no monthly cost.
oh no,,, you mean you hope you'll get all that support and bugfixes and expansions and such with no monthly fee,, you hope you'll get it Roll
I'm confused as to what you mean. I've already been playing since beta and the one time I have needed support I got it quickly. The expansion is already due for this year. I doubt I need to hope to get it, since it seems to be chugging along quite nicely. It's no different from here, hoping CCP don't bork the game every release, hoping that petitions don't sit unanswered for 3 months. the only difference is here people have to pay a fee (though plexing is much nicer these days).

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#357 - 2015-08-28 16:23:33 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
xxxTRUSTxxx wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I just bought the lifetime expansion pass for Elite. Now I get all the support, bugifxes, expansions and such with no monthly cost.
oh no,,, you mean you hope you'll get all that support and bugfixes and expansions and such with no monthly fee,, you hope you'll get it Roll
I'm confused as to what you mean. I've already been playing since beta and the one time I have needed support I got it quickly. The expansion is already due for this year. I doubt I need to hope to get it, since it seems to be chugging along quite nicely. It's no different from here, hoping CCP don't bork the game every release, hoping that petitions don't sit unanswered for 3 months. the only difference is here people have to pay a fee (though plexing is much nicer these days).



The other difference is Elite is still growing...

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.

Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#358 - 2015-08-28 18:01:26 UTC
Jill Xelitras wrote:
Foxstar Damaskeenus wrote:
I have a few good suggestions. First off though I have to say one reason I haven't played eve too much lately is that it is too good of a game in some aspects. I log on to Warthunder occasionally and shoot down some Germans in my Spitfire for an hour and call it a night. Eve online requires some commitment to truly enjoy. Unfortunately I just don't desire to put in that much time.

Secondly, part of Eve's brilliance is that the players create the great content. That being said I have logged on many times in different alliances sitting behind my screen waiting with tons of other people for someone to make fun. The only time, myself I ever was able to lead fleets was when I was moving and didn't have to work a few months. After telling people what to do all day at my job without pissing them off I'm simply mentally incapable of leading a fleet.

So here's my take.

1. Create things in the universe that are worth fighting for. There should be new and fun PVE in highsec but people need to yearn to go to null to mine, etc.

2. On the leadership thing, could Eve implement some sort of matchmaking system where leaders can find followers for a few hours to roam or play with.

3. When the "this is eve" thing came out with player comms in the videos it seemed to fire many people up and get some new recruits. So marketing marketing marketing. In our aviation charter business we have plenty of regular customers that fly on our planes, probably enough to sustain us for a few years but we never stop working tirelessly to get people interested, even cable companies advertise and in many areas of the USA you don't have options if you want TV/internet, yet they still market.

4. If the blue donut or whatever is hurting content than have a few CCP employees log in to ships and go destroy something player owned or controlled. Make an event or whatever.



Regarding your suggestions:

4. What good is a sandbox without sand ? CCP needs to stay neutral toward players.

3. I agree, but I think that CCP is budgeting to market Gunjack, Valkyrie and possibly Legion.

2. You can create an open fleet ... it's called fleetfinder .... or did CCP remove that while I was not looking Bear

1. They just did add Drifter Incursions. Concerning mining in 0.0 ... for that miners just need to join a nullsec alliance with a mining branch. Those who stay in highsec, don't want to leave and that's fine. High-sec is just overly profitable when you compare the risk vs reward from various places. IMO PI should never have been allowed in high-sec systems. Low-sec needs a buff. Yeah FW is not all of low-sec.


The income from PI in highsec is so low i consider it negative income because you could make more isk per hour afk mining veldspar.

While i agree some things you can do in highsec probably need an income nerf most of what you can do in highsec pays very little. It isnt an overabundance of isk per hour that keeps so many in highsec its the serious reduction in encounters per hour with harassment that keeps so many in highsec.

Lowsec is the most lawless place to play EVE, no reasonable enticement is going to bring significantly more people to that type of environment.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.

Seven Koskanaiken
Shadow Legions.
Insidious.
#359 - 2015-08-28 18:29:06 UTC
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Webvan wrote:
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
So, while you are at the bar getting one under, I will be talking with the people who don't have a one track vision of the demise of this game.

lol EVE is Dying™

yeah uh-huh, it only counts if you like the changes, whether or not others do, otherwise it doesn't count.
Anyway, like I've shown, EVE isn't in some demise, only evolving. EVE has been dying for over 10yrs now Roll



If your idea of dying is tripling its user base... then yeah sure.

Now, in the last two years, yes it has been dying.

But basically, since you appear to be completely giving up the argument you were so obviously wrong on, I must point out. *snip* Personal insults not necessary. ~ ISD Decoy

Anyone can look at the graphs, the data, and see there is a problem. If you can't, then it must be because you can't understand math.


A stopped clock is right twice a day.
Eli Stan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#360 - 2015-08-28 18:56:08 UTC
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Eve players crack me up...

"We need to get rid of blobs and make smaller groups viable in pvp"

ten seconds later

"64 player combat limit... oh heck no"

I get it, but I don't. Oh well. Everyone must just mean that they don't want to GET blobbed, they just want to BE the blob.


That's part of it, sure.
Also, the different statements likely come from different people with different playstyles.

Personally, I find myself bored with arena-based multiplayer. As in, join a server with up to 63 other people also connected, your character gets loaded up, you PvP for a while, then you log off and go back to your PvE game. It works for a lot of games, of course - Quake Arena, TF2, CS, CoD, etc. But it's not for me. I would never want EVE artificially limited somehow so that only 64 could be involved in a fight. EVE is more dynamic, more flowing, more unpredictable - and therefore interesting and meaningful - than that.

What I'd love to see introduced into New Eden so that small gangs can have a chance against large ones is the concept of terrain. A logi buff is a force multiplier than helps large groups as much as, or more than, small groups. But terrain - cover, choke points, small areas of "high ground" - can help small gangs much more than large ones. Think of the 300 movie - imagine a deadspace pocket into which only five ships per minute can enter. Or anomalies that give HP/DPS buffs within a 1km radius, and the buffs get stronger then longer a ship is in range so that a small gang can set up there and stand a better chance of fighting off an approaching large gang if they have enough time to prepare. Or imagine a grid with warpable objects scattered all over the place so that a small nimble force can mobilize around a larger less coordinated gang and pick off vulnerable stragglers. (Some of this is impractical or unworkable or useless, but I'm trying to express the general idea, not necessarily present a solution of polished mechanics.)

So on equal terms - the larger force should prevail over the smaller. But it'd be cool to see ways to make a 5-person fleet as strong as a 10-person fleet, while a 100-person fleet only works like a 105-person fleet.