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Decline in numbers... starting to turn into RAPID!!!

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Britney Fears
EVE Corporation 98582134
#301 - 2015-08-27 20:58:13 UTC
Black Pedro wrote:
Britney Fears wrote:
Hyperdunking made me quit eve.

Well, if you are quitting Eve over the loss of a few imaginary items that only exist in a database somewhere then clearly you did not enjoy the game.

Best of luck in finding a game or pass-time you do enjoy.



It makes alot of sense when you put it like that, thank you.
handige harrie
Vereenigde Handels Compagnie
#302 - 2015-08-27 21:07:31 UTC
A lot of gamers want a quick play session of something without a lot of commitment to a game. Without wanting to commit a lot, EVE is a boring game, with boring mechanics that have aged really bad.

To circumvent this they try to do a couple of things like:

not wanting to commit money: How do I earn enough isk to earn a plex? / I'm not going to pay real money for my sub.
not wanting to commit effort: EVE should have arenas so we could have fights when we want them. / Why can't my 2 week old character pilot a tech 3, I need it to get to the fun parts of the game.

Which leads to a thought train that ends with them not subscribing to the game, because you can have much more fun somewhere else.

EVE also suffers from a bad case of the same thing Risk suffers from:

It's a great game when you're on equal footing with your opponents. It's a fun game while you are ahead. It's bad if you are losing and/or have no chance to catch up.

Baddest poster ever
Sonya Corvinus
Grant Village
#303 - 2015-08-27 21:14:55 UTC
Odie McCracken wrote:
Quiet, they think they're playing for free :) :)


I took a few econ classes in grad school. We covered this lovely thing called 'opportunity cost' that a few people around here need to look up

For all you PLEXers
Koebmand
Silverflames
#304 - 2015-08-27 21:39:28 UTC
Avvy wrote:

PLEX is here to stay, too much of a money spinner.


I have no doubt you are right.

Avvy wrote:

But anyway more games are starting to do similar.


Yes, very hard to find a game worth playing these days.
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#305 - 2015-08-27 21:54:00 UTC
handige harrie wrote:
A lot of gamers want a quick play session of something without a lot of commitment to a game. Without wanting to commit a lot, EVE is a boring game, with boring mechanics that have aged really bad.

To circumvent this they try to do a couple of things like:

not wanting to commit money: How do I earn enough isk to earn a plex? / I'm not going to pay real money for my sub.
not wanting to commit effort: EVE should have arenas so we could have fights when we want them. / Why can't my 2 week old character pilot a tech 3, I need it to get to the fun parts of the game.

Which leads to a thought train that ends with them not subscribing to the game, because you can have much more fun somewhere else.

EVE also suffers from a bad case of the same thing Risk suffers from:

It's a great game when you're on equal footing with your opponents. It's a fun game while you are ahead. It's bad if you are losing and/or have no chance to catch up.


Which is,why eve works as a subs/niche game. Some players like what you mentioned. Patience play, thought and planning. Intensity. As long as the team has its bills paid, then needing a million subs isnt that big of deal. The issue is that the player base that longs for a intellectual approach gets disenfranchised by lack of stimulation. We get lockex into repetition then just drift off.

To quote Lfod Shi

The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
Darek Castigatus
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#306 - 2015-08-27 21:55:53 UTC
What i think a lot of people are missing is thats theres a general downturn in MMO numbers at the moment, its not just eve and Wow. Pretty much every major MMO has seen a fall in numbers or a slowing of growth over the past three to four months.

TLDR It isn't just EvE, this is happening in the whole MMO market.

Pirates - The Invisible Fist of Darwin

you're welcome
Spookay
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#307 - 2015-08-27 22:03:16 UTC
Darek Castigatus wrote:
What i think a lot of people are missing is thats theres a general downturn in MMO numbers at the moment, its not just eve and Wow. Pretty much every major MMO has seen a fall in numbers or a slowing of growth over the past three to four months.

TLDR It isn't just EvE, this is happening in the whole MMO market.



Wrong. I hate all the new changes from phoebe onward. I let all my subs lapse. The tedium CCP is adding to this game is making it dumb.

Major null alliances are dying. The meta is broken. Big fights are dying. Major wars are a thing of the past.

CCP broke nullsec... and **** playing in lowsec or highsec.
Scalding Holland
Doomheim
#308 - 2015-08-27 22:36:44 UTC
[quote=handige harrie EVE should have arenas so we could have fights when we want them. / Why can't my 2 week old character pilot a tech [/quote]


Go back to World of Warcraft
Dominique Vasilkovsky
#309 - 2015-08-27 22:59:46 UTC
Well it will be -1 tomorrow as I'm in the middle of giving away everything including this char. Quite funny how I have gone from 10 accounts during a peak in 2008 to 0 by this time tomorrow.
Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#310 - 2015-08-27 23:30:21 UTC
Dominique Vasilkovsky wrote:
Well it will be -1 tomorrow as I'm in the middle of giving away everything including this char. Quite funny how I have gone from 10 accounts during a peak in 2008 to 0 by this time tomorrow.

Well people do burn out. I played one mmo (among many) for years and years, finally I just couldn't any longer. But some people have played games like gemstone (a subscription mud) for 20 years. There are not really many choices for people like me that like the more old-school first gen style mmo's, and where I see most/all new ones as just trash with their instanced, casual and global f2p model and all that junk.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#311 - 2015-08-27 23:42:26 UTC
Just reading the general comments that aren't off-topic and it seems like a growing trend here and on Reddit.

1) CCP completely ignored high-sec, with the exception of the burner missions (which are generally disliked)
2) CCP paid too much attention to Null, and went in a direction that was not very popular
3) CCP screwed certain WH groups with changes to Null holes, adding statics to C4's and the Mass based distance spawn.
4) CCP completely forgot there was low-sec in this game
5) 6 week patch cycles suck

Just anecdotal observation, nothing scientific here. But I think a combo of these 5 killed the game as we knew it.

You can't make everyone happy all the time... but damn if CCP didn't make all the people unhappy all the time. Shocked

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.
Painkill3r
Perkone
Caldari State
#312 - 2015-08-27 23:46:44 UTC
Dominique Vasilkovsky wrote:
Well it will be -1 tomorrow as I'm in the middle of giving away everything including this char. Quite funny how I have gone from 10 accounts during a peak in 2008 to 0 by this time tomorrow.


Feel free to toss a few credits my way, old friend.
Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#313 - 2015-08-28 00:05:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Webvan
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Just reading the general comments that aren't off-topic and it seems like a growing trend here and on Reddit.

1) CCP completely ignored high-sec, with the exception of the burner missions (which are generally disliked)
2) CCP paid too much attention to Null, and went in a direction that was not very popular
3) CCP screwed certain WH groups with changes to Null holes, adding statics to C4's and the Mass based distance spawn.
4) CCP completely forgot there was low-sec in this game
5) 6 week patch cycles suck

Just anecdotal observation, nothing scientific here. But I think a combo of these 5 killed the game as we knew it.

You can't make everyone happy all the time... but damn if CCP didn't make all the people unhappy all the time. Shocked

Why I don't bother with reddit, let me count the ways ... nm

Well I remember back in 2012 and before with EVE being a buggy and broken game more or less. After incarna and the mass riots, CCP changed direction, headed for a full reiteration and bug fix end to end starting with noob space. 3 years, that's three years, and they finally made it out to null, and you want to complain?? just lol
I'm not even a nullbear, and I can recognize SOV had this coming for three years now, waiting patiently in line. Now people want to whine as if CCP never did a thing for high and low? Bartender, I'll have what he's having, make it a double Lol

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#314 - 2015-08-28 00:52:22 UTC
Webvan wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
Webvan wrote:
Bob Maths wrote:
Perhaps CCP needs to adapt to the modern market and stop trying to peddle a product that is quite niche.

We're not here to play a modern market game. Games that change to get a different type of player, fail.

I was thinking there's some validity to that statement about wider appeal. I made a suggestion about offering a real money prize for the Alliance Tournament, funded by vanity or special edition item sales. I agree with the statement about mainstream appeal because current tournament prizes are in-game items which to an outsider are unappealing for being part of a closed system.

Offering real money is superior because real world currency is something everyone can relate to.

EVE could stand to be more relevant, and a great way to do that is offer tournament prizes that outside gamers and non-gamers can understand.

But you gotta think who does it appeal to. You have a target audiance and need a way to reach them with a message you bait the hook with. I think CCP kind of understands this, and the difficulty with putting the right message in the right places for the right people. Probably the best thing they have going right now besides word of mouth by vets is being visible on Steam.

A lot of us didn't know we were uber EVE nerds until we started playing.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
aldhura
Blackjack and Exotic Dancers
Top Tier
#315 - 2015-08-28 00:58:27 UTC
We don't need to guess why numbers are dwindling, when you cancel an account you give a reason, and CCP take the time and effort to read those because they care about their player base.
I personally have clearly articulated my reasons for dropping 3 accounts and I know CCP already have plans in place to resolve my problems. I will check my evemail to see what they are doing the moment my launcher finishes loading, was a big patch its taking a few days now.

YEAH RIGHT!!!!

Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#316 - 2015-08-28 01:29:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Webvan
Rain6637 wrote:
A lot of us didn't know we were uber EVE nerds until we started playing.

Geeks > Nerds Pirate
Actually a lot of growth happened when CCP teamed up with ATARI to publish a box to put on store shelves. Sadly, no more store shelves for PC games X
well apart from boxes of WoW, the SIMS and farm sim or whatever. CCP COULLLD print PLEX codes (to redeem for a PLEX) on those cards like they sell hanging on the racks at Walmart and Best Buy etc. I think that would be the most visible as a PC game can be for a "grab me" advertisement.

Oh and those cards do sell like crazy, I notice like STEAM cards often selling out, also the Minecraft cards. It's about visibility, and PC games have always done traditionally better if they were physically visible somewhere. And I notice adults standing there staring at them, so I know it's not just 12yos buying them all up.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#317 - 2015-08-28 01:41:48 UTC
Webvan wrote:
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Just reading the general comments that aren't off-topic and it seems like a growing trend here and on Reddit.

1) CCP completely ignored high-sec, with the exception of the burner missions (which are generally disliked)
2) CCP paid too much attention to Null, and went in a direction that was not very popular
3) CCP screwed certain WH groups with changes to Null holes, adding statics to C4's and the Mass based distance spawn.
4) CCP completely forgot there was low-sec in this game
5) 6 week patch cycles suck

Just anecdotal observation, nothing scientific here. But I think a combo of these 5 killed the game as we knew it.

You can't make everyone happy all the time... but damn if CCP didn't make all the people unhappy all the time. Shocked

Why I don't bother with reddit, let me count the ways ... nm

Well I remember back in 2012 and before with EVE being a buggy and broken game more or less. After incarna and the mass riots, CCP changed direction, headed for a full reiteration and bug fix end to end starting with noob space. 3 years, that's three years, and they finally made it out to null, and you want to complain?? just lol
I'm not even a nullbear, and I can recognize SOV had this coming for three years now, waiting patiently in line. Now people want to whine as if CCP never did a thing for high and low? Bartender, I'll have what he's having, make it a double Lol



First of all you must be joking. They have redone SOV twice and introduced changes to FW, WH, Null space, Exploration. In the same time they rightfully nerfed Incursions, eliminated high sec lvl 5's, screwed with Ice and changed pos fuel.

Where do you think Null was left out? Also, 2012 isn't a good year to be doing your benchmark of love anyways, since the game was still growing/stable then. Let's look at 2014/2015 to see why people are leaving the game from Highsec and WHs. Fozzie said there was an increase in Null.

So, while you are at the bar getting one under, I will be talking with the people who don't have a one track vision of the demise of this game.

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.
Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#318 - 2015-08-28 01:48:55 UTC
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
So, while you are at the bar getting one under, I will be talking with the people who don't have a one track vision of the demise of this game.

lol EVE is Dying™

yeah uh-huh, it only counts if you like the changes, whether or not others do, otherwise it doesn't count.
Anyway, like I've shown, EVE isn't in some demise, only evolving. EVE has been dying for over 10yrs now Roll

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#319 - 2015-08-28 03:11:28 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Decoy
Webvan wrote:
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
So, while you are at the bar getting one under, I will be talking with the people who don't have a one track vision of the demise of this game.

lol EVE is Dying™

yeah uh-huh, it only counts if you like the changes, whether or not others do, otherwise it doesn't count.
Anyway, like I've shown, EVE isn't in some demise, only evolving. EVE has been dying for over 10yrs now Roll



If your idea of dying is tripling its user base... then yeah sure.

Now, in the last two years, yes it has been dying.

But basically, since you appear to be completely giving up the argument you were so obviously wrong on, I must point out. *snip* Personal insults not necessary. ~ ISD Decoy

Anyone can look at the graphs, the data, and see there is a problem. If you can't, then it must be because you can't understand math.

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.
James Cannon Fodder
Doomheim
#320 - 2015-08-28 04:43:51 UTC
I think a lot of old players felt betrayed when their supercaps got nerfed. A year of SP lost just because new players didn't like getting blown up. Myself I felt kind of put off when the "resource efficiency" Industry skill got replaced with "Advanced Industry" and I'd just spent a week training it to 5. I can only imagine how someone might feel after studying a supercap skill to max and seeing their supercap nerfed.




Is the game really losing revenue, though?

Fewer players online doesn't necessarily mean less money collected from PLEX, "Account services", Aurum, or even subscriptions. I kept 4 accounts subbed for months when I had no time at all to play, just to keep my characters growing in SP.