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2 ganking questions

Author
zzzra
New Eden Shipwright LLC
#1 - 2015-08-27 06:10:36 UTC
1. I'm wondering if buying an industrial ship with a covert ops cloaking device (viator) will let me move stuff in hisec around pretty much safe from gate campers in destroyers. I'm guessing that 100% safety is impossible, just safe from the average ganker.

2. Is ganking more difficult in a 1.0 system than a 0.5? Or is there some other reason they would be less inclined to gank in 1.0?
Trevor Dalech
Nobody in Local
Of Sound Mind
#2 - 2015-08-27 06:20:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Trevor Dalech
If you have insta dock/undock bookmarks, and ALWAYS use your cloak, you should be 99.99% safe. The only risk is if you happen to get decloaked by something.

Most viators get blown up because they fail to turn on their cloak for some reason (because they are autopiloting for example)
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#3 - 2015-08-27 06:30:36 UTC
Best bet if you want to learn how not to be ganked is to try your hand at ganking for a while yourself. You'll learn a lot and that information will help you evade gankers.

A viator that has a cloak and doesn't screw up is very hard to kill. As is, for that matter, a tanked freighter with a combat and utility escort (something I've only seen a couple of times).

On 0.5 and 1.0 - CONCORD will show up considerably faster in a 1.0 system. This means we need more firepower to pop you and it costs us more (in both ships and player time), and it also means our available resources might not be up to the task at all. So yes, 1.0 is less unsafe than 0.5, but an Iteron even under gate gun protection can still be ganked easily by two players in cheap ships in a 1.0.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com

Azda Ja
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2015-08-27 06:37:38 UTC
+1 for asking how to deal with it instead of demanding it be removed.

Grrr.

Bitevni Shalina
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2015-08-27 07:37:38 UTC
zzzra wrote:
1. I'm wondering if buying an industrial ship with a covert ops cloaking device (viator) will let me move stuff in hisec around pretty much safe from gate campers in destroyers. I'm guessing that 100% safety is impossible, just safe from the average ganker.

2. Is ganking more difficult in a 1.0 system than a 0.5? Or is there some other reason they would be less inclined to gank in 1.0?


1. Basically - yes. With proper fit (tank and agility) you will give gankers hard time to catch you. But it is not 100 procent impossible. Another good option for very low volume is Luxury Yacht. Fitted with factional inertia stabs or full set of Genolution implants it can warp in less, than 2 seconds. Best ship to move skill books or blue prints. Specialized gallente transports are better suited to move goods in safe high sec and Wreath is the best T1 industrial ship for mwd/cloak, IMHO.

Actually, you do not really need viator to move goods in high sec. Ship itself is expensive and if you get even more expensive stuff in it - you will be ganked even in 1.0 anyway. If you need a test - join gallente militia and try to jump from Erma to Villore. Even empty gallente militia transport will be insta locked and poped in a matter of second. So key thing is not transport too much expensive stuff in one time. Specialized gallente transports are better suited to move goods in safe high sec.

I would never ever in any ship undock in major trade hub or come to the any gate with PLEX in my cargo.

2. Yes, cause concord reaction time is shorter.
0.5: Roughly 19 seconds
0.6: Roughly 14 seconds
0.7 : Roughly 10 seconds
0.8 : Roughly 7 seconds
0.9 and 1.0: Roughly 6 seconds

But there is ways how to keep concord from comming much longer by distracting it somewhere far far away from you.

This is what I would use:
[Viator, warp stab]
'Halcyon' Core Equalizer I
'Halcyon' Core Equalizer I
'Halcyon' Core Equalizer I

10MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner
Large F-S9 Regolith Compact Shield Extender
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II

Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
[empty high slot]

Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing II
Medium Cargohold Optimization II

Giant Secure Container
Huge Secure Container
Large Standard Container

Warp away time is about 4,5 second. Warp stabilizers cause I suck in reaction time.

[Viator, agility]
Inertial Stabilizers II
Inertial Stabilizers II
Inertial Stabilizers II

10MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner
Large F-S9 Regolith Compact Shield Extender
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II

Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
[empty high slot]

Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing II
Medium Cargohold Optimization II

Giant Secure Container
Huge Secure Container
Large Standard Container

Warp away time is less, then 3 seconds. Which can be more safe if you are good in clicking and pressing buttons, cause gankers probably has more than 3 effective points, so 3 stabs will not save you.
Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#6 - 2015-08-27 08:39:45 UTC
I use a Blockade Runner for most of my high sec hauling and my only loss was docking in Jita, If you land outside the docking ring, gankers will have time for an alpha shot.

You can deal with this either by making an insta-dock bookmark or by fitting a buffer tank - being lazy, I chose to tank my ship and have survived a subsequent ganking attempt.

Gankers can't scan a blockade runner so they are playing roulette when they attack one - hoping the cargo drop is worth more than their ship.

At gates in high-sec your only real risk is getting de-cloaked by a nearby ship. Since a blockade runner can warp in 4 seconds, you should be OK if your tank can survive the alpha shot from a Tornado. I fit a large shield extender and 2 shield resistance amplifiers for 20K EHP which has been sufficient thus far.
Black Pedro
Mine.
#7 - 2015-08-27 11:42:12 UTC
zzzra wrote:
1. I'm wondering if buying an industrial ship with a covert ops cloaking device (viator) will let me move stuff in hisec around pretty much safe from gate campers in destroyers. I'm guessing that 100% safety is impossible, just safe from the average ganker.

The Blockade Runner is a good choice for small things. As was said, always using the cloak and having insta-dock and undocks will keep you safe.

And a good alternative is the Deep Space Transport. Fit with an active tank and with their overheating bonus, the DSTs can rival freighters in EHP but are much harder to bump. They hold much more than Blockade Runners.

Both need to be actively piloted to be safe though. But flown properly, either will make you 99.9+% safe to casual gankers so only if you do something extremely silly (like stuffing many billions of ISK of goods in) to attract attention will you be at any real risk.
Shiloh Templeton
Cheyenne HET Co
#8 - 2015-08-27 19:20:37 UTC
Black Pedro wrote:
And a good alternative is the Deep Space Transport. Fit with an active tank and with their overheating bonus, the DSTs can rival freighters in EHP but are much harder to bump. They hold much more than Blockade Runners.
The good news is that training for a blockade runner will automatically give you access to the same racial deep transport - so you might take that into consideration when you choose which BR to train for.

I use a blockade runner for anything of high value that doesn't fit in a Stratios. The BR is quite fast! Suggest you fit it with cargohold rigs and then use the low slots for agility, tank or cargo as needed. BR will also allow you to expand your horizons into low sec and WH's.


ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2015-08-27 20:04:51 UTC
Bitevni Shalina wrote:

Actually, you do not really need viator to move goods in high sec. Ship itself is expensive and if you get even more expensive stuff in it - you will be ganked even in 1.0 anyway.

The Viator is immune to cargo scanners. Gankers can not tell if you have nothing or 500 PLEX in your cargohold. This is important because even empty you are at a much higher risk of getting ganked than any other empty ship in game and the ship is not cheap to begin with. So if you buy one you need to be on your toes at all times, full of expensive cargo or empty.

Want to talk? Join Cara's channel in game: House Forelli

Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#10 - 2015-08-27 21:19:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
You don't need w-stabs nor tank on a blockade runner Roll because if you are uncloaked ANYWHERE, boom!

The covert cloak is a blockade runner's tank. When this module is inactive, there is no tank! Boom!

All the blockade runners have roughly the same stats when fitted "properly" = roughly 8k m3 of cargo. All of them can be fitted differently however, emphasizing one or more attributes at the expense of others. The Amarr Prorator is arguably the most flexible BR.

There are some people that will tell you to fit for speed and agility, but that really isn't needed in hisec or lowsec. However, it can help when dodging bubbles in nulsec and w-space.

Cargo expander rigs and modules, as well as i-stabs, are considered bad by people that don't know the differences between the ships, nor when to use these rigs and modules.

Insta-dock and undock bookmarks are ESSENTIAL on stations you frequent.

Tip: Jita 4 Moon 1 is aligned with the 4-4 undock. It is really easy to make an insta-undock bookmark between them.

Tip: Amarr botttom-eject undocks are easy to bookmark if you turn-on tactical, click on the station, and fly down the line in a shuttle or fast frigate.

Example: My Caldari Cranes are fitted with T2 Cargo rigs, and I always carry i-stabs and cargo expanders for the low-slots, and change them as needed with preference to i-stabs. I also fit EM amp to fill the massive 0% EM hole when cloacked. MWD and invulnerability field (only useful when unclocked, so OVERLOAD!!) round-out the fit. I wouldn't fit the other BR like this though.

I take shortcut trips through lowsec all the time in my Crane (my Crane has been in nulsec and w-space too). I've only lost one Crane in the past 6 years, and that was in Jita when I accidentally warped to station instead of my insta-dock bookmark.
Paranoid Loyd
#11 - 2015-08-27 21:21:21 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
You don't need w-stabs nor tank on a blockade runner Roll because if you are uncloaked ANYWHERE, boom!
QFT

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!

Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#12 - 2015-08-28 00:03:29 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Tip: Amarr botttom-eject undocks are easy to bookmark if you turn-on tactical, click on the station, and fly down the line in a shuttle or fast frigate.

You can also use the tac overview on many other stations where the undock aligns along one of the sets of numbers :)

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager

Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#13 - 2015-08-28 01:21:38 UTC
I just moved 8bil in a blockade runner through most of the prominent ganking systems a few nights ago. Although 9/10 times I'm empty or carrying <100m in stuff. on my alts that can fly them I usually just use them like shuttles in case I want to pick something up on the way.

I'd also say your main problem will be someone with a tornado or two that is bored and wants a kill. Don't see any shiny haulers so might as well play a blockade runner lottery before bed.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Malt Zedong
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2015-08-28 08:43:29 UTC
When you decide to take on the non-combat road, You have to take it to the heart. Your most important shield is info.
If you take all the steps to ensure your ship can survive but you go around talking too much or making jokes about valueables and trips you take, you just seeking your own demise.

Do not underestimate the capacity for people to be on the watch for you. First and foremost, if you take the transport of valuables seriously, get it done by a pilot that only does that. That pilot wont talk on local, wont talk on corp (should not even be in your corp), wont express views in forums, it must be stealthy as a pilot before it is in flying a ship.

That alone will ensure a lot about you not getting ganked. Contracts and market offers are created often with the intent of taking you into dangerous routes so people can gank you, not only for the cargo, but for the colateral or for your personality itself. When you get a anonymous alt, people doing that will be on the look out for your corp, your name, and often will dismiss unknown seemingly uninteresting pilots. Take that to your advantage.

After you are secure that your pilot are only at the mercy of case by case evaluation on the spot, then you start worrying about how to fit your ship.

WorldTradersGuild.Com [WTG] - We are here for the long haul.

McChicken Combo HalfMayo
The Happy Meal
#15 - 2015-08-28 11:30:39 UTC  |  Edited by: McChicken Combo HalfMayo
If you're patient the Deep Space Transport is the way to go in highsec. I can understand the need for speed though. I'd pick the Crane for highsec in those cases. You've got 4 mid slot and T2 resists which gives you a beefy enough tank.

You can also go with the Viator, which aligns in 2.0 seconds with 3 x Domination Inertials and a Nomad set. Very tough to catch that.

There are all our dominion

Gate camps: "Its like the lowsec watercooler, just with explosions and boose" - Ralph King-Griffin

Kairos Antilles
Doomheim
#16 - 2015-08-30 08:46:29 UTC
Do Little wrote:
I use a Blockade Runner for most of my high sec hauling...


Don't let your management read that.
Desert Frog
Doomheim
#17 - 2015-08-30 09:51:09 UTC
Kairos Antilles wrote:
Do Little wrote:
I use a Blockade Runner for most of my high sec hauling...


Don't let your management read that.


Too late.

Bedouin of the galactic shipping lanes...

قد البراغيث من ألف الجمال تغزو أولئك الذين فريسة على الضفادع

Luther Mandrix1 Hemanseh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2015-08-30 10:56:32 UTC
Trevor Dalech wrote:
If you have insta dock/undock bookmarks, and ALWAYS use your cloak, you should be 99.99% safe. The only risk is if you happen to get decloaked by something.

Most viators get blown up because they fail to turn on their cloak for some reason (because they are autopiloting for example)


How many meters from the station do you make Dock bookmarks and undock Bookmark
How do you use a insta undock Bookmark?

How do you sort your Bookmarks so its not a mess?
Luther Mandrix1 Hemanseh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2015-08-30 10:57:47 UTC
Luther Mandrix1 Hemanseh wrote:
Trevor Dalech wrote:
If you have insta dock/undock bookmarks, and ALWAYS use your cloak, you should be 99.99% safe. The only risk is if you happen to get decloaked by something.

Most viators get blown up because they fail to turn on their cloak for some reason (because they are autopiloting for example)


How many meters from the station do you make Dock bookmarks and undock Bookmark
How do you use a insta undock Bookmark?

How do you sort your Bookmarks so its not a mess?



So at Gates i can mark a Bookmark to get me closer to it than just warping to gate as normal.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#20 - 2015-08-30 15:13:38 UTC
Luther Mandrix1 Hemanseh wrote:
Trevor Dalech wrote:
If you have insta dock/undock bookmarks, and ALWAYS use your cloak, you should be 99.99% safe. The only risk is if you happen to get decloaked by something.

Most viators get blown up because they fail to turn on their cloak for some reason (because they are autopiloting for example)


How many meters from the station do you make Dock bookmarks and undock Bookmark
How do you use a insta undock Bookmark?

How do you sort your Bookmarks so its not a mess?
https://youtu.be/AkBa57JL3Nc
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