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Missions designed for frigates, for cruisers, etc.

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Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#41 - 2015-08-13 00:07:56 UTC
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
CCP's AI is several orders of magnitude less complex than your average basic calculator. It makes flatworms look positively brilliant by comparison. I don't know if it's even fit to be called AI. It'd be nice to see some actual AI programmed in for once. It can't be that difficult.



It's a cool idea to have missions in which you repair or warp disrupt, or perform other tasks. One point, though: sieged dreadnoughts cannot be remote-repped. It gave me an idea for a mission, however:

Do you want to fly a dreadnought?

Greetings, pilot.

A short time ago we intercepted a message from a nearby Serpentis pirate base being built in secrecy. It would seem they plan to spy on us to discover weaknesses in our convoy defenses. They wish to steal supplies. We could have eliminated them quickly by sending in a proper military force, but it was deemed to expensive to match the threat these pirates pose.

That's where you come in.

There is a band of volunteer militia working to find inexpensive solutions to some of our, shall we say, neglected problems. These brilliant soldiers and engineers have designed what they claim is a working replica of a Moros dreadnought, although I've seen it and I can tell you it is little more than a giant heap of tritanium scrap metal. Nevertheless, they want to field test it but they need a capsuleer pilot to control it.

That's where you come in...oh wait I already said that.

Anyway, it's a fairly simple design setup despite its size, thus you won't need proper capital ship training to pilot the beast. Just fly your capsule to the coordinates I've put into your Neocom, and they will instruct you on how to proceed from there.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Pilot your capsule to the mission coordinates.

Once you arrive at the mission coordinates, you find yourself at a large shipyard with a Moros dreadnought nearby. You are instructed to board the ship. It requires nothing more than spaceship command I to pilot, and no skills are needed to activate any of the modules. The ship is not equipped with a proper warp drive or jump drive. Upon boarding, you will find it is equipped with a capital armor repairer, a siege module, three XL ion blasters, and a complete shiftfit in the rest of the slots, obviously put together by a moron.

They online a nearby acceleration gate (5-10km away from the Moros) and have you approach and activate it to warp into the next pocket. Upon arriving in the pocket, you find yourself about 60km away from a Serpentis hideout station with two large communications arrays nearby, a large defense field generator, and several field hardener modules of various types.

Your mission at this point is to destroy the hideout. Once it's down, mission is complete. It has a lot of hitpoints and, due to the defense field generator, everything here has high resistances. The easiest structures to destroy are the field hardeners. (Protip: destroy the kinetic and thermal hardeners.) Every time a structure is destroyed while either communications array is up, a group of Serpentis rats will spawn and begin attacking. These NPCs are virtually impervious to the Dreadnought's weaponry as it tracks far too slowly. After some time, your friendly militia will send in NPC ships to fight off the Serpentis, but not before you sustain a lot of fire. You simply need to watch how many NPCs you cause to spawn, and make sure you do not overwhelm yourself. Shooting the communications arrays first is the slow but chill way to do the mission. Also, you'll need to watch your optimal and falloff and switch to the best ammo while you slowly drift toward the station attempting to get into antimatter range.



This mission would give newer pilots a chance to see what it feels like to pilot a dreadnought, and perhaps give them a bit more love for their smaller, faster ships.


I would like to see this adapted to a carrier and possibly Titan/super carrier as well.
It would be entertaining, even if the mission payout was low.
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#42 - 2015-08-13 02:11:07 UTC
Joe Risalo wrote:
I would like to see this adapted to a carrier and possibly Titan/super carrier as well.
It would be entertaining, even if the mission payout was low.

Here's some ideas:


1.) A triage mission in which you team up with another logistics carrier (NPC) to keep some dreadnoughts alive while they blast away at incoming enemy dreadnoughts. Sometimes you have to activate the triage module in order to rep fast enough to keep them alive, other times you have to be out of triage mode so you can spider tank and maintain capacitor. The NPC will react to your triage state and match it, and will likewise match capacitor transfers you apply to it. You also get to order the NPC dreadnoughts to enter siege mode. You can query them to discover their capacitor level and they will give a delayed response similar to a real pilot. You can fill up their capacitor with cap transfers and then order them into siege mode so they can self-rep incoming DPS while you focus reps on another dreadnought.


2.) A titan mission in which your capital fleet goes up against another capital fleet and you select the most important targets to use the superweapon against, also considering resistances because if you fail to kill the target, the enemy may just rep it back up. Periodically a nearby structure will recharge your superweapon, allowing it to be re-fired sooner so that it can be used multiple times during one battle. You can focus fire on a target that resists your superweapon, and finish it off with the superweapon when its EHP gets low enough. Alternatively, you could, for instance, use it to take out shields that are weak to it, and command dreads with a different damage type to finish off the armor.


3.) A multiplayer co-op mission in which each player gets a capital ship of their choice and you have to work together to defeat the enemy capital fleet.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#43 - 2015-08-13 02:31:03 UTC
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
Joe Risalo wrote:
I would like to see this adapted to a carrier and possibly Titan/super carrier as well.
It would be entertaining, even if the mission payout was low.

Here's some ideas:


1.) A triage mission in which you team up with another logistics carrier (NPC) to keep some dreadnoughts alive while they blast away at incoming enemy dreadnoughts. Sometimes you have to activate the triage module in order to rep fast enough to keep them alive, other times you have to be out of triage mode so you can spider tank and maintain capacitor. The NPC will react to your triage state and match it, and will likewise match capacitor transfers you apply to it. You also get to order the NPC dreadnoughts to enter siege mode. You can query them to discover their capacitor level and they will give a delayed response similar to a real pilot. You can fill up their capacitor with cap transfers and then order them into siege mode so they can self-rep incoming DPS while you focus reps on another dreadnought.


2.) A titan mission in which your capital fleet goes up against another capital fleet and you select the most important targets to use the superweapon against, also considering resistances because if you fail to kill the target, the enemy may just rep it back up. Periodically a nearby structure will recharge your superweapon, allowing it to be re-fired sooner so that it can be used multiple times during one battle. You can focus fire on a target that resists your superweapon, and finish it off with the superweapon when its EHP gets low enough. Alternatively, you could, for instance, use it to take out shields that are weak to it, and command dreads with a different damage type to finish off the armor.


3.) A multiplayer co-op mission in which each player gets a capital ship of their choice and you have to work together to defeat the enemy capital fleet.


I was more thinking a carrier mission where you actually get to let drones loose to deal damage, but yeah, a triage mission wouldn't be too bad, even though CCP could simply introduce logistics missions for logo ships as opposed to triage carriers.

Honestly, since carrier models aren't that large compared to a BS, I would like to see them rebalanced as sub-capital ships.
Much like an Orca. They can still be classified as carriers, and the title "super Carrier" would actually have more relevance.
Maybe simply take fighters away from them and make super carriers dedicated to fighters and fighter-bombers (those really need a new name).

Retain triage mode, and introduce them to the bastion module.
With Bastion, they'd be able to retain high tank and DPS with sub-fighter drones.

Just a thought... I don't see carriers being used outside plexing and structure repair very often, so it would be a nice change.
Dreads still have enough power to retain their stature as a capital, but carriers have fighters and capital modules. That's the only thing that makes them a capital.
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#44 - 2015-08-13 02:58:50 UTC
Joe Risalo wrote:
I was more thinking a carrier mission where you actually get to let drones loose to deal damage, but yeah, a triage mission wouldn't be too bad, even though CCP could simply introduce logistics missions for logo ships as opposed to triage carriers.

Honestly, since carrier models aren't that large compared to a BS,

I think that's an issue with the models. I've got a screenshot of the Nidhoggur next to a Maelstrom and the Maelstrom has about 80% of the Nidhoggur's length, but I believe that was addressed and fixed already. Please note that although the Nidhoggur in the image is behind the Maelstrom, it is right next to it as opposed to being further away. The impression you get from the image is accurate, as was confirmed by myself very carefully before I took the image.


It'd also be neat to have carrier fighter missions. Those could be simpler, perhaps included in a set of freebie ship missions in which the mission plays out fairly similar to a normal mission but is balanced for something you're less likely to have available (or be trained for) and so instead of asking you to bring your own ship, one is provided. The mission could allow you to bring your own as well, should you own one and be able/willing to take it in. Also, your skills would affect these freebie ships and their modules even though none are required to use/activate anything.


I'd like to keep carriers as capital ships, but I am very open to making mini-capitals: small capital ships that can use stargates and enter highsec but also have jump drives, and can use some capital modules but have limited powergrid. These ships would be Orca-sized, in fact I'd like to re-classify the Orca as a mini-capital and possibly have its powergrid and CPU adjusted to allow it to fit new mini-capital modules. Some possible designs:
1.) Mini-carrier - flies 5-10 drones (not fighters) depending on drone control units fit, powergrid reduction to cost of fitting drone control units
2.) Mini-freighter - carries 100,000-200,000 m3 of freight and also has more fitting capacity than a large freighter, so more room for tank but also faster than large freighter
3.) Capital EWAR platform - uses strong anticapital EWAR that can function against ships in siege/triage/bastion mode as well as against supercapitals. These EWAR modules wouldn't be very effective against supcaps but can be used against them if that's what you want to do. Can be used as a more expensive and sluggish but more durable HIC for tackling titans.
4.) Capital mining barge - everybody is asking for it, just give it the same output as a Covetor with a lot more defenses and a bigger cargohold, and of course make it a lot more expensive than a Hulk. (I realize everyone is asking for a ship that mines faster than a Hulk, but perhaps if CCP gave them this, it would put their intentions on the matter into perspective.)

Mini-capitals would give people some wiggle room between battleships and capital ships, making the transition smoother while also allowing for a wider variety of fleet options for when battleships are too small but capitals are too big.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#45 - 2015-08-13 04:42:22 UTC
We have already talked about mining capital ship and if I do recall the ppular choice was T2 version of Orca. No fleet booster roles but mining focus platform with lot of survivability since it would be only allowed to use in low, null sec.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#46 - 2015-08-13 05:22:23 UTC
Tiddle Jr wrote:
We have already talked about mining capital ship and if I do recall the ppular choice was T2 version of Orca. No fleet booster roles but mining focus platform with lot of survivability since it would be only allowed to use in low, null sec.



That seems fair.

As far as the mini-carrier... I've always been for it.
I've wanted a drone specific boat (not a boat that has drone bonuses but still has guns).

If you take and gave it the ability to fit 5 drone control units (possible utility high), but give no drone damage bonuses,

You get 1063 dps with 10 T2 heavy drones, all skills 5, and 4 drone damage amps.


That, coupled with their tank, is actually a well balanced dps level, when you consider that in order to get utility of logi, they would have to drop drone control units.

I would also suggest they use large modules (instead of using capital or creating a new module class for them).

Then, introduce them to bastion.
Logi would require triage module, while dps would require bastion, which would greatly increase drone control range and drone EHP, as well as give the standard bastion ewar invulnerability.

I'm sure someone could think of a "needed role they fill", but I for one don't give a crap about the difference between wants and needs in a video game.
I want a mini-carrier... I don't NEED Eve, and nothing in Eve would exist if only NEEDs were created.
To the people that would say such a thing.. It's a video game... Have fun and quit stressing..
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