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They need to add some kind of expedition mini ninja Orca
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Talos Emishi
Doomheim
#1 - 2015-08-04 16:28:49 UTC
Myself and two buddy's have grown sick of hi sec mining but do not wish to live in null. To keep out selves interested we have been ninja mining in prospects we have been doing some ninja worm hole gas mining but also alot of low sec ore mining. Though it is fun, it is in no way cost effective. We have zero incentive isk wise to mine jaspet in low sec using prospects when we can fleet mine in exhumers with orca support in Hi sec.

Solution
Buff low sec ore a lil more.

Add new ship.
Covert ops cloak or immune to D scan and warp strength.
Mining boosting capacity
50k m3 ore hold?
Drone bay to deal with rats as Prospects can't
Price tag under 100mill

This will make a small group of null hating ballsy miners happy, and also make low sec pirates happy as they might have more targets.
Carrie-Anne Moss
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2015-08-04 16:33:35 UTC
Talos Emishi wrote:

Covert ops cloak or immune to D scan and warp strength.
Mining boosting capacity
50k m3 ore hold?
Drone bay to deal with rats as Prospects can't
Price tag under 100mill

This will make a small group of null hating ballsy miners happy, and also make low sec pirates happy as they might have more targets.


Lol "new targets" that have covert op cloak, freaking d-scan immunity and +warp strength so cant be pointed....

Yeah sounds legit and balanced.

Bear
Talos Emishi
Doomheim
#3 - 2015-08-04 16:40:19 UTC
Carrie-Anne Moss wrote:
Talos Emishi wrote:

Covert ops cloak or immune to D scan and warp strength.
Mining boosting capacity
50k m3 ore hold?
Drone bay to deal with rats as Prospects can't
Price tag under 100mill

This will make a small group of null hating ballsy miners happy, and also make low sec pirates happy as they might have more targets.


Lol "new targets" that have covert op cloak, freaking d-scan immunity and +warp strength so cant be pointed....

Yeah sounds legit and balanced.

Bear



I did say covert ops OR d scan warp strength.

Also I agree it would not be balanced the risk v reward would still be heavily in favour of sitting in hi sec to mine. It would still be more cost effective to mine in Hi sec than low sec. And there would still be risk, miners would be caught out in low sec regardless. You clearly don't think you could catch anyone you obviously lack confidence in your gank ability's.

They need to coax hi sec miners into low sec, the venture and prospect are not enough.
Carrie-Anne Moss
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2015-08-04 16:43:01 UTC
Please tell me how you lose small fast aligning frigate with covert ops cloak and mwd to gatecamp with mwd/cloak trick. Plus its real easy with covert ops cloak.

Go mine in a WH. There is your increased reward for increased risk right there already buddy.
Go gas mine in venture in WH.

You are NOT welcome
Talos Emishi
Doomheim
#5 - 2015-08-04 16:54:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Talos Emishi
Carrie-Anne Moss wrote:
Please tell me how you lose small fast aligning frigate with covert ops cloak and mwd to gatecamp with mwd/cloak trick. Plus its real easy with covert ops cloak.

Go mine in a WH. There is your increased reward for increased risk right there already buddy.
Go gas mine in venture in WH.

You are NOT welcome



LOL not going to waste my time explaining how, far to many situations and variables, but if you think prospects are immortal and never die then you are more ignorant than you appear as they get blown up every day. Also we were not talking about the prospect we are talking about a support ship for the prospect which being a hauler would be larger with a bigger sig radius and longer align time. If prospects are unkillable and op now go cry about em somewhere else please as they are already in game and considered by most as good additions to the game.

I'm basically requesting a ORE transport ship.. just as killable as the other transport ships, but tailored to support fleet mining has an ore hold instead of regular cargo hold etc.
Lady Ayeipsia
BlueWaffe
#6 - 2015-08-04 17:20:32 UTC
Don't blockade runners have a 60000km corp hanger and +2 warp strength? Or the covert haulers have the cloak but less cargo?

Why not use the tools available before asking for more?
Talos Emishi
Doomheim
#7 - 2015-08-04 17:42:13 UTC
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:
Don't blockade runners have a 60000km corp hanger and +2 warp strength? Or the covert haulers have the cloak but less cargo?

Why not use the tools available before asking for more?


The covert haulers are not fit for task, they have tiny cargo holds might as well bring a 3rd prospect the cargo holds are tiny.

The blockade runners, I already am using it for the purpose I describe. I run 3 prospects and a occator in low sec but need a asualt frig escort for rats as transports and prospects can't deal with low sec rats no drones.

I make a crap ton more per hour with 3 exhumers and an orca and no escort in high sec. I risk nothing in high sec very little anyway as we don't go afk and run tanked skiffs but I make loads more per hour than an expedition to low sec. Thus I would like a transport ship with a similar Ore cargo hold to a blockade runner but also has drones to kill belt rats and some mining bonuses. The devs say risk = reward all the time this would be a step in the right direction to making low sec mining viable. Hope this answers your question.
Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#8 - 2015-08-04 17:52:49 UTC
>Compares mining Jaspet in a mining frigate to highsec ores in a barge/exhumer with Orca buffs.

1- You can mine using barges and exhumers in lowsec, you just need to know how to do it safely.
2- You could even just keep an orca within docking distance of a station for using mining boosts.
3- http://ore.cerlestes.de/#site:ore Stop comparing the worst lowsec ore to the best highsec ores.

Now compare highsec ores with Orca boosts versus lowsec ores with Orca boosts and decide which NPC station you want to base your operations out of. Either use a freighting corporation (Red Frog/Push-X) or get a DST/blockade runner to move your minerals out.

Then get over your fear of nullsec and WH and improve your income further by being able to mine in completely dead end systems with intel channels warning you of any incoming threats.

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager
Talos Emishi
Doomheim
#9 - 2015-08-04 18:05:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Talos Emishi
Eli Apol wrote:
>Compares mining Jaspet in a mining frigate to highsec ores in a barge/exhumer with Orca buffs.

1- You can mine using barges and exhumers in lowsec, you just need to know how to do it safely.
2- You could even just keep an orca within docking distance of a station for using mining boosts.
3- http://ore.cerlestes.de/#site:ore Stop comparing the worst lowsec ore to the best highsec ores.

Now compare highsec ores with Orca boosts versus lowsec ores with Orca boosts and decide which NPC station you want to base your operations out of. Either use a freighting corporation (Red Frog/Push-X) or get a DST/blockade runner to move your minerals out.

Then get over your fear of nullsec and WH and improve your income further by being able to mine in completely dead end systems with intel channels warning you of any incoming threats.


You are talking about living in low sec, with intel channels etc. I am talking about expedition nipping into a system filling up a load and getting out. Doing what you advise is no different than just moving to null sec--- with woste ore of course.
Cyber SGB
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#10 - 2015-08-04 18:15:31 UTC
At first, I thought these ideas were stupid, but I sat down and got to thinking on the subject of Low Sec mining.

I have never seen a barge/exhumer in Low Sec while flying around looking for something to kill. Some people may have, but I think it is very rare.

These ships are very high priority in the greater scheme of things. Without them, the economy would collapse. You would think exhumers and orca's would be developed to have capabilities that allow them to operate in hostile environments or there would be a deployable that help them operate in hostile environments.

Perhaps the ops suggestions have some merit.

What would be wrong with exhumers and an orca type ship having d-scan immunity? There's a combat ship that has d-scan immunity. Should there be another exhumer created that has this ability?

What kind of deployable could there be? Is there already a deployable available?

I believe this subject deserves to be discussed.

I write Kindle books. Visit my author page. http://amazon.com/author/sgbynum
Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#11 - 2015-08-04 18:24:08 UTC
Talos Emishi wrote:
Eli Apol wrote:
>Compares mining Jaspet in a mining frigate to highsec ores in a barge/exhumer with Orca buffs.

1- You can mine using barges and exhumers in lowsec, you just need to know how to do it safely.
2- You could even just keep an orca within docking distance of a station for using mining boosts.
3- http://ore.cerlestes.de/#site:ore Stop comparing the worst lowsec ore to the best highsec ores.

Now compare highsec ores with Orca boosts versus lowsec ores with Orca boosts and decide which NPC station you want to base your operations out of. Either use a freighting corporation (Red Frog/Push-X) or get a DST/blockade runner to move your minerals out.

Then get over your fear of nullsec and WH and improve your income further by being able to mine in completely dead end systems with intel channels warning you of any incoming threats.


You are talking about living in low sec, with intel channels etc. I am talking about expedition nipping into a system filling up a load and getting out. Doing what you advise is no different than just moving to null sec--- with woste ore of course.

In OP you said that you didn't want to live in nullsec but found highsec boring.

You didn't say that you had considered living in lowsec from an NPC station which will be:
- cost effective
- more risky than highsec so you don't get bored
- provide an option for null hating ballsy miners
- make lowsec pirates happy as they have more targets (that aren't in almost uncatchable frigates)

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager
Lucian Trask
Fuel Blocks for Dante
#12 - 2015-08-04 18:27:09 UTC
The devs should look for incentives and add tools to make low sec mining viable. It would be healthy for the game. miners have more fun and so do the pirates. The devs know this they added the venture and prospect, but they need to do more.

Valar Morghulis, Valar Dohaeris
Talos Emishi
Doomheim
#13 - 2015-08-04 18:34:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Talos Emishi
Eli Apol wrote:
Talos Emishi wrote:
Eli Apol wrote:
>Compares mining Jaspet in a mining frigate to highsec ores in a barge/exhumer with Orca buffs.

1- You can mine using barges and exhumers in lowsec, you just need to know how to do it safely.
2- You could even just keep an orca within docking distance of a station for using mining boosts.
3- http://ore.cerlestes.de/#site:ore Stop comparing the worst lowsec ore to the best highsec ores.

Now compare highsec ores with Orca boosts versus lowsec ores with Orca boosts and decide which NPC station you want to base your operations out of. Either use a freighting corporation (Red Frog/Push-X) or get a DST/blockade runner to move your minerals out.

Then get over your fear of nullsec and WH and improve your income further by being able to mine in completely dead end systems with intel channels warning you of any incoming threats.


You are talking about living in low sec, with intel channels etc. I am talking about expedition nipping into a system filling up a load and getting out. Doing what you advise is no different than just moving to null sec--- with woste ore of course.

In OP you said that you didn't want to live in nullsec but found highsec boring.

You didn't say that you had considered living in lowsec from an NPC station which will be:
- cost effective
- more risky than highsec so you don't get bored
- provide an option for null hating ballsy miners
- make lowsec pirates happy as they have more targets (that aren't in almost uncatchable frigates)


Im currently living on a hi sec island and working the surrounding low sec area so I'm all but doing what you suggest useing prospects and a transport. Still it is not worth risking an orca or exhumers in low sec and prospects and a transport can not match Hi sec mining with an orca and exhumers. Something more needs to be added the rewards do not match the risk.
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#14 - 2015-08-04 18:52:12 UTC
LOL





Seriously. I did.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Freya Sertan
Doomheim
#15 - 2015-08-04 19:17:34 UTC
Day tripping in wormholes huffing gas will make you billions in a month with no Orca support and only one smartly piloted Prospect.

I know, I do it every month.

New Eden isn't nice. It isn't friendly. It isn't very hospitiable. Good thing there are people here to shoot in the face.

Want to make New Eden a nice place? Try this out.
Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#16 - 2015-08-04 19:23:44 UTC
Talos Emishi wrote:
Im currently living on a hi sec island and working the surrounding low sec area so I'm all but doing what you suggest useing prospects and a transport. Still it is not worth risking an orca or exhumers in low sec and prospects and a transport can not match Hi sec mining with an orca and exhumers. Something more needs to be added the rewards do not match the risk.

*It's not worth risking taking exhumers and orcas through lowsec gates*

If you live and mine within one carefully chosen lowsec system then the risks are hugely minimised whilst the rewards are hugely increased. That is perhaps what you are looking for.

The risk in piloting a little mining frigate worth almost nothing are not worthy of increased rewards - your suggestion would devalue lowsec ores even more by making them increasingly easy to harvest from a carebear haven in highsec.

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#17 - 2015-08-04 22:34:26 UTC
Actually, a "ninja Orca" would be pretty cool for camping or day tripping wormholes, or even for highsec reshipping shenanigans. Of course, the only thing that is relevant here is the ship maintenance bay so I would be perfectly happy to sacrifice ore space etc.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#18 - 2015-08-05 01:33:44 UTC
be careful what you ask for, the easier something is to do in the game the more people it will attract and the less income per hour you will make.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Ahed Sten
#19 - 2015-08-05 01:39:44 UTC
Providence.

And no, I don't mean the ship.

Your welcome.
Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#20 - 2015-08-05 13:21:42 UTC
Honestly, the orca is my favorite ship in the game. Its the most versatile ship imaginable - you can pack it full of your stuff, have it follow you around and pull it out as you need it - its the swiss army knife of ships. OFC its usefulness in null, wh and low is limited due to its size and speed. Accordingly, I have often wished for other flavors of the ship - in particular I would love to see a combat version of the ship, one that eliminates the ore hold and increases the size of ship bay to allow for say a couple of BS to fit in there, while also changing the skill requirements to eliminate the industry stuff - this ofc is what the bowhead should have been, but CCP brain farted and we got the bowhead, which is singularly uninteresting or particularly useful.

Another version of the orca I would like to see would be sort of a pt tender - make a mini covert ops orca, with just enough room to fit a five or 6 sb, and to carry sufficient fittings and ammo to allow the sb to truly operate deep behind enemy lines without a station. This way the sb can refit and even reship without having to continually go all the way back to civilization.

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
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