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Finally willing to spend money on PC

First post
Author
Tollen Gallen
Glory of Reprisal Enterprise
#1 - 2015-07-24 21:39:47 UTC
No idea what im doing, dont trust myself to build it.
Test build to get some idea of what i should be looking for, really doubt i'll be looking to upgrade in the foreseeable future/ ever.



Intel® Core™i7 Six Core Processor i7-5930K (3.5GHz) 15MB Cache

Motherboard
Gigabyte X99 Gaming 5P: E-ATX, LG2011-3, USB 3.0, SATA 6GBs, XFIRE/SLI

Memory (RAM)
16GB KINGSTON HYPER-X PREDATOR QUAD-DDR4 2666MHz X.M.P (2 x 8GB)

Graphics Card
2x4GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 970 - 2 DVI, 1 HDMI, 1 DP - 3D Vision Ready

1st Hard Disk
120GB KINGSTON HYPERX SAVAGE SSD, SATA 6 Gb/s (upto 560MB/sR | 360MB/sW)

2nd Hard Disk
2TB WD CAVIAR BLACK WD2003FZEX, SATA 6 Gb/s, 64MB CACHE (7200rpm)

1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM

Power Supply
CORSAIR 1000W RM SERIES™ MODULAR 80 PLUS® GOLD, ULTRA QUIET

Processor Cooling
Corsair H100i GTX Hydro Series High Performance CPU Cooler

Thermal Paste
ARCTIC MX-4 EXTREME THERMAL CONDUCTIVITY COMPOUND

Sound Card
ONBOARD 8 CHANNEL (7.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD) no idea whether a sound blaster card would be worth it

USB Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 6 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS

Operating System
Genuine Windows 7 Home 64 Bit w/SP1 - inc DVD & Licence

Monitor
BENQ RL2455HM 24" LED GAMING MONITOR

Monitor Cables
1 x 2 METRE GOLD PLATED V1.4 HDMI CABLE

dont play FPS that much anymore (too old).



I Hate shopping for a PC.

Zimmy Zeta - I f*cking love martinis. the original ones, with gin, not that vodka martini crap. Your old Friends can use me for 7 days, free!!!

Velarra
#2 - 2015-07-24 22:18:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Velarra
Do you have past experience with and fully intend to enjoy the experience that is Over Clocking your CPU? Do you have some hopeful over clocking goals/speeds in mind for your cpu?

Are you familiar with the mild controversy surrounding the NVidia GTX 970 "4GB" which is actually 3.5 GB (with a slower 512mb extra bit of ram on the card)?

You may -really- prefer a 240 GB SSD for general breathing room, in addition to a normal hard drive.

Edit:
Your CPU, Ram and motherboard are great. Yet you mention you're unlikely to upgrade after the system is built. Your motherboard will support up to 64 gig of ram by 8 slots. Initially, you only have 16 gig of ram by two 8 gig sticks. Are you sure you won't want to upgrade your ram in the future?

Which leads to the version of windows, Win 7 Home, will support a max of 16 gig. Windows 7 Professional 64 will support ram far beyond 16. Yet the motherboard supports upto 64 gig.
Tollen Gallen
Glory of Reprisal Enterprise
#3 - 2015-07-24 22:30:44 UTC
Velarra wrote:
Do you have past experience with and fully intend to enjoy the experience that is Over Clocking your CPU? Do you have some hopeful over clocking goals/speeds in mind for your cpu?

Are you familiar with the mild controversy surrounding the NVidia GTX 970 "4GB" which is actually 3.5 GB (with a slower 512mb extra bit of ram on the card)?

You may -really- prefer a 240 GB SSD for general breathing room, in addition to a normal hard drive.



No intention of overclocking, i'm old school, if you need to mod it, you brought the wrong one.


No was not aware of the 4GB/3.5GB thing, will research now....great more Hate/research.

Ok will bare that in mind.


Thanks for reply.



Zimmy Zeta - I f*cking love martinis. the original ones, with gin, not that vodka martini crap. Your old Friends can use me for 7 days, free!!!

Velarra
#4 - 2015-07-24 22:55:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Velarra
Tollen Gallen wrote:


No intention of overclocking, i'm old school, if you need to mod it, you brought the wrong one.


No was not aware of the 4GB/3.5GB thing, will research now....great more Hate/research.

Ok will bare that in mind.


Thanks for reply.





Well, if you have no desire for overclocking, you may wish to reconsider the CPU and cooler.

The i7-5930K with a "K" designation signifies that the CPU is unlocked (Today, Intel locks its default CPU's to prevent traditional ratio based OCing) and completely ready for overclocking. Over clocking tends to generate massive quantities of heat, and is the reason the build likely has the really solid H100i water cooler.

I'd suggest looking at Non-K i7 CPU's (you even get some (very niche) virtual machine support that's removed from K i7 CPU's) or, people may look at you odd initially, - Xeon CPU's at the low end of their range which are nearly identical to consumer i7's and WILL work in consumer motherboards.

Finally, you may or may not want to reconsider the motherboard & ram type. They're both wonderful. Fantastic. But they might be overkill and better suited to an all out, overclocking go-wild kind of setup that you DO intend to upgrade later.

Edit: cooling

For cooling? If *not overclocking*, i'd look at Air coolers for eg. the Coolermaster Hyper 212 Evo (which is great value/awesome performance) or say, the Noctua NH-D14 which IS more intended for air & lower end OC'ing. Eitherway, choose something that's *not* the stock Intel cooler.
Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#5 - 2015-07-24 23:49:31 UTC
You building this from parts? Or is this a custom build off a website? Just to say, Win10 release in five days. I'd be looking into a systems with the upgraded version of win10, possibly OEM discount with the system. I haven't looked into it, just the standard drill on past winders releases.

Never too old for an FPS, and wipe the floor with 'em. Though I do pref tacticals more now compared to when I was a spring chicken. Just stay off my lawn!

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12

Tollen Gallen
Glory of Reprisal Enterprise
#6 - 2015-07-24 23:56:20 UTC
Webvan wrote:
You building this from parts? Or is this a custom build off a website? Just to say, Win10 release in five days. I'd be looking into a systems with the upgraded version of win10, possibly OEM discount with the system. I haven't looked into it, just the standard drill on past winders releases.

Never too old for an FPS, and wipe the floor with 'em. Though I do pref tacticals more now compared to when I was a spring chicken. Just stay off my lawn!




Custom build from website.





I truely Hate pc shopping.

Zimmy Zeta - I f*cking love martinis. the original ones, with gin, not that vodka martini crap. Your old Friends can use me for 7 days, free!!!

Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#7 - 2015-07-25 00:02:30 UTC
Yeah plan it out, take your time and see if you can get an OEM deal with it. Win pro or whatever it is.



I like Linux.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12

Velarra
#8 - 2015-07-25 00:12:19 UTC
Webvan wrote:
Yeah plan it out, take your time and see if you can get an OEM deal with it. Win pro or whatever it is.



I like Linux.


Amiga OS 3.1 ftw Big smile
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#9 - 2015-07-25 13:11:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Mina Sebiestar
Looks great would go with bigger SSD i reinstalled my desktop 5-6 days ago and from 256GB ssd it say it used 170GB i have basic software on it and 3 games eve sins of solar empire and homeworld remastered on it ...nothing else.

so you will have to set steam and everything else to be installed to hard drive from a get go in your case.

Edit:

My bad it show 171GB free out of 256GB it used ~80GB

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard

Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2015-07-25 16:36:20 UTC
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883281222

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#11 - 2015-07-26 18:41:52 UTC
Get a 27" screen. The extra vertical resolution is priceless, and there is a BIG difference between 1080x1920 and 1440x2560.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#12 - 2015-07-27 03:02:18 UTC
If you only intend on gaming, you can save a lot of money by going for the mainstream segment instead of the enthusiast grade stuff like you have done now.

Intel has the new 'Skylake' line of CPUs coming in August together with the Z107 chipset, might be worth waiting for that instead.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.

Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#13 - 2015-07-27 05:04:55 UTC
Yep, on my last desktop computer, I just grabbed an ASUS off the shelf. Then I grabbed a vid card (which I've even replaced since then), and an even nicer audio card since I do a lot of audio work, was almost worth the base system price itself. Certified desktop support. Why I do that? So if the system is no good I can take it right back and yell at 'em in person hehe. I use to build all the time, and for others, and repair systems. But it's all just cheap stuff now, mostly disposable, problematic, so I get it local so no long waits to get results on broken trash. Not too bad a choice going with a distant builder off a website though, better guarantee than just ordering parts and building it yourself. I've had really snark remarks taking broken junk back, individual items that didn't clear testing.

But however you do it, make sure you burn in the system. Just mostly let it run as is for a few days non-stop.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12

ISD FlowingSpice
ISD SYAD
ISD Alliance
#14 - 2015-07-27 09:13:08 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD FlowingSpice
I'd suggest a few tweaks.


CPU wise, you can go a lot cheaper.
I'm running an i7 3770 and I don't think it's ever topped out while gaming.


Set aside a 120GB SSD for just your OS and core programs. Set up regular imaging to the HDD.

Pick up an extra 120 or 240 SSD for games. Don't worry about getting the fastest and best, just look at reliability. The speed differences aren't really noticeable for your day to day gaming.

That way if the SSD goes pop, you're just recovering the OS, or if your game drive fries, you can still run the OS.

Drop the dual 970s and get a single 980ti, roughly the same price.
980ti has more VRAM, which is what you're going to need for newer games.
Dual cards still don't have fantastic support.
Also, looks like your monitor is 60hz, so you're not going to benefit from the higher frame rate that the dual cards might get you.

Probably don't need the thermal paste, h100i has good enough coverage out of the box, though always handy to have some around.

You can get away with a much smaller PSU.
650w will do just fine. Might need a touch bigger if you stick with the dual cards.


Now, personal opinion, go for as compact a build as possible.
I made the mistake of building a giant rig once. Total pain in the butt.
Also, avoid LEDs like the plague, unless you're going to be showing it off, they're more trouble than they're worth.


Good luck!

Vice Admiral

SYAD - Systems Administration

Interstellar Services Department

Velarra
#15 - 2015-07-27 16:06:38 UTC
Given some of the expanded, more thorough suggestions and feedback in the thread i thought i'd share further:

If you're looking to build a long term primary system for gaming and general computing + any kind of complex computing of a remotely professional nature (read: video editing, streaming, really demanding games you hope to run at very high settings several years from now..) based on the ball park of your initial posted system, i'd go with something along the lines of:

At time of build, whatever is the most recent (non-k) intel CPU. For instance an i7 variant or low tier Xeon (look into the E3 family or similar) in at least a mid grade consumer motherboard. Anything higher rated than mid-grade leads into extreme enthusiast hardware, overclocking and excessive, questionable overkill features.

A very good mid-range consumer motherboard relative to the current generation of CPU you go with and its chipset requirements at time of building the system. I'm going to gesture toward Asus as personally i feel they have some fantastic fan-control software. This software in windows lets you very easily tune fan speeds, fan sound levels vs. performance etc. Note, that's a personal choice, Gigabyte for instance, is fine too.

CPU cooler? Cooler master hyper 212 Evo or perhaps a Noctua NH-D14.

Ram, - Odds are Eve doesn't need more than 4gig of ram today if not 8 at most. Most games don't need more than 8 gig of ram and a general gaming system -today- doesn't really need more than 16 gig. But if you're building a system that you don't want to touch too seriously for a very long time, - having as much ram (eg. 32+ Gig ) as you can on the motherboard at time of building -really- will make life so much comfortable 5-7+ years from now. You could start small, and upgrade later, but ram's a finicky creature and prone to being picky particularly when you're using sticks physically made various years apart. Ultimately, all at once, is better than upgrades years apart for ram.

In general - any known ram (eg. Kingston, G. Skill, etc..), that's 'low profile' (physically lacks heat spreaders affixed to the ram module), with a rated speed sitting between 1600-1866, CL 10 or 9, should be fine. DDR 4 is the new kid on the block with some of the recent cutting edge motherboards, but DDR3 ought to be fine (and MUCH more affordable). Available maximum quantity of ram will end up being much more useful for general computing/gaming years from now, than fractional performance improvements due to higher Mhz or smaller CL values.

Graphics? As mentioned above, SLI and general dual card performance today just isn't really as fantastic as the advertising and benchmarking reviewers might suggest it to be. Unless you know a very specific application or game WILL take advantage of SLI, odds are it'll be a depressing heat generator in your box. Unless you live in the arctic, - an SLI'd rig could make for a great space heater option! :)

With SLI off the table, you could go with A. the best non-SLI Nvidia graphics card you can find. The awesome 980ti was suggested above for instance. Or, B. a sweet spot card. A mid range, graphics card that balances excellent performance with value. The sweetspot card will probably need to be upgraded within 3 or so years however, which might place it out of your build plan.

Drives and storage? Well, as mentioned earlier I'm a proponent of giving my windows/boot SSD drive, no less than 240 gig. Between the OS, Windows default virtual memory and hibernation files, a handful of must-have apps and perhaps a single game you can easily have the windows boot SSD get really tight/full. With a comfortable boot drive, bulk data/games can happily go onto a spinning platter drive of your preference. About the only other thing i'd suggest would be a backup drive. Surprisingly, windows backup works rather well and you can configure it to run a weekly backup/system restore disc. An internal or external dedicated backup drive wouldn't be a bad consideration.

Sound cards? Unless you know that you will need one, ... you don't need one. Motherboard sound chips are great for most computing and gaming. Unless of course you intend to setup a complex at-home audiophile computing experience with your build.

Cooling / case / fans...No reference in your build list of a case, but they are worth some time and research. Cases can impact your computing experiences' desk-space's sound, lighting and system temperature levels due to how they may be designed for airflow or audio profile. A case isn't just a matter of appearance, or a window in the side (or lack there of). Sound levels, heat generation, dust retention, etc, can all be variables that cases can influence.

Last but absolutely not least, - do not cut corners with your power supply. The rated wattage required or at least a good idea / minimum for your system - may vary. But whatever you do, do not skimp on the quality of the power supply. These creatures can fail and do bad things to the rest of a system if they fail. Everything in the computer's build hinges on the power supply providing clean, reliable electricity. For example, look to PSU's built by Seasonic, or perhaps Enermax.
Tollen Gallen
Glory of Reprisal Enterprise
#16 - 2015-07-27 19:18:50 UTC


Thanks for all the replys.




Velarra wrote:
If you're looking to build a long term primary system for gaming and general computing + any kind of complex computing of a remotely professional nature (read: video editing, streaming, really demanding games you hope to run at very high settings several years from now..)


This is exactly what im going for. Considering i've made do with a laptop for the past 6 years (Aspire 8920G). I'm basicaly looking to buy a machine which will play anything smoothly and on full settings. There are games my LP wont even touch now, let alone play on min settings. Hence the OverTheTop choices i made.

Alpheias wrote:
Intel has the new 'Skylake' line of CPUs coming in August together with the Z107 chipset, might be worth waiting for that instead.


I had heard/read that somewhere, chances are thats what i will do, though i understand that they will be very pricey when they first come out, so who knows. (This is why i hate PC shopping).
On the other hand, that might mean the i7's come down in price a little.

It seems most custom build sites only do i7K's, OC must be a more common thing these days. I guess i could order it OC'd then ramp it down a little.


Malcanis wrote:
Get a 27" screen. The extra vertical resolution is priceless, and there is a BIG difference between 1080x1920 and 1440x2560.


Looked into it, but as far as i could make out the only one that made sense added £300+ to the final price.

I'm really trying to buy all i need from the same site, for delivery reasons. (i know thats stupid and costly).

Alpheias wrote:
If you only intend on gaming, you can save a lot of money by going for the mainstream segment instead of the enthusiast grade stuff like you have done now.


The enthusiast stuff is what im drawn to, simply because i've waiting many many years to be able to afford a top of the line PC.
Could be worse, i could have gone for 64 gig ram, an 8 core i7 and a Titan black. Thanks for pointing it out tho, who knows it might sink in.


Caleidascope wrote:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883281222


Made me laugh, thanks.
You have no idea how close i am to just giving up and buying this .


This is what i had lined up on Saturday.

Overclocked CPU
Overclocked Intel® Six Core i7-5930K (3.5GHz @ MAX of 4.4GHz)
Motherboard
ASUS® RAMPAGE V EXTREME/U3.1: E-ATX, HSW-E CPU, USB 3.0, SATA 6 GB/s
Memory (RAM)
32GB KINGSTON HYPER-X PREDATOR QUAD-DDR4 3000MHz X.M.P (4 x 8GB)
Graphics Card
4GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 980 - 1 DVI, 1 HDMI, 3 DP - 3D Vision Ready
2nd Graphics Card
4GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 980 - 1 DVI, 1 HDMI, 3 DP - 3D Vision Ready
1st Hard Disk
250GB Samsung 850 EVO SSD, SATA 6Gb/s (upto 540MB/sR | 520MB/sW)
2nd Hard Disk
2TB WD CAVIAR BLACK WD2003FZEX, SATA 6 Gb/s, 64MB CACHE (7200rpm)
1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
16x BLU-RAY WRITER DRIVE, 16x DVD ±R/±RW
2nd DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM
Power Supply
CORSAIR 1200W PRO SERIES™ PLATINUM AX1200i DIGITAL MODULAR PSU
Processor Cooling
Corsair H100i GTX Hydro Series High Performance CPU Cooler
Thermal Paste
ARCTIC MX-4 EXTREME THERMAL CONDUCTIVITY COMPOUND
Sound Card
ONBOARD 8 CHANNEL (7.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Wireless/Wired Networking
10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT (Wi-Fi NOT INCLUDED)
USB Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 6 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Power Cable
1 x 1 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead)
Operating System
Genuine Windows 7 Professional 64 Bit w/SP1 - inc DVD & Licence
Windows 10 Upgrade
FREE Upgrade to Windows 10 with all Windows 7 & Windows 8.1 Purchases*
DVD Recovery Media
Windows 7 Professional (64-bit) DVD with paper sleeve
Monitor
BENQ XL2411Z 24" 1MS 3D GAMING MONITOR
Monitor Cables
1 x 2 METRE GOLD PLATED V1.4 HDMI CABLE


Thanks again for Advice, I'm of to consider recent replys, and bang my head against a wall.



I still Hate PC shopping.








Zimmy Zeta - I f*cking love martinis. the original ones, with gin, not that vodka martini crap. Your old Friends can use me for 7 days, free!!!

Velarra
#17 - 2015-07-27 21:53:00 UTC
Tollen Gallen wrote:


Velarra wrote:
If you're looking to build a long term primary system for gaming and general computing + any kind of complex computing of a remotely professional nature (read: video editing, streaming, really demanding games you hope to run at very high settings several years from now..)


This is exactly what im going for. Considering i've made do with a laptop for the past 6 years (Aspire 8920G). I'm basicaly looking to buy a machine which will play anything smoothly and on full settings. There are games my LP wont even touch now, let alone play on min settings. Hence the OverTheTop choices i made.


With a 1Ghz Amd Athalon which now functions as a file/print server running Windows XP, an Amiga 3000 UX under my desk, alongside an early 2008 macbook pro reserved for occasional Final Cut, and finally a recent (last year) good for another 10yrs build not unlike your current goal, I can genuinely empathize with both the experience and the sentiment for how you want to use a future system.

If anything, when going for over-the-top gear, keep in mind your expectations of longevity, wear and tear, entropy and quality of build. Some high end respectedly branded enthusiast gear may have massive performance much more in mind, over say very long term durability in its dna. How much do you want to deal with a dead AIO water pump that's died in 2-3years? No, not necessarily leaked water, but just stopped working leading to overheating and system instability? (and ultimately needing to replace it.)

Or a solidly overclocked CPU that several years later starts losing the ability to maintain the OC'd Ghz? Particularly as OC's are the kind of things you kinda set, lock in and just hope will last as long as possible. Before you may have to set up another OC through extensive trial and error with vcore / VID and its myriad of friends in bios. Note, if you ENJOY being fiddly with your bios and computer hardware? Awesome! OCing is for you! However, - If you want to set it up and forget about it, for years and years on end? ehm... well, I'm really not so sure.

Ultimately, please beware high end tech by very reputable brands that may only be good for 3 or so years before it gets weird or fails. Yes, finding non-k, non OC enthousiast setups can be harder than all the "K" emblazoned, OC shiny with lights gear, but if you're building long term...finding the right setup for you will be worth it long term. Vs. something that gets flaky in 3-5years Shocked

(My Ignorant cynicism, please feel free to ignore: While OCing used to be useful & cool, ... today the gains for the computer user for all the cost seem only marginal. However the wear and tear on the hardware it causes certainly leads to people buying more computer gear much sooner than if they'd not OC'd. I'd half want to joke that dealers love it. selling OC gear = the potential for much more after sales servicing and earlier return of customer to buy new PC. I suppose, you could say that OCing is great, as it helps keep the brick and morter computer shops alive with regular clients!)
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#18 - 2015-07-27 22:39:12 UTC
Not very tech savvy but I wouldn't go far back to 3rd Gen i7

6 or so months or so I was refreshing my system and If I remember right I was buying last mobo for i7 in active production and a lot of other were out of stock.

Not sure how that will translate in active bios updates or mobo breakdowns due to reasons like bad psu and other would go w 4th gen i7 instead.

Also couldn't agree more with bulk ram buy,have a laptop and used 24gb ram for approx 8 months and when I installed last 8 gigs it started crashing not because new one but 2 old ones that produced small errors not enough to cause problems before maxing it out.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard

Unezka Turigahl
Det Som Engang Var
#19 - 2015-07-28 09:15:29 UTC
EVE is SO much better on a 27" 2560x1440 screen. It's definitely worth it. I'd go for a quad core CPU and a single graphics card and put that money into a nice big screen.

Games benefit more from the core speed of the CPU, and tend not to utilize more than 4 cores. If you are rendering videos a lot or something like that then I can understand getting a 6 core. But for just games, go with the fastest quad core available.

Unlike CPUs, video cards are still making decent progress from generation to generation. So buying two expensive cards seems like a waste. Video cards become outdated faster than CPUs basically. Buy a single 970 or 980 and save the money to replace it with a new card in 5 or 6 years. Within the next year or two video cards will be switching over to a new way of handling memory that can increase speeds. AMD has actually already released a card with the first iteration of this new memory tech. Looks promising. Nvidia will be making the move next year probably. So 5 years from now you won't want to be stuck with two 970/980.

I'd go for a 500GB SSD for the main drive, to have some breathing room. 850EVO or Crucial BX100/MX100/MX200.
Black Panpher
CastleKickers
Rote Kapelle
#20 - 2015-07-28 18:37:42 UTC
Tollen Gallen wrote:


No intention of overclocking, i'm old school, if you need to mod it, you brought the wrong one.



Wow you really do have no idea! Shocked
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