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CCP - Are you ever going to fix exploration (Data Sites)?

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Damjan Fox
Fox Industries and Exploration
#21 - 2015-07-23 22:18:41 UTC
I guess, removing Data Cores from LP stores should fix the problem.

Proposal: >>> New Inventory / Item Hangar <<<
beakerax
Pator Tech School
#22 - 2015-07-23 22:49:47 UTC
Radar sites used to be worth running. Personally I think it was the decryptor changes that ruined them.
Hal Morsh
Doomheim
#23 - 2015-07-24 02:47:30 UTC
Isk per hour isn't always the most important thing ever.

Oh, I perfectly understand, Hal Morsh — a mission like this requires courage, skill, and heroism… qualities you are clearly lacking. Have you forgotten you're one of the bloody immortals!?
Shiloh Templeton
Cheyenne HET Co
#24 - 2015-07-24 02:58:04 UTC
Is it really a function of how valuable decyrptors, and all the other junk, is worth? Maybe it's more of an industry problem.
Buoytender Bob
Ronin Exploration Mission and Mining
#25 - 2015-07-24 03:42:43 UTC
In my area, i usually wait until server population is below 25k before even trying to make exploration worth while. Under 20k usually allows for loot drops/site spawning to be good. This usually means off hours and for a short amount of time. Weekends rarely work and anything over 25k in population and I'm better off doing almost any other activity.

..and every time I get another piece of Carbon, I know exactly what CCP is getting this Christmas.

To buck the popular trend, I began to Rage Start instead of Rage Quit.

...and every time I get another piece of Carbon, I know exactly what CCP is getting this Christmas.
Hadrian Blackstone
Yamato Holdings
#26 - 2015-07-24 04:16:06 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
[quote=Ellatte Silversong]
Data sites aren't that lucrative sure, but when all you need is a Cov Ops frigate with a cloak and probe launcher, it's not exactly much risk either.


If it's so low risk why even bother with the cloak? Roll

Like a cloaky Tengu who has already scanned down the sites waiting for you to uncloak in your frigate never happens...never
Orlacc
#27 - 2015-07-24 04:34:49 UTC
Hadrian Blackstone wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
[quote=Ellatte Silversong]
Data sites aren't that lucrative sure, but when all you need is a Cov Ops frigate with a cloak and probe launcher, it's not exactly much risk either.


If it's so low risk why even bother with the cloak? Roll

Like a cloaky Tengu who has already scanned down the sites waiting for you to uncloak in your frigate never happens...never



How about a Proteus? Will that do?

"Measure Twice, Cut Once."
Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#28 - 2015-07-24 05:02:39 UTC
Another explorer whine thread? Since the introduction of mini-game exploration, this is the only real fit you need so to win at exploration. I miss the old explorer threads.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
Harrison Tato
Yamato Holdings
#29 - 2015-07-24 05:20:39 UTC
Arla Sarain wrote:
Such a simple thread quickly derailed by "hurr durr Highsec lvl 4s make so much *money*". LP rewards payout as much as you nullsec crabs are willing to pay, because all the liquid ISK available for trading comes from anoms and incursions. Stop paying mission runners as much as you are and their income will drop. Or start doing regular BLOPs to churn out all the expensive sh*t from NS renters.

The point of the thread is that Data sites suck. Really, really suck. Primary commodities from Data sites were decriptors, and racial decriptors were quite valuable. But now, they are generalized and except some of the top tier ones, they don't sell for much. Getting carbon from data site is hilarious tho. And all the PI mats as well. Or things like trade goods (weapons and stuff).

CCP needs to go through which items are shared between Data sites and other parts of the game and readjust - Data sites need some unique items to sell, perhaps based on emergent events (antikioashdas elements/drifter parts depending on drifter activity, for example), in order to motivate people to start farming them again and start data site BPCs source again.



The BPC's in data sites right now are toilet paper. Ooooh another target spectrum breaker BPC!
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
#30 - 2015-07-24 12:35:19 UTC
This just in... CCP is dumb.

I would post constructively about how I agree with OP and the reasons why exploration is a complete waste of time since Odyssey but it wouldn't do any good.

Not today spaghetti.
Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#31 - 2015-07-24 13:34:06 UTC
Webvan wrote:
Another explorer whine thread? Since the introduction of mini-game exploration, this is the only real fit you need so to win at exploration. I miss the old explorer threads.


honestly that is the best way to make isk - shoot the explorers and take their sister launchers ftw.

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Hadrian Blackstone
Yamato Holdings
#32 - 2015-07-24 14:59:47 UTC
Orlacc wrote:
Hadrian Blackstone wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
[quote=Ellatte Silversong]
Data sites aren't that lucrative sure, but when all you need is a Cov Ops frigate with a cloak and probe launcher, it's not exactly much risk either.


If it's so low risk why even bother with the cloak? Roll

Like a cloaky Tengu who has already scanned down the sites waiting for you to uncloak in your frigate never happens...never



How about a Proteus? Will that do?


A Proteus, for what? There's hardly any risk, remember?
Ellatte Silversong
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#33 - 2015-07-24 15:20:38 UTC
"Actually I had a pretty good idea of the time. The point was to get you saying how long it took you to make 20 million. Half an hour. Not 6-8 hours. It took you half an hour to do 4 data sites for 20 million.
You openly said you found a bunch more during that time but chose not to run them.

So you are complaining that you ignored money in front of you because you wanted different money, then never found the different money.
Data sites aren't that lucrative sure, but when all you need is a Cov Ops frigate with a cloak and probe launcher, it's not exactly much risk either."


No, you don't have a good point. Finding 4 data sites in 1 system is rare. Normally you have to fly around a bunch to find them and only foolish people run sites in systems that are not empty. That is how you lose your ship. You can also find 7 or 8 empty systems in a row, which means there is nothing. I might only find 10 sites in 3 hours- which comes out to maybe 80 million, as I stated. That is terrible ISK per hour, especially compared to Relic sites or High sec mission running.

You don't just fly from data site to data site. You have to find and scan them down, which takes a lot of time.

Like I stated, Cov Ops frigs have issues in null. They die to good bubble camps, or if caught by a Interdictor if they make a mistake. In both of these scenarios, you will also lose your POD. They will not survive the harder sleeper cache sites, you need a T3 to do them safely get around Null.


The fact that people are simply leaving the data sites proves my point. If they were worth doing, people would do them.

One other thing, bring up an issue is how things get fixed, it's not complaining. If I post over and over about it, that would be complaining.
Borascus
#34 - 2015-07-31 07:23:58 UTC
Arguably, the covert research anoms have the option to be run in an Ibis with prop and hacker mod.

These are usually 30mil before the pop shot, I ran a loot 2 cans warp out strategy after losing an astero to my first.

That earns more ISK, even with flight time, compared to data sites.

The previous posts about looting the good stuff and leaving the site active is an area that is important.

I disagree with the sleeper site combat focus, all 3 were run in an astero, you have to cherry pick what you loot and it's selfish to do them when you can't finish the site, but it's 10-50mil for limited, 50-200mil for standard 70-500mil for superior in an astero. Hard finding them though, every low-sec island seemed to have station dwellers that undock to find them.

It can be done though.

For limited; all cans, standard; skip the turret area by mwd up when exterminators deploy, then mwd back to the teleport near the array, superior; warp in move past sentry room to aligner room, loot aligner cans using aligned ray and small armor rep 2 + eanm 2 for the ISK values mentioned.

Possible even with level 3 hacking / analyzer skills (t1 mods)
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#35 - 2015-07-31 09:14:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Barrogh Habalu
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
You can have a low barrier to proficiency with **** drops or a high barrier with good drops, you can't have both.

So how do relic sites fit into this paradigm in comparison with data?

****** drops isn't the problem, it's the fact that FW stores make data loot and some older professions irrelevant. This isn't the case for items relics drop.

Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
Sequester Risalo
German Corps of Engineers 17
Federation of Respect Honor Passion Alliance.
#36 - 2015-07-31 09:31:19 UTC
Ellatte Silversong wrote:
This is terrible. I could easily have farmed over 400 million doing level 4 missions, which is boring as hell.



I think this is an important point here. You chose to do exploration sites because you enjoy them more than missions. You further said that you are earning your ISK mainly by station trding with another toon. I fail to see aproblem here. You enoy what you do and don't even need the money.

What exactly is your point? It's impossible to balance all professions so all are making the same amount if ISK/h.
Commander Spurty
#37 - 2015-07-31 09:52:22 UTC
On the flip side, I now have a huge stack of Carbon to produce crappy Charon contracts with 8-/

There are good ships,

And wood ships,

And ships that sail the sea

But the best ships are Spaceships

Built by CCP
Eternus8lux8lucis
Guardians of the Gate
RAZOR Alliance
#38 - 2015-07-31 11:33:34 UTC
My only take on this is spawn rates of sites. I realize that likely only CCP knows for certain if relics despawned by finishing or other methods spawn other relics only and datas spawn more datas only. If your finding far to many data sites there is a possibility that both datas and relics spawn other data and relics, perhaps 50/50, and as more relics get done and despawn the chance of another data, which arent being run, gets higher until there are nothing but datas kicking around until either the datas are run or despawned to spawn more relic/datas.

Tbh this ideology would make sense from a programming standpoint to prevent too much relic loot from entering the economy and reducing isk/hr by making data sites the "fluff" and ****** sites on purpose and create a dynamic style of seeding. So frankly if this is the case then your whining about data sites in general means its working.


This is much like the idea when drone sites were **** and noone was doing them. Almost every scanned site was a drone site someone didnt want to do and had left open. But if the aggregate amount of sites open in any region or area was a combination of any style of site it meant that until done they would increase in number over time.

But this is just an idea at best. Remember CCP trolls the hardest....Twisted

Have you heard anything I've said?

You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right?

That's right.

Had to end sometime.
Rawthorm
The Establishment
#39 - 2015-07-31 12:46:31 UTC
The issue with Data sites is a mix of them originally containing items for invention that never expired, leading to market saturation. This then got compounded by half the loot they drop now being defunct. I'm sure once some new release calls for new components, CCP will thread them into Data sites making them worth while again. Until then, there isn't a single thing that can be done about it unless they find a way to drastically ramp up demand for what little the sites give.
Xearal
Dead's Prostitutes
The Initiative.
#40 - 2015-07-31 13:04:17 UTC
Another problem with data sites is cargo, while relic sites and combat sites require only very little cargo to hold all your valuables, filling up your cargo on data goes very very quickly. And it's all low value so a full cargohold will be worth far less than if you did relic/combats.

When I go out scanning, I do run data's from time to time, if nothing else is available. but usually when I do that, i have to return quicky becuse my hold is ful, whereas when I'm running Relics, after a good run, I'll still have plenty of cargo space, while the value is enough for me to go back and secure my loots.

Does railgun ammunition come in Hollow Point?
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