Player Features and Ideas Discussion

In this thread I'll explain how to fix the many broken Amarr laser ships and why Khanid style bonuses would finally allow these ships to function as intended. Not all ships should become 'khanidized' though, I'll share some thoughts about when it is appropriate and when not.

1) The -10% laser cap usage losers

- Maller
- Prophecy
- Punisher

These are all considered inferior to their peers. They also have an armor resist bonus per level. An armor resist bonus lends itself best to passive tanked ships (without a repairer). Passively tanked armor ships do not need a cap reduction bonus because they use little cap. An armor resist bonus also lends itself to an active tank. The problem with that though, is that the pilot is playing the game of outlasting while flying the ship with the most cap hungry weapons (even after the cap reduction bonus). So how do these ships work best then? By capitalizing on their armor resist bonus, which means putting on as many armor plates as possible, then putting on whatever weapon can still fit (often autocannons or frigate-grade blasters). Why is this so? Lasers have some the highest powergrid requirements in the game and coincidentally, armor plates also have high power grid requirements. Spending power grid on armor plates is gives better returns in combat performance than spending it on lasers without a damage bonus.

It is clear that the combination of a laser cap reduction bonus and an armor resist bonus is inherently flawed.

The solution? The Maller and Prophecy become Khanid ships. In this way these ships can be the tough brawler they were intended to be. A damage bonus, HAM launchers using less powergrid than lasers and being more compatible with active tanked setups would avoid all the aforementioned contradictions.

What about the Punisher? A Khanid style Punisher is out of the question because there already is a missile ship in the Amarr T1 frigate lineup*. There are two choices here: a cap+damage or a damage+resistance bonus, and both are proven designs that will work.


2) The Devoter

While the ship works because it can effectively provide an infinipoint, it is yet another design that would be better off as HAM ship. The same problem of laser powergrid requirements on a ship that gets a lot out of armor plates applies here. In addition it is expected to operate in environments where energy neutralizers are common and capacitor is critical to keep the infinipoint running. I realize that the cookie cutter Devoter actually uses frigate-grade autocannons and that HAM bonuses won't change that (and the turret hardpoints should be kept to preserve the currently used fits). What HAM bonuses will do though is make the Devoter less of a one trick pony and give it bonuses that actually make sense!


3) The Legion covert subsystem is worth mentioning because it only has a -10% laser cap usage bonus.

Should this be 'khanidized'? In my opinion, no. Cloaky strategic cruisers are all about striking hard and destroying the target before help can arrive. This tactic values damage over endurance, whereas Khanid ships value endurance over damage. It just needs a damage bonus to make it worthwhile fitting lasers.


To sum all the suggestions up in a few lines:
- Punisher gets +5% damage +5% armor resist bonus per level OR -10% cap usage +5% damage per level
- Maller and Prophecy get +5% HAM damage +5 armor resists per level
- Devoter keeps its turret hardpoints, gets +10% HAM velocity and +5% HAM ROF per level and 4 launcher hardpoints.
- The Legion covert subsystem should NOT receive HAM bonuses but instead a laser damage bonus.


* the Inquisitor is patiently awaiting Tiericide and rocket damage / armor resistance bonuses.

It is anything but stupid. Not only does it fix several broken ships, it also makes the Amarr T1 lineup more varied. That's better than having laser ship after laser ship.

This is going to be especially true when Tiericide finally arrives. Variety in ship bonuses is going to be much needed to differentiate the ships, otherwise the only variety is going to be: this ship here has a bit more EHP, while this other ship does a bit more damage but they fly and fit the same.

You're mistaken on your dps figure. A Maller with 3x Heat Sink II, 5x Heavy Pulse II and Scorch does only 274 dps (and has no powergrid left to fit anything but an afterburner). Whether you can make this work in your meta-games or not, there are some fundamental problems with this ship and its brothers.

The Prophecy isn't as bad as the Maller but it's pretty much just a worse Harbinger unfortunately. If it were a Khanid ship, it would be worth flying because it would be unique. If not in PvP, then certainly in PvE for its selectable damage types.

Ok, got my range off. You was right. The 350 figure is with navy multifreq or conflag (and that was rounding up by ten or so). Oopsie. And yes, it's flawed, but not useless. Give it some drones and it'd be just fine. Relating to OP though, a HAM ship is really called for in the lineup somewhere and I think the Maller is probably the best place for it, since it's already suitable to brawling and the sacrilege follows it. Amarr really do need a way to get damage selection; given the range flexibility of lasers, refitting to a different weapon system to force a trade off is the way to go.

I forgot the Coercer:

Destroyers fights always end quickly (one way or another). As such, a laser cap usage bonus is useless on this ship. A Dual Light Pulse II, Scorch, 2x HS Coercer is cap stable. Without the cap usage bonus, it would cap out in 3 minute 42 seconds. The battle will be long over by then.

Should this be 'khanidized'? Absolutely not, the instant damage of turrets is very important to the Destroyer role. There are a variety of bonuses that would work well, but I think the details are best left to CCP because the Coercer is up for mid-slot related changes anyway.