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[IG-CVA] Encyclical on Singularity and the One True Empire of the Lord

Author
Arrendis
TK Corp
#21 - 2015-07-21 00:14:10 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
My advice to people is simply not to talk to members of Goonswarm. As Alizabeth Vea aptly demonstrated, they are of little intellectual worth and make mistakes that geometrically increase in severity the longer people don't pay attention to them.


Because, of course, in all of the history of human endeavour, the best way to get someone to stop doing things you don't want them to do is to shun them, to allow them to feel put upon, and let them grow resentful - especially when you have nothing they need.

Perhaps you should consider how well that worked for the Amarr with the Elders and the Thukker.

Engagement, not estrangement, is the only way to convince your enemies to look upon you as anything other than a foe in their crosshairs.
Rytha Main
Defensores Fidei
#22 - 2015-07-21 01:18:38 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Brother Honorius, as an avowed heretic who finds the Amarr faith to be strange, alien, and frankly completely devoid of moral worth, I will admit that you and I will have our differences of opinion. Also, apologies in advance, as I may display a tendency to become a bit wordy and long-winded in expressing my thoughts, and slightly prone to focusing on tangential minutiae, eh, little fi-er... Dr. Scherezad?

Why should any recognize Max as anything more than a madman, when his own followers who address him as "Pope" are avowed heretics who are not counted amongst the faithful.

Arrendis wrote:
Similarly, one does not redirect a moving starship by ramming it into a station and expecting it to bounce in the right direction, with no harm or damage inflicted or taken. You set your planned heading, and turn the ship slowly, through a constant curve. Is it not also reasonable to think that Maximilian Singularity may be attempting to guide capsuleers by degrees? To first harness their energy in a way that will later allow him to introduce them to concepts from the Amarr faith and scriptures, rather than attempt to stand in front of them and yell out scripture verse now in a gesture that would surely be almost completely ignored and ineffective?

You're right, Max is using degrees... none of which are based in the law or scripture of Amarr, but rooted in senseless violence. There is no justification for Burn Amarr.

And there is no sense in calling for "legal inquiry" when you yourselves break the law, and try to bend Imperial opinion by attacking a region under united Amarr rule. To date, none of you have addressed this. Crusaders who avoid answering for their own missteps.

Everything about you, and yours are contrary, and it is best if all within your crusade remain silent.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#23 - 2015-07-21 01:44:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Arrendis
Rytha Main wrote:
To date, none of you have addressed this. Crusaders who avoid answering for their own missteps.

Everything about you, and yours are contrary, and it is best if all within your crusade remain silent.


Well, I didn't Burn Amarr, and I hold to the belief that I am responsible for my actions, and you are responsible for yours. So I really can't answer for those who participated in Burn Amarr, any more than Jamyl Sarum can answer for the invasions of Matar and Starkman Prime. In the same vein, I am not - and cannot defend the choices of Max Singularity, but rather, I am asking Brother Honorius if there are factors he has not taken into consideration in his decision.

My intent, as I said, is not to defend someone's choices, but to offer up information, that someone else can make a more informed choice than they might otherwise have done. If Brother Honorius has already considered this possibility, then there's hardly any need for him to continue to dwell on it. If he's not, then it might be something that he would want to consider. And no, none of Max's arguments to capsuleers, especially in nullsec, have yet included any Amarr law or scripture - but if they did, it's likely that that would make them less likely to be successful. If you have the option of being subtle, and successful, or blatant, and failing, then why would you choose the latter?
Conrad Chow
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2015-07-21 02:01:10 UTC
Well said Brother, I'm glad someone had the pluck to bring to light Singularity's perversion of the Amarr faith.

Amarr victor!
Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#25 - 2015-07-21 02:14:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Samira Kernher
Arrendis wrote:
And no, none of Max's arguments to capsuleers, especially in nullsec, have yet included any Amarr law or scripture - but if they did, it's likely that that would make them less likely to be successful. If you have the option of being subtle, and successful, or blatant, and failing, then why would you choose the latter?


A victory won with weapons of the Deceiver is no victory. God demands that we do things properly, not through lies and deceit.

And I will repeat, that his arguments do not simply decline to reference Scripture, they are actively contrary and defiant of it. He is a radical liberal and reformist. He is not presenting God's message, he is presenting his own aberration. He preaches treason and blasphemy, and encourages his minions to desecrate and defile.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#26 - 2015-07-21 02:31:04 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:

A victory won with weapons of the Deceiver is no victory. God demands that we do things properly, not through lies and deceit.


So killing people and making their children slaves for a thousand years is ok, but letting someone get to know you and trust you before telling them about the Holy Scriptures is bad? Fascinating.

Quote:
And I will repeat, that his arguments do not simply decline to reference Scripture, they are actively contrary and defiant of it. He is a radical liberal and reformist. He is not presenting God's message, he is presenting his own aberration.


As a hypothetical, if God were to decide that the time for violent enslavement of other cultures was at an end, how would He make this known that wouldn't be labelled heresy and radicalism? If it came from an Emperor/Empress, then would it be believed, or would the defenders of the faith and the Amarr traditions decry their leader?

How could you tell the difference between God's Will saying 'this is the appointed time for this to change', and a dangerous heresy taking root in the highest levels of the faith? Again, as a hypothetical.

Quote:
He preaches treason and blasphemy, and encourages his minions to desecrate and defile.


Now hang on! First we're his minions, then he's a 'goon puppet', then we're his minions again? Seriously now, one or the other, you folks have to make up your minds! Especially if you're going to object to contrarianism.
Strange Shadow
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#27 - 2015-07-21 02:34:49 UTC
Arrendis wrote:


My intent, as I said, is not to defend someone's choices, but to offer up information...


Every goon offer is a scam. Common knowledge proven countless times. Even your own news site is chock full of proofs.

Your lies fall on deaf ears.
Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#28 - 2015-07-21 02:57:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Samira Kernher
Arrendis wrote:
So killing people and making their children slaves for a thousand years is ok, but letting someone get to know you and trust you before telling them about the Holy Scriptures is bad? Fascinating.


If your means of getting them to trust you is with promises and teachings that are forbidden by Scripture? Then yes, it is bad. It is contrary to God's Will.

We must be honest and true to God's Will and His Word. Hate slavery if you want, but it is honest. A slave is told precisely what she is and what she must do to earn God's forgiveness. She is given the choice to obey and work her way into God's graces and freedom for her family, or to disobey and face God's wrath and taint her family with her sins.

The forceful truth is better than the comforting lie. Blessed is Servitude, for in it lies Salvation.

Quote:
As a hypothetical, if God were to decide that the time for violent enslavement of other cultures was at an end, how would He make this known that wouldn't be labelled heresy and radicalism? If it came from an Emperor/Empress, then would it be believed, or would the defenders of the faith and the Amarr traditions decry their leader?


It would be believed, because Her Imperial Majesty speaks with the Voice of God. The Emperor of Amarr and the Theology Council are the people charged to carry forth God's message. Their word is indisputable law.

Her Imperial Majesty has denounced Singularity. He has no right or authority with which to argue back.

Quote:
How could you tell the difference between God's Will saying 'this is the appointed time for this to change', and a dangerous heresy taking root in the highest levels of the faith? Again, as a hypothetical.


It's not our place to decide that difference. This is called Faith, that thing that Singularity and his supporters preach and yet understand nothing of. Amarr trust our betters to guide us righteously, because we have Faith in them, as God's chosen representatives in this world.

Her Imperial Majesty is the Voice of God. The Theology Council are the interpreters of God's Will. Their decisions stand above all others, save God. Not one soul beneath has any right or authority to question them. All things serve one higher.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#29 - 2015-07-21 03:09:59 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:
It would be believed, because Her Imperial Majesty speaks with the Voice of God. The Emperor of Amarr and the Theology Council are the people charged to carry forth God's message. Their word is indisputable law.


And if the Empress and the Theology Council disagree with one another?
Arrendis
TK Corp
#30 - 2015-07-21 03:13:55 UTC
Strange Shadow wrote:
Your lies fall on deaf ears.


And which lies would those be? That I didn't participate in Burn Amarr? That I disagree with the Amarr tradition of slavery? Please, do enlighten us.
Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#31 - 2015-07-21 03:36:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Samira Kernher
Arrendis wrote:
Samira Kernher wrote:
It would be believed, because Her Imperial Majesty speaks with the Voice of God. The Emperor of Amarr and the Theology Council are the people charged to carry forth God's message. Their word is indisputable law.


And if the Empress and the Theology Council disagree with one another?


Her Imperial Majesty speaks with the Voice of God. Her will is the will of God. In such disagreements, there can be no disputing her.

The Lord gave our Emperor the power to harness the Good and punish the Evil.
Ever since, the Emperor has lived the lives of his subjects and breathed the air of authority.

- Book I, 1:14


God gave the Emperor of Amarr the power to harness Good and punish Evil. No lesser person has that power, and so it is the Emperor of Amarr who breathes the air of authority. No one but God may rule over the Emperor of Amarr.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#32 - 2015-07-21 03:47:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Arrendis
Samira Kernher wrote:
Her Imperial Majesty speaks with the Voice of God. Her will is the will of God. In such disagreements, there can be no disputing her.


Ok, so the Empress is utterly infallible, guided by God. If the Emperor/Empress is infallible, then why did the Empire attempt a Reclamation of the Jove that resulted in an immediate defeat... and the Minmatar Rebellion that cost the Empire the majority of the Matari populace? Wouldn't infallibility mean that the attack on the Jove was the Will of God, and that by extension, the enslavement of the Jove was the Will of God?

And if it was the Will of God... how could they fail?
Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#33 - 2015-07-21 04:25:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Samira Kernher
The will of the Emperor of Amarr is infallible, because it is the will of God.

The efforts of we servants is not, because we are not perfect. Our souls are still tainted with weakness, with sin, temptation, disbelief. We are in a struggle always to Reclaim our souls and prove our worth to God. God sets us upon His will, but only we can determine whether succeed or fail at carrying out that Divine Will.

It is the will of God that we Reclaim all of creation and become whole with Him again. But the Reclaiming is internal as much as it is external. The enemies of the outside must be defeated, and the enemies of the inside controlled. If we cannot control the enemies inside our own souls, how can we conquer the enemies of the outside?

Vak'atioth was lost because of the failings of man. The traitor fleet commander, a man once renowned for his faith, turned to apostasy and treason against God and Amarr. The sickness born in him spread through the fleet and corrupted all chance at victory. His failure to overcome his inner demons doomed everyone around him.

The same happened in the Minmatar Rebellion. The holder of the Starkmanir failed to control his own inner enemies, and lost the strength to enforce discipline on his people. In his fear of being too harsh, he used a soft hand and spoiled his children. He refused to cull their culture, he failed to punish them for choosing wrong over right, and so in their hearts grew arrogance and greed. They worshiped their holder as a god, instead of worshiping the one Lord God, because their holder gave them freedom to act upon their desires. When the holder was executed and struck for his heresies, his spoiled and poorly-taught servants rebelled. They spread their fallen holder's twisted teachings to a thousand other slave communities, corrupting more minds and growing a cancer of insubordination against God.

Those teachings are the same that your Harbinger of Blasphemy uses now. He is loved because he offers comforting promises of freedom to do as one pleases. People are sinful, and drawn to those who encourage them to indulge in temptation. It is easy to win followers when you promise what they want, instead of what they need.

The Will of God is clear. It is given in Scripture, and communicated to us by the Emperor of Amarr. But mankind is fallen. We are tainted. A monster dwells within that must be shackled and controlled lest it consume us and drive us to evil. Vak'atioth failed because those who fought it failed to control that beast. The Rebellion was spawned because of those whose duty it was to teach had they themselves failed to control that beast.

Max Singularity is a modern Fleet Commander of Vak'atioth. He is a modern Holder of the Starkmanir. He is a modern Heir of House Khanid, and a modern Chamberlain of Blood. He is a man who has failed to control the enemies of the inside, and now seeks to unbind the monster in those around him. This is why he is a heretic, this is why he is a blasphemer, this is why he is a traitor. Every failure suffered by the Amarr Empire resulted because of people exactly like him.

The great Amarr Empire was founded to cultivate the spirit of man.
To do so the enemies of the outside had to be defeated and the enemies of the inside controlled.

- Book I, 1:14
Arrendis
TK Corp
#34 - 2015-07-21 06:58:48 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:
The will of the Emperor of Amarr is infallible, because it is the will of God.


I understand the principle, but I'm still a bit iffy on how it plays out.

If the will of the Emperor is infallible, then would not the Emperor choose someone who would be successful to lead his fleets? If God wishes the Jovians to be Reclaimed, then not Reclaiming the Jovians because a man who could not control his inner enemies was selected to lead the Reclamation effort... would indicate that a mistake was made in the selection of that man, would it not?
Max Singularity
House Singularity
Sixth Empire
#35 - 2015-07-21 08:08:29 UTC
Honorius Vitellius wrote:
On the eve of the unnecessary deaths of millions, a clear response to some of the ideas put forth by Maximilian Singularity is necessary. At the present juncture, my words will do nothing to prevent the carnage soon to come, but I present them as a continued confession of faith, a declaration of Amarr identity in the face of an assault that seeks to destroy it. This attack upon what it is to be Amarr seeks to substitute the clarity of God, Scripture, and history for the glory of one man and the expediencies of one moment. This attack must be resisted. This attack is a test, and in this test the Faith will find strength but not in the way Singularity expects.

The great danger of this attack and how it is clearly opposed to God can be most easily seen in the organization and the individual who leads it. The assault upon the Empire and the Faith has been described as a cleansing “inquisition” and the action of a “Sixth Empire,” under the direction of a “pope” who would be an emperor if he could. I will first respond to what Singularity describes his so-called “Sixth Empire” to be. I will then describe what this organization actually is.

Singularity’s Empire makes no mention of the Lord, but many references to both himself and to capsuleers as if they were gods. Regard how he has described the “Sixth Empire” to me:
“The Sixth Empire is not a thing you can join, nor quit. It is not a thing that is united, in fact, it excels when it is divided. It can not fall, it can only rise. It is the very thing that has made CVA, The Imperium and all the alliances stronger over the years. It is the exclusive realm of Capsuleers where we strengthen by our divided adversity. It is a realization. An idea. A bad idea, a good idea both in one where duality of confusion leads only to the infusion of STRENGTH.”

These notions make little logical sense and even less sense when an attempt is made to reconcile them with the Lord’s Scriptures and the Amarr tradition. Even the most unlearned seminary student can see these flaws, and I apologise for rehearsing basic elements of Amarr doctrine in my response to them. The duty of the Reclaiming is unity. This unity is the goal of the Lord, who wishes that all of His creatures be returned to Him. Singularity says that his “empire,” in contrast thrives on permanent division: “It is not a thing that is united, in fact it excels when it is divided.” In these words, he seems to suggest that the final goal of the “empire” is not a Reclaiming to God but endless division, death, and self-glory. Where is any reference to God? Where is any reference to the Scriptures? This is not a faithful “empire” it is something else.

In addition, Singularity calls for legal inquest while breaking the law. Amarr law is based on the Lord and His Scriptures. Singularity cites none of these. What law does he claim to enforce? If one enforces notions born from one’s own mind outside of any tradition or legitimate government, this is not law. It is pure tyranny, a farcical pantomime of legitimacy. He promises you freedom and an end of slavery, as long as you submit to his novel notions and all his demands. To all others he offers only death, with endless contempt for the rest of humanity. He participated in what his band of terrorists called “Burn Amarr” feeling “no pity” for the countless thousands killed (even the crews of merchant ships whose “crime” was travelling in a system he had chosen to indiscriminately attack for the promulgation of terror). He does all these actions to underline the Empress’ supposed wickedness and his own supposed nobility. Judging by their evident fruits, which is the more poisoned? Indeed, far from heaping scorn on the Empress, he exalts her by comparison.

Singularity appears to discount that capsuleers are involved with and, in fact, servants to the Lord. Our role is to further His plan for all of humanity, not just ourselves. An exclusive “empire” of capsuleers is an offense against this basic truth. We are servants of the Lord, even those of us who do not know it. What singularity outlines is not the Amarr faith; it is a capsuleer-centred death cult. Indeed, the so-called “Sixth Empire” resembles more a monument of homicidal vanity, a twisted idolatry of the self to the expense of God. As I have argued before, submission to the Lord above all else is the essence of Amarr (https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5831129). Singularity promises you a slavery to the self, rather than submission to God that will make you free. The Lord’s true Empire is for all of humanity. It is the destination of all peoples. Let us, faithful, re-affirm our ultimate allegiance to the Lord, to His plan and to his one, only, holy, Amarr Empire. Amarr Victor! Faithful to God forever!

Given by Brother Honorius, Lord and Holder of the Vitellius Family, Servant of God and His Empire



You did not live up to the promise stated in this manifesto's first sentence. Not much factual information here I can debate. Pity.

Well, maybe one point I can debate. My lack of using God and the Lord in my Proclamations, is true. Good job on catching that one.

The reason is simple and apparent. Read the replies. Read all the replies of the other communiques. Read the statements by many of the writers of IGS. Include the Bloodraiders, the Sansha, the Kahnid, and the Amarr... for those that throw out the title God, and His name do so in vain.

They all... ALL... A-L-L use His name as if it were their personal broadsword to swing towards their victims!!

Sacrilege

Blasphemers

There is no reverence for its usage. It is used to justify all the humanistic evil perpetrated upon humankind, and even damnation of the animal kingdom. It is used in violence, domination, and justification to control His creations made of Water, Earth, Wind, and Fire. It is used in vain and unholy declarations of cruelty.

I hold His name sacred!

Harbinger of Faith His Holiness Maximilian Singularity VI, Pope of New Eden

First Champion House Kador (defeated) - #MagnateGate

Viceroy Interview & Apostle In Amarr

Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#36 - 2015-07-21 08:18:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyn Farel
Arrendis wrote:
Samira Kernher wrote:
The will of the Emperor of Amarr is infallible, because it is the will of God.


I understand the principle, but I'm still a bit iffy on how it plays out.

If the will of the Emperor is infallible, then would not the Emperor choose someone who would be successful to lead his fleets? If God wishes the Jovians to be Reclaimed, then not Reclaiming the Jovians because a man who could not control his inner enemies was selected to lead the Reclamation effort... would indicate that a mistake was made in the selection of that man, would it not?


If you are refering to Vak'Atioth, it is probably one of the events that brought the most tremor in the modern Amarr society, and continues to that day.

Many have discussed it in depth, over and over again, and the explanations, as always, are numerous and varied. Was it a trial sent to the emperor Damius like the Sefrim were for Amash-Akura himself (see. Epitoth) ? Was it a trial sent to all of the Amarr ? What was the true meaning behind ?

Most seem to agree that a certain questioning was cast upon the Amarr way of old, and many calls for change happened since then. You will often notice a certain difference in how the Empire used to deal with the rest of New Eden before Vak'Atioth, and after.
Honorius Vitellius
The Icarus Expedition
Solyaris Chtonium
#37 - 2015-07-21 09:28:16 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
is it not reasonable to say that there can be temporal conflict among the faithful, and that unity with your God does not necessarily require unity with your political apparatus?

Is it not also reasonable to think that Maximilian Singularity may be attempting to guide capsuleers by degrees? To first harness their energy in a way that will later allow him to introduce them to concepts from the Amarr faith and scriptures, rather than attempt to stand in front of them and yell out scripture verse now in a gesture that would surely be almost completely ignored and ineffective?


In response to your question, I can offer few words better stated than those Samira Kernher has offered. By way of support, I will echo that unity with God (the only God, He is not “my” God alone; He is the only God) does require unity with the “political apparatus” of the Amarr Empire. This unity is the ultimate destiny of all humanity, although its realization will take eons. The Lord’s plan for how this unity will precisely come about cannot be fully known by us at present. Our place is to remain faithful to Him and to what He has commanded of us through His revelation. We cannot do otherwise.

Regarding your insinuation that one might inculcate the Faith in criminals via stealth, I must again echo Kernher’s response that this is not the way to create true faith as practiced by the Empire for eons. To be holy, one cannot become impure. A human is too small a thing to embody a duality of that kind successfully.

Finally, regarding slavery I have explained at length the imperial position. Slavery is a response to criminality, as all of those wilfully estranged from God are criminals, guilty of the worst possible crime of all crimes: treason against the Lord. The faithful must respond to this crime and seek to prevent it.

If there are other questions you and yours may have regarding the doctrines of the Empire, continue to ask them. I will, if able, respond in further dedicated postings to them.

Max Singularity wrote:
Not much factual information here I can debate. Pity.


At last, to Singularity, what greater fact can I cite than that in the “doctrine” we have seen from you there is nothing of the true Faith? I must again, in the names of the uncounted thousands of non-capsuleers so cruelly slain in actions you have supported, raise the fact of the terrorist attack called “Burn Amarr.”
Kontrahage
Perkone
Caldari State
#38 - 2015-07-21 09:41:01 UTC
Max Singularity wrote:


You did not live up to the promise stated in this manifesto's first sentence. Not much factual information here I can debate. Pity.

Well, maybe one point I can debate. My lack of using God and the Lord in my Proclamations, is true. Good job on catching that one.

The reason is simple and apparent. Read the replies. Read all the replies of the other communiques. Read the statements by many of the writers of IGS. Include the Bloodraiders, the Sansha, the Kahnid, and the Amarr... for those that throw out the title God, and His name do so in vain.

They all... ALL... A-L-L use His name as if it were their personal broadsword to swing towards their victims!!

Sacrilege

Blasphemers

There is no reverence for its usage. It is used to justify all the humanistic evil perpetrated upon humankind, and even damnation of the animal kingdom. It is used in violence, domination, and justification to control His creations made of Water, Earth, Wind, and Fire. It is used in vain and unholy declarations of cruelty.

I hold His name sacred!


I grow tired of this nonsense.
Max Singularity
House Singularity
Sixth Empire
#39 - 2015-07-21 11:04:50 UTC
Utari Onzo wrote:
... yet he has no support from the very people he has come from, The Amarr! A nullsec coalition and a few rag tag outlaws and other ignorants does not the support of an entire cluster make...



When you say nullsec coalition, you also mean CVA.

Consider this...
If you think there are no CVA and Members of its Houses standing by my side, then you are naive.

And...
If you think that I do not respect the institution that CVA has built, then you are deaf.

Furthermore...
If you believe name calling, degrading, demeaning arguments to focus on me or The Imperium, and not the topic at hand are a valid tactic of diplomacy, then maybe it is my fault to listen to those at my side. For plans and mercies can be reset.

Harbinger of Faith His Holiness Maximilian Singularity VI, Pope of New Eden

First Champion House Kador (defeated) - #MagnateGate

Viceroy Interview & Apostle In Amarr

Kontrahage
Perkone
Caldari State
#40 - 2015-07-21 11:17:10 UTC
Max Singularity wrote:
Utari Onzo wrote:
... yet he has no support from the very people he has come from, The Amarr! A nullsec coalition and a few rag tag outlaws and other ignorants does not the support of an entire cluster make...



When you say nullsec coalition, you also mean CVA.

Consider this...
If you think there are no CVA and Members of its Houses standing by my side, then you are naive.

And...
If you think that I do not respect the institution that CVA has built, then you are deaf.

Furthermore...
If you believe name calling, degrading, demeaning arguments to focus on me or The Imperium, and not the topic at hand are a valid tactic of diplomacy, then maybe it is my fault to listen to those at my side. For plans and mercies can be reset.



I have no doubt your criminal connections were successful in installing spies and covered agents among our ranks but do not presume to use the good name of the Curatores Veritatis Alliance to support your devious plot.