Ships & Modules

Hey guys, so im reading all these posts on the baddon fits and im just drawing complete blanks... everyone says the cap is terrible - well i am pretty skilled, no implants 3x cap rechargers and i have zero cap problems, i run all lasers with conflag, tracking comp 3 energized adaptive and a t2 large repper constantly - cap stable at 39%... the only sacrifice is no AB/MWD, but if i were to fit one i could pulse it without being absolutely capless.

my problem in the baddon is range - people say that apoc is better for sniping, so i made a tachyon t2 build... 8 guns required a reactor control but i crammed em in there, still cap stable and my range with optimal range script/Aurora is 148+37!!!!!!!! now i read other posts and people are saying you cant snipe - my trouble is i can rarely even get at that extreme a range.

so im looking for the best combination of crystals and guns in order to be able to fire at rats at all basic ranges - i need the best combo of tracking comp/script/crystal/laser to work effectively at 10-50, 50-100 and 100-120 (dont think any more is practical since i can already get more and found it pointless in most missions)

also - just a general question but i see everyone spec hardens, i just go 3x energized adaptive and i can tank most l4s indefinitely unless i agro the whole damn spawn + 2 waves or something ridiculous like that... named char hit me with 200 damage penetrates and its just not a problem to stay at full armor and 50%+ cap... my problem is damage projection, which is wierd since everyone here says that baddon does big damage but cos of cap cant damage and tank.

not posting a build because i dont have one, im still playing around with it and am looking for advice on what to get - im not looking to spend big, so t2 is as expensive as Ill go (no faction please, i know they are awesome but im not spending that much isk on em)

thanks for reading and i hope you guys can help, i been out the game for years and i remember hating this thing for its horrendous cap use - now i come back and its so OP i dont know how to make it work like i want :D :D

"so im looking for the best combination of crystals and guns in order to be able to fire at rats at all basic ranges - i need the best combo of tracking comp/script/crystal/laser to work effectively at 10-50, 50-100 and 100-120 (dont think any more is practical since i can already get more and found it pointless in most missions)"

you got a point - but im poor atm, what would be the best combo with the mods i already got laying around (t2 lasers of every kind, alot of cap mods etc - normal amarr t2 stuff) please include a summary of ranges and crystals that you guys use... i see some people use t2 crystals... some people go faction...some people use normal L crystals or a mix of the aforementioned - whats the best combo of these at different ranges for maximum damage?

no idea if it matters but im running missions out of lustrevik in minmitar space - mostly angels with some amarr navy/caldari navy rats.

Ouch indeed on Angels. On the plus side, their ewar is a joke and they tend to have fewer raw hitpoints than other rats. On the minus, their resists are stacked against lasers.

As for which crystals. Let's break down how this logic works.

Laser crystals do some combination of EM and thermal damage. Closer range crystals have a relatively large thermal component while longer range crystals skew towards EM until you hit Radio and get to pure EM. Closer range crystals also do more absolute damage.

Angels (ignoring for a moment Angel Webifiers and Vipers, which are definitely odd) have resists, low to high, of exp/kin/therm/EM. Ergo, you want to maximize the amount of thermal damage your lasers are doing and always want to pick the shortest range crystal you can for the job.

However, Angels also do the most damage up close, so you want to be able to keep some range. The ship that allows you to do that is the Apoc (or NApoc). The Abaddon lacks the range bonus so you end up having to rely on longer range crystals -- which will do more EM damage and thus lower effective damage.

So which crystals? Well, you aren't going to have to shoot out past 100km due to the Apoc's limited lock range. With perfect skills and two range-scripted T2 tracking computers, UV shoots to 94+33 -- so let's call that 100km. That should be your longest range option. Multifrequency is obviously your short range go-to. There are two in-between types: Xray and Gamma. Either is viable and you might as well carry them, especially since they both have much higher thermal components than UV. If you are fitting T2 guns you might as well carry Gleam as well; the 50% thermal damage is really nice to have around though the range is short enough that you need to consider how long you want to stick around at that point. At the very least it will be good for breaking the last few battleships on the field after there's no real remaining threat.

So do you spring for faction crystals? Yes. Yes you do. They don't break that often; just buy them. It's an Apoc; they aren't known for raw damage so pump it up as much as you can.

i get its a waste - but it seems to work better for the angels (wierd i know) i tried going active with kin/exp but for some reason they shredded me way quicker than they did when i went EANM II.... maybe just bad luck on a mission or something but the difference is significant... honestly i can sit there and tank whole camps for 4-5mins without actually getting under 50% cap, back in the day we used to fit t2 meds as a constant rep and t2 large as a backup for pulsing - i see this is not done anymore...

at any rate thank you very much to zhillia and elitatwo for the very comprehensive explanations and thats exactly what i needed to know - already got a mobile depot, and im thinking if i find a way to fit a MJD (im yet to use one, did not exist in my day) i can jump out to 100, drop a depot and start shredding with beams and then switch out to pulses once they get under 60 or so... and i will get faction crystals - i just didnt want faction guns as they are too pricy... crystals are acceptable.

thanks again guys - very appreciated! :))

don't waste too much of your time with the baddon, train for the NMs and armor tank it using tachs + navymulti and watch the rats melt with ease in any lev 4 mission (angel included).

This seems okay, it's really slow though and uses Pulse instead of Beams though.

[Abaddon, Eddard Stark]
Large Armor Repairer II
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II

100MN Afterburner II
Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script

Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Radio L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Radio L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Radio L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Radio L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Radio L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Radio L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Radio L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Radio L

Large Energy Locus Coordinator II
Large Energy Locus Coordinator II
Large Nanobot Accelerator I

that answered itself



Pretty big sacrifice since you also have no range.



Mostly see apocs fitted with pulses, quite a few missions have rats at 80km+



Bring a few of the navy ones, gamma/x-ray and standard should be in your hold.



2 spec hardeners vs 3 eanms, can you not see the advantage in this?

And no, people do not say "big damage but cant damage and tank cos of cap". if you've read any of my posts thoroughly on the topic you wouldn't have posted this.

and nightmares are so cheap these days

In a CNR you can run most missions on the natural cap buffer and recharge of the ship since you are just using cap for pulsing the shield booster where on the abaddon you would go dry just shooting the guns. I'm not sure how well a cap boosted abaddon would do. but on the abaddon you don't need to use your rigs for damage application so it doesn't hurt as much to use them for cap, although using them for range/tracking would be nice. and with the way cap mods stack to get it anywhere near cap stable you have to use a ton of slots, and at that point adding one more makes it completely cap stable.

tl;dr agree completely get a nightmare/paladin

eeeeehhhh the amarr navy would like a word with you


Ngeddon is a fantastic boat too, very face melty.