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Making missions and ratting a group activity
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William Husker Adama
Voyager Syndicate
#1 - 2015-07-13 22:56:13 UTC
Currently in most cases it's more beneficial to do missions and ratting solo with a somewhat pimped or optimized ship.

Exceptions include incursions and some wormhole combat anomalies.

One thing that could make these missions and ratting more appealing to do in a group would be an increase in mission rewards, LP points and/or bounties for people who are in a fleet.

Let's say you'd get up to 10-15% more bounties and mission rewards depending on how many people are in your fleet and participating in the mission or ratting activity. So if you only have 2 people in fleet, maybe you only get 3% increase in bounties, 3 people and you get 6% etc. up untill maybe a maximum of 5-6 people where you'd get the highest buff.

This is not a magic bullet to fix PVE obviously, but it would help to make it a more social activity rather than a solitary one.

Thoughts? Comments?
Paranoid Loyd
#2 - 2015-07-13 23:06:26 UTC
There are quite a few efficiencies that can be gained by running missions in a group. There is no need to increase the rewards that would just be abused by multi-boxers anyway. I say this as a multi-boxer who would abuse it.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Aerasia
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2015-07-13 23:20:35 UTC
William Husker Adama wrote:
Thoughts? Comments?

Incursions seem to be 'social' enough, in a min-maxed self interested sort of way.

Honestly, I'd aim to bring the PvE and PvP combat together. Incursions show that if the ISK is there people will group up for it. But I wonder, could you get mission runners to swallow the idea that most of them need to re-ship after every mission because they got alpha'd off the grid fleet combat style? Or that they need dedicated tackle because the only ship in the mission with a bounty on it is skittish?
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#4 - 2015-07-13 23:43:00 UTC
Players will create a fleet with an alt and have their alt participate in the mission in the bare minimum way and run it solo with their main anyways.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

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elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#5 - 2015-07-14 00:32:10 UTC
I have an idea, ask your corp buddies to come along, instal teamspeak and everyone who kills a ship need to drink beer until it makes fun.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#6 - 2015-07-14 03:16:36 UTC
They put team burners in the game, didnt they?

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#7 - 2015-07-14 03:30:38 UTC
Nothing is stopping you from running missions or ratting in a group.

I love group content, but love the fact that Eve has plenty of content that I can do solo.

Eve definitely does not need a way to reward me even more for playing the game with six characters.

What I would totally support, is making DED sites, especially the 6/10 through 10/10 harder and less common. As it is, they are all relatively easy (although they are easier in some space than in others). I would be okay with them requiring more team work to complete.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#8 - 2015-07-14 06:08:28 UTC
FT Diomedes wrote:
What I would totally support, is making DED sites, especially the 6/10 through 10/10 harder and less common. As it is, they are all relatively easy (although they are easier in some space than in others). I would be okay with them requiring more team work to complete.

You mean the Serpentis 6-10/10s? All other DEDs of these classes that I know are definitely a challenge solo. I recently had the pleasure to run a Sansha 10/10; it definitely was not soloable in my BS and I brought along some corp mates in logis. I am not entirely sure about Guristas, but all Serpentis DEDs are soloable in an Ishtar without any problems. I do not know if you know the Sennen's Tip (Part 2 of the Serpentis Logistical Outpost). This site, while "only" having a very low chance of dropping cruiser A-Type modules, is highly challenging in my opinion. Respawning neutralizing towers and high-dps sentries, lots of elite frigates and elite cruisers and time/ship kill triggered waves of reinforcements. I tried this one a couple of times in Syndicate in an Ishtar and it took me some time and effort to not die in this one. The same goes for the Angel version (Mineral Acquisition Outpost 2), which I have only been able to run once so far but experienced some problems with my Geddon when I did. They are classified as unrated 6/10s, but by the challenge that I felt in these plexes, they are more likely to a 9/10. More DEDs should be like these, including some further improvements to make them even harder, in particular by fielding more ewar and elite stuff, more respawns and random triggers or time based triggers to increase the pressure.

Too much encouragement for group activity in general, however, I am not a fan of. It took me hours to get the 2 logistics for the 10/10, because people either do not want to rat, do rather rat anoms, do not have time and are afk, are gate camping some random gate or just ship spin while doing something else or for other reasons do not want to rat. I do not have the capabilities (neither pc spec and monitor count wise nor in terms of number of accounts) to run alts nor do I want to. Some PVE activities requiring a fleet to gain more rewards is all nice and dandy, but if everything were to be turned into this mess and I would have to wait for and depend on other people or park an alt on the gate all the time, PVE would turn even more into a dissatisfying activity for many than it already is. Not to mention the (as just said) already mentioned problematic use of alts to circumvent the limitations and gain more still running solo.

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FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#9 - 2015-07-14 06:35:56 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
FT Diomedes wrote:
What I would totally support, is making DED sites, especially the 6/10 through 10/10 harder and less common. As it is, they are all relatively easy (although they are easier in some space than in others). I would be okay with them requiring more team work to complete.

You mean the Serpentis 6-10/10s? All other DEDs of these classes that I know are definitely a challenge solo. I recently had the pleasure to run a Sansha 10/10; it definitely was not soloable in my BS and I brought along some corp mates in logis. I am not entirely sure about Guristas, but all Serpentis DEDs are soloable in an Ishtar without any problems. I do not know if you know the Sennen's Tip (Part 2 of the Serpentis Logistical Outpost). This site, while "only" having a very low chance of dropping cruiser A-Type modules, is highly challenging in my opinion. Respawning neutralizing towers and high-dps sentries, lots of elite frigates and elite cruisers and time/ship kill triggered waves of reinforcements. I tried this one a couple of times in Syndicate in an Ishtar and it took me some time and effort to not die in this one. The same goes for the Angel version (Mineral Acquisition Outpost 2), which I have only been able to run once so far but experienced some problems with my Geddon when I did. They are classified as unrated 6/10s, but by the challenge that I felt in these plexes, they are more likely to a 9/10. More DEDs should be like these, including some further improvements to make them even harder, in particular by fielding more ewar and elite stuff, more respawns and random triggers or time based triggers to increase the pressure.


We can discuss this further in another thread - so I do not want to get too far down the rabbit hole. I will say this, however, I do not think that a solo Ishtar should be capable of doing the 10/10 sites with ease.

As for the sites I have run:
The Serpentis 6/10 is a difficult site. The Serpentis 7/10, 8/10, 9/10, and 10/10 are very easy.

For Guristas, the 6/10, 7/10, 8/10, 9/10, and 10/10 are complete jokes. Ludicrously easy if you have the proper setup. The non-rated Guristas sites (e.g. Provincial HQ and associated escalation), are much more challenging. I think the 10/10 sites should be brought up to that level.

The Blood Raiders sites are challenging. I personally think that the Blood Raiders sites are the proper difficulty level. They are hard enough that not everyone can run them with ease (unlike Guristas), while not requiring a fleet to complete them in a timely manner.

I have only done a couple of Drones, Sanshas, or Angels sites. Some were harder than others.

Rivr Luzade wrote:

Too much encouragement for group activity in general, however, I am not a fan of. It took me hours to get the 2 logistics for the 10/10, because people either do not want to rat, do rather rat anoms, do not have time and are afk, are gate camping some random gate or just ship spin while doing something else or for other reasons do not want to rat. I do not have the capabilities (neither pc spec and monitor count wise nor in terms of number of accounts) to run alts nor do I want to. Some PVE activities requiring a fleet to gain more rewards is all nice and dandy, but if everything were to be turned into this mess and I would have to wait for and depend on other people or park an alt on the gate all the time, PVE would turn even more into a dissatisfying activity for many than it already is. Not to mention the (as just said) already mentioned problematic use of alts to circumvent the limitations and gain more still running solo.


I completely agree with you on this one. On the one hand, I like the idea of more group activities. On the other hand, I like the ability to log in to Eve on a Wednesday night in late USTZ and at least have something interesting to do solo. Waiting for other people to log in to have any content is a bad thing.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

Cassandra Skjem
Big Sister Exploration
#10 - 2015-07-14 16:07:56 UTC
William Husker Adama wrote:
Currently in most cases it's more beneficial to do missions and ratting solo with a somewhat pimped or optimized ship.

Exceptions include incursions and some wormhole combat anomalies.

One thing that could make these missions and ratting more appealing to do in a group would be an increase in mission rewards, LP points and/or bounties for people who are in a fleet.

Let's say you'd get up to 10-15% more bounties and mission rewards depending on how many people are in your fleet and participating in the mission or ratting activity. So if you only have 2 people in fleet, maybe you only get 3% increase in bounties, 3 people and you get 6% etc. up until maybe a maximum of 5-6 people where you'd get the highest buff.

This is not a magic bullet to fix PVE obviously, but it would help to make it a more social activity rather than a solitary one.

Thoughts? Comments?

Exceptions also include level 4/5 missions and FW missions, the key is learning how to blitz them as a group for more isk per hour, that is if you are into grinding. I have a job for that, but in your case, find the triggers, kill the triggers and complete only the mission objectives, it's not really that difficult to build say a Nestor within 48hrs of starting to cycle through SOE missions.

Yes I did this in a group setting and yes I optimized my ship. The benefits to running a fleet in missions are actually a lot more than what you may realize. Including but not limited to boosts, killing the rats quicker, pulling more missions at a time to minimize travel time for said optimized ships, and having someone else there that would make you harder to gank while running missions. Yes I said it, harder to gank.

The payouts from all having good social skills will also net you a fairly large LP pool, build stuff to make isk. If you want high reward bounty payouts as you said there are way better places for that and btw Wormholes don't benefit from bounties and many class wormholes are similar in difficulty to LV4s.

Is it a tarp?
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#11 - 2015-07-15 05:35:51 UTC
How to get this now.


Run smaller ships or ships not IWIN buttons for pve.


3 people in uber golems should not be surprised to be bored, or to not make much isk.

Now 3 man hac or AF it...gets its moments potentially.


Gets a nice ROI off the pve ship as well. After you spend say 1 bil on the pve BS ride of doom yes you can expect some solo spamming. that say mission pays out 20 directly with bounty and isk reward (won't play with lp voodoo magic, ignore for example's sake) they need that 20 mil. They have to pay off the ship so its actually profitable.


Drop down to say a gang of 3 AF rush....that 20 mil split say 3 ways....6ish mil right there. that can be roughly 25%of ship right there alone. 3 more missions like that....AF is paid off and a making isk. And a bit of fun. I run 3's in AF's from time to time. Not missile chucking ones to spice it up with range control for turret use. can make pve more interesting I found. More intriguing than missile spam on tengu or raven/scorpion variants I do more commonly anyway.