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What are Attributes for and why are they still in the game?

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GAJY
The Monkey Island Cannibals
#1 - 2015-07-07 14:14:13 UTC
For me personally I just see them and attribute implants as an extra thing to put new players off PVP. For people I know who play, they're just a nuisance and they wouldn't care if they were gone, just something you have to remap once in awhile and spend money on, yet it adds nothing to the experience.
Angelica Dreamstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2015-07-07 14:21:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Angelica Dreamstar
People use new players as argument for and against anything nowadays. Would you prefer the game tries to reach out for everyone?Where would the smart people go then?

bingo, his pig not being a goat doesn't make the pig wrong, just him an idiot for shouting at his pig "WHY ARENT YOU A GOAT!" (Source)

-- Ralph King-Griffin, about deranged people playing EVE ONLINE
Ivant Sumboodi
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#3 - 2015-07-07 14:29:42 UTC
idk about smart people, I just don't want the i-win people to get carte blanche here. There's always an i-win for people like OP, it's called Character Bazaar. Use it.
Commissar Rain
Kesukka
#4 - 2015-07-07 14:30:26 UTC
Skills are bad for new players too. Along with ISK.

Remove both.



Also you don't spend money to do remaps.

Member of the Commissar Kate Fanclub
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#5 - 2015-07-07 14:44:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
Commissar Rain wrote:
Skills are bad for new players too. Along with ISK.

Remove both.



Also you don't spend money to do remaps.


Actually the worst thing for new players is other players, really. I think it would just be best to remove everyone, in one progressive swoop. This is idea is not any worse than all the hilarious nonsense people have been spouting over the years in regards to "newbies catching up" and "this game should be made easier".
Hengle Teron
Red Sky Morning
The Amarr Militia.
#6 - 2015-07-07 14:47:02 UTC
They are there, so we can either choose to train anything at same speed, or limit ourselves only to specific skill groups, but train those faster.
Yarda Black
The Black Redemption
#7 - 2015-07-07 14:49:58 UTC
They're looking at ways to remove attributes, but the existence of implants is complicating matters. I cant find the source atm, but if you google, search etc you can probably find it. There is probably a discussion about it you can join.

The "basic" skills are also being looked at. Mostly in the form of beefing up starting skillpoints so n00bs can actually warp from gate to gate for example.
stoicfaux
#8 - 2015-07-07 15:10:47 UTC
Yarda Black wrote:
They're looking at ways to remove attributes, but the existence of implants is complicating matters. I cant find the source atm, but if you google, search etc you can probably find it. There is probably a discussion about it you can join.

The "basic" skills are also being looked at. Mostly in the form of beefing up starting skillpoints so n00bs can actually warp from gate to gate for example.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=432569&find=unread

Q: 'Attributes aren't very interesting, you should remove them'
A: Again, we agree. Team Size Matters discussed removing them on the o7 show (or some other public venue) awhile back and it's still something we are very interested in. We need to figure out a good way to handle all the learning implants in the game though, which is actually a difficult problem. If any of you have awesome ideas for how to handle it don't hesitate to make suggestions.


If you have feedback or ideas about the New Player Experience, then you will want to post in that thread.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#9 - 2015-07-07 15:17:36 UTC
Yarda Black wrote:
Mostly in the form of beefing up starting skillpoints so n00bs can actually warp from gate to gate for example.
I hope to, insert deity of choice, that this is sarcasm P

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#10 - 2015-07-07 15:20:46 UTC
Gaellia Bonaventure
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2015-07-07 15:44:00 UTC
Just remove all the players from the game and everything will be fine.

Bring your possibles.
Yarda Black
The Black Redemption
#12 - 2015-07-07 16:06:51 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Yarda Black wrote:
Mostly in the form of beefing up starting skillpoints so n00bs can actually warp from gate to gate for example.
I hope to, insert deity of choice, that this is sarcasm P


You wish lol

Im sorry to say your deity failed you and gave us "warpdrive operation"
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#13 - 2015-07-07 16:12:30 UTC
Yarda Black wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Yarda Black wrote:
Mostly in the form of beefing up starting skillpoints so n00bs can actually warp from gate to gate for example.
I hope to, insert deity of choice, that this is sarcasm P


You wish lol

Im sorry to say your deity failed you and gave us "warpdrive operation"
ahh I read that the wrong way Oops. I read it as "newbies can't warp to a gate because of SP"

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Baaldor
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#14 - 2015-07-07 16:22:16 UTC
FFS, just convert the game to Pong and be done with it. As that is the direction of this game anyhow.
Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#15 - 2015-07-07 16:30:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Webvan
I think this is what happens when 3 million people suddenly quit WoW and every game forum is filled with 'make this game easy naow'. Attributes aren't the problem.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
Chance Ravinne
WiNGSPAN Delivery Services
WiNGSPAN Delivery Network
#16 - 2015-07-07 17:15:28 UTC
Attributes aren't the Big Bad, but they're certainly an unintuitive and unfun system. The mourning process following their demise will be short.

You've just read another awesome post by Chance Ravinne, CEO of EVE's #1 torpedo delivery service. Watch our misadventures on my YouTube channel: WINGSPANTT
Baaldor
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#17 - 2015-07-07 18:20:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Baaldor
Chance Ravinne wrote:
Attributes aren't the Big Bad, but they're certainly an unintuitive and unfun system. The mourning process following their demise will be short.


I think it really separates pilots a bit as to make them a wee bit different. meaning that it is another way of adjusting (or not) the process of learning something another pilot may not value as much and able to pool or push their attributes towards that direction.

It gives a slightl uniqueness to one pilot verses another rather than the vanilla cookie cutter stamp out some sort of character etc etc.
Algarion Getz
Aideron Corp
#18 - 2015-07-07 20:03:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Algarion Getz
GAJY wrote:
yet it adds nothing to the experience.

They add an option to specialise your character. This is surely not the best way to do it, but if they remove it, another option to customize your character is gone. I know CCP needs to reduce unnecessary complexity to keep new players, but if you make everything easy and straightforward EVE wouldnt be EVE anymore. Change attributes or if you remove them, give us another way to customize our character (this does not mean more cosmetics).


EDIT: This:
Baaldor wrote:
Chance Ravinne wrote:
Attributes aren't the Big Bad, but they're certainly an unintuitive and unfun system. The mourning process following their demise will be short.


I think it really separates pilots a bit as to make them a wee bit different. meaning that it is another way of adjusting (or not) the process of learning something another pilot may not value as much and able to pool or push their attributes towards that direction.

It gives a slightl uniqueness to one pilot verses another rather than the vanilla cookie cutter stamp out some sort of character etc etc.
stoicfaux
#19 - 2015-07-07 20:06:54 UTC
Chance Ravinne wrote:
Attributes aren't the Big Bad, but they're certainly an unintuitive and unfun system. The mourning process following their demise will be short.

The 30 day accelerated learning boosters/implants sold in the NES will help ease the sense of loss.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
stoicfaux
#20 - 2015-07-07 20:18:20 UTC
Baaldor wrote:
Chance Ravinne wrote:
Attributes aren't the Big Bad, but they're certainly an unintuitive and unfun system. The mourning process following their demise will be short.


I think it really separates pilots a bit as to make them a wee bit different. meaning that it is another way of adjusting (or not) the process of learning something another pilot may not value as much and able to pool or push their attributes towards that direction.

It gives a slightl uniqueness to one pilot verses another rather than the vanilla cookie cutter stamp out some sort of character etc etc.

I can't even agree that they provided even a "slight uniqueness" between pilots. Uniqueness between pilots implies character. Attributes are simply a min-maxing technique to optimize your yearly skill plan. Based on a character's attributes, do you go around saying things like, oh hey, that pilot is smart! Or that pilot is charismatic? Do you fly combat ships because your pilot has high perception? Do you only do industry with your high intelligence characters? What is the average Charisma attribute of Fleet Commanders?

I would guess that even role-players don't take their attributes seriously.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
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