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Getting all lines running.
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Wide Awake
Proxy Gallore
#1 - 2015-07-06 09:19:28 UTC
I am having trouble getting the full use out of all my slots. I have two problems.

1. A combination of procuring materials in a timely manner and having the right amount of buffer. I do have a reasonable amount of capital so I can afford an ok buffer. However I don't have an infinite amount of capital and I would like to use it intelligently.

2. Getting enough turnover to justify using all my slots. I have 40+ bpos but you only get so much of any market and build times seem really fast. Of course which BPOs matter. How do I get more out of each item? I noticed the better margin items tend to get saturated easier. Should I focus first on filling my line then go for margin?

I do succeed in using maybe 60% of all my line/hours but I would like to move that closer to 100%. Any tips would be helpful.
Oriella Trikassi
Trikassi Enterprises
#2 - 2015-07-06 15:23:19 UTC
Looks like you need a Spreadsheet. Using skill and judgement can only take you so far, beyond that the data has to be pulled down and manipulated into a display that will tell you what to do.

There is a column on mine that tells me how much for example Tritanium I need, and if I keep running out I increase the buffer.

With a Spreadsheet you should aim for a column that returns ISK/hour allowing for all the variables - manufacturing, taxes etc. Mine has lots of conditional formatting so green lights come on if something is worth manufacturing and/or trading.

The level beyond that is a graph that totals up stocks and tells you when the warehouse needs a clearout. And beyond that come more sophisticated tools that try to analyse the data and anticipate profit before it happens, which I haven't got into yet.
Gilbaron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2015-07-07 00:20:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Gilbaron
your first goal should be to fill all your slots with things that have a high relative return, but a low absolute return. having two lines running at 300k/hr is better than one at 500k/hr.

once you have done that, switch to things that have a lower relative, but a higher absolute return.

one line at 400k/hr and one at 300k/hr is better than two at 300k/hr

you don't really need a buffer in the form of materials. all the materials that lie around should be planned for some kind of job. everything else is dead capital. if you don't have the money to start an expensive job, start a cheap one instead. keep the average isk/hr of all your lines as high as possible.

there is one exception to the rule, and that's for people that have a huge collection of BPOs and BPCs and only produce for temporary shortages. this requires very fast reaction to market trends, so you often don't have the time to build your own components or buy things that aren't trivial to buy. but that business model is very different from what the average manufacturer does and shouldn't serve as an example for you.
Wide Awake
Proxy Gallore
#4 - 2015-07-08 01:51:23 UTC
Quote:
you don't really need a buffer in the form of materials. all the materials that lie around should be planned for some kind of job. everything else is dead capital. if you don't have the money to start an expensive job, start a cheap one instead. keep the average isk/hr of all your lines as high as possible.


If I don't buffer than I have extra delay during which I won't have stock for sale for the item. I guess there are two ways to buffer by having lots of finished goods on the market and by having raw materials to make from. Both tie up capital.

Quote:
Looks like you need a Spreadsheet. Using skill and judgement can only take you so far, beyond that the data has to be pulled down and manipulated into a display that will tell you what to do.

There is a column on mine that tells me how much for example Tritanium I need, and if I keep running out I increase the buffer.

With a Spreadsheet you should aim for a column that returns ISK/hour allowing for all the variables - manufacturing, taxes etc. Mine has lots of conditional formatting so green lights come on if something is worth manufacturing and/or trading.

The level beyond that is a graph that totals up stocks and tells you when the warehouse needs a clearout. And beyond that come more sophisticated tools that try to analyse the data and anticipate profit before it happens, which I haven't got into yet.


I am using a website to get the isk/hr for each item and the needed goods. Following your post I now have my own spreadsheet for keeping track of buffer. I am going to try using a PID (from control theory) to maintain my chain.
Gilbaron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2015-07-08 04:44:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Gilbaron
Quote:

If I don't buffer than I have extra delay during which I won't have stock for sale for the item. I guess there are two ways to buffer by having lots of finished goods on the market and by having raw materials to make from. Both tie up capital



you don't need a buffer for that. you need to plan your jobs ahead. there is no need to have more of anything than what you plan to use in your next batch. if you keep 100m trit just because it feels good, you aren't putting your money to work.

if you don't have the money to start expensive jobs without selling the last batch, make cheap things instead.

I have about 15b tied up in manufacturing, week a means 10b in jobs, weekend means transport, week b means 5b in jobs.

everything above that is used for fun and interest payments to Corp and alliance mates
SJ Astralana
Syncore
#6 - 2015-07-08 07:52:51 UTC
There's an opportunity cost of a supply chain not keeping up with demand. If I can make 80mil per day building SBUs, and I'm crapped out of Capital Construction Parts, I promise you I didn't start buying them quickly enough. Any argument that I should stock the 64 I need to build today rather than the 840 I need to reliably keep my production unimpeded is somewhere between academic and naive. I know what my stock levels should be because I empirically adjust them over time. I don't order 800mil trit because it feels good, I do it because at current sales levels 720mil historically has caused an efficiency cost. As my usage fluctuates due to a change in sales, my stock levels naturally adjust in response because stocks are maintained as a ratio to related sales.

Incidentally, I gross 140bil a month and net 14, and I average 1.8mil an hour in my 11 slots, so my money's on I actually know what I'm talking about.

I'm piqued by the mention of PID in the context of producing in Eve. Care to expand?

Hyperdrive your production business: Eve Production Manager

Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#7 - 2015-07-10 02:24:59 UTC
I know of three items that are basically always profitable to produce, and cheap on materials. One is Magnetic Field Stabilizer II.

These three items are my backup items. I pretty much always keep 500-2000 runs of them pre-invented and enough materials to make 500 of the item. Note this actually isn't much of a capital cost, less than a half billion for magstabs and similar amounts for the other two items (which share materials but require different BPCs)

If I have a production line that I can't keep busy due to demand being depressed on basically everything else I have the ability to produce in a short turnaround time, I start vomiting out Magstab 2s.

Supply chain screwups happen, but I try to prevent them. Usually if I have one, it's Isogen, and I've stopped those issues by being more willing to have a billion ISK tied up in minerals and another billion tied up in intermediate T2 components. Dead capital but a cost of doing business and less than the opportunity cost of investing the necessary time to be more 'just in time'.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com
Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#8 - 2015-07-10 12:36:14 UTC
Just in time inventory shouldn't be a problem - outbound freight from Jita tends to get picked up quickly. You will need a low skill ALT in Jita to make the purchases - can be a second character on your account. If you buy your materials and create your courier contract before going to bed/work - the stuff will normally be delivered by the time you get up/home.
Wide Awake
Proxy Gallore
#9 - 2015-07-10 14:54:58 UTC
Quote:
I'm piqued by the mention of PID in the context of producing in Eve. Care to expand?


It's a bit hard to explain and I'm going to wait to see if it works before writing it up. So I am going to do some science and will report back on it eventually.

Quote:
Just in time inventory shouldn't be a problem - outbound freight from Jita tends to get picked up quickly. You will need a low skill ALT in Jita to make the purchases - can be a second character on your account. If you buy your materials and create your courier contract before going to bed/work - the stuff will normally be delivered by the time you get up/home.


Rarely is the bottleneck shipping for me. Services like Red Frog and Push are mostly responsible for that. Instead it's actually getting the buy orders filled when you have large orders. I maybe shouldn't say a bottleneck cause if I had orders 24/7 on all the mats I use I would meet my demand but its definitely hard to predict and varied. For some of my mats it is almost 24/7 and I may be constrained by supply for those items. It is frustratingly hard to tell sometimes because there are lots of small delays in each part of the production chain.
Wide Awake
Proxy Gallore
#10 - 2015-07-30 05:36:29 UTC
So reporting back and the PID has worked incredibly well. I now have a fairly reliable method of purchasing materials in advance in the proper amounts. Having that be cleared out of the way allowed for me to have a better idea about the other parts of my operation that could be streamlined.

For one I still didn't have enough demand/velocity to use all my slots despite the 50+ (I actually counted this time). I now no longer .01 isk and will always change by somewhere around .5% to 1%. This has drastically improved my velocity making up for the small loss in margins. I don't think I would have gotten the feedback to make this jump without having the buffer setup.

So to finally answer SJ Astralana: A PID is a proportional-integral-derivative controller. It is used set the appropriate level for the manipulated variable (In this case the amount of supplies to order for this week). The process variable is the actual demand used. Long story short the manipulated variable is set to a linear combination of the proportional error, a sum of the errors overtime, and the derivative of the error. It is used in the real world for automated system for example controlling the heat in a room. I read an scholarly article that used a PID for inventory management and followed their plan with a slight modification.

So in the end I guess thanks for the help. In closing math works and production times are way too fast.