Player Features and Ideas Discussion

It's true the Tempest/Tempest fleet issue needs some love, but just increasing the rate of fire bonus is not enough.

Tempest and Tempest fleet issue right now are just ******** twin brothers of the Machariel - less dps, no damage application bonus, less agility and less speed. The only thing in which Tempest fleet issue is slightly better than a Mach, is the shield/armor/hull amount - around 10% better than what Mach has.

So instead of the proposed changes, why don't you give Tempest a different role?

Minmatar ships are terribly lacking in decent artillery platforms (only Jaguar and Munin can be counted as such with bonuses to both tracking and OPTIMAL, and even they need a rework for the better.). You keep pushing falloff into minmatar hulls which is kinda understandable because of autocannons.

Artillery turrets are simply the worst weapon system in the game - sure, it doesn't spend any cap and can change damage type, but where ever you see a minmatar damage application bonus, you see falloff, so not only artillery does the shittiest dps in the game, but also has the shittiest tracking in the game, AND you get falloff where ever you want to fit them just to add that little extra chance to miss....this is really a ******** concept.

Tempest hulls already have enough powergrid to fit T2 1400mm turrets - something you don't see every day, but I guess that has more to do with having only 6 turret slots.


My idea here is:

First: remove missile hardpoints from Tempest hulls.
Second: nerf their drone bays down to 25Mbit/sec and 50m3

Tempest:

10% bonus to Large Projectile turret optimal range
10% bonus to Large Projectile turret rate of fire


Tempest Fleet issue:

10% bonus to Large Projectile turret optimal range
10% bonus to Large Projectile turret rate of fire


All this would place both Tempest variations into a role of their own without being overpowered and without fighting for their place under the sun with the Machariel.

I deliberately chose an optimal bonus, and not tracking because artillery already has the worst tracking in the game, so when you bonus something that's already almost non-existant, you still get a value which is almost non-existant.
Artillery can only gain any meaningful accuracy through extra range.

Having only a rate of fire bonus would prevent alpha abuse while keeping a decent amount of dps.


Would it be too much to ask to also finally fully construct the tempest and add proper symmetry to the ship - you know...so the right side of the ship gets it's own little "bridge" and the hardpoints not shooting from within the ship's gut?

It would actually be 24 effective turrets at L5. It might need a buff, but certainly not that much.

Agreed that tempest hulls need more than they are doing now ie adding more rof on basic tempest.

While i never cared for basic tempest and the way it is looked upon i do believe that fleet issue should steer clear of it is "battlecruiser not battleship" mantra as hard as it can.

Concept is ridiculous it will never work in favor of battleship hull without making it another machariel or better.

Optimal bonus will make it an arty platform instead of autocannons pwnmobile something Minmatar ships are in dire need boosted artillery platform and for it dual dmg and no tank bonus(maelstrom) it apsolutely need to deliver bigger payload than maelstrom to be considered over it.

Maelstrom 8gun brawler with shield boost

Tempest fleet artillery platform

Typhoon caldary missile spamer.

Tempest basic battlecruiser wannabe failure.

What is OP?

It has 6 guns.

15% per level to make it slightly better than a normal Tempest, and being better than a Maelstrom by 0.5 effective turrets - It's a NAVY BATTLESHIP, it's supposed to be better than t1 battleships.

you are aware that the new tempest takes the "ship with the most effective turrets" award from the vindi right? and does more DPS then the fleet tempest, vargur and machariels RIGHT?

Just making sure...

It sure is enough. CCP overdid the rate of fire bonus. They turned the Tempest from a really awesome ship with underwhelming DPS to a really awesome ship with overwhelming DPS. I loved everything about it previously except its only 6 turrets, but now it might as well have 7 except it doesn't have to pay for the 7th and it still gets 2 utility highs. It's like the Navy Hurricane on steroids.

Some people are never happy...

Also I think the OP doesn't know how to do maths.

I would say that for both of them, 7 guns and a 10% damage bonus per level, along with a 7.5% tracking speed bonus, would be the correct way to go. Tracking speed greatly benefits both arty and autos, and would be very fun to see what it could kill with autos and high tracking.

with only 6 turrets, the 7.5% bonus means it now has only got 9.6 effective turrets, coming out in the low end of the attack battleship subclass. I'd love something like this to work out, but the numbers to make it hit the curve for DPS (where projectiles need to be nearly the top of the curve of paper DPS to be close with applied, due to fighting in falloff) are wierd things like an 8% per level bonus.

Yeah, 9.6 effective turrets is not gonna cut it, and the only reason it somewhat works on Typhoon Fleet Issue, is because of a generous drone bay.
After doing some more calculating and comparing with other similar ships, I've modified the original post again.

What CCP is proposing would make Tempest have 12 effective turrets. Machariel has 11.666...
That same effect could be achieved with a single 10% rate of fire bonus on 6 guns with the addition of an optimal bonus.

The only thing I would recommend over all that is to nerf their drone bays to 25Mbit/sec and 50m3 to keep their dps somewhat in line.