Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Ok so we all agree that this doesn't have a easy solution. It stills bugs me how it should be made, but I came with multiples "possibles" solutions to it while addressing the main issues that are:
-Too Easy & Repetitive (Bot Friendly)
-Boring (Lack of Required interaction)
-Not much rewarding experience (AFK friendly)
-Pretty Uniform (Same here as there)

SO here it comes:

Solution #1: The Minecraft/RL way
So how's real mine looks like? Just google the thing and you will see tunnels or BIG holes.
Big holes uh? humm. What if you make a big asteroid, and it have different compositions along its surface. It looks like PI. But PI only have the outside layer, its not like the big holes. OK then you add different layers to the asteroid until you hit a layer 0 called core... and if you make sections of the asteroid in all different layers and place a maximum limit to active mining lasers per sections you could make having something like those pictures... I mean, because if one guy do it he will end with a tunnel ah? Reminds me of Minecraft
If you get the train of thoughts then you end making
+Asteroids with multiples layers that could have different compositions and densities on it. The numbers of layers and composition could be ruled by sec index and location with the universe. In that case 0.0 asteroids could have like 10 layers making less but more BIGGER asteroids.
+A new survey mode where you could see the composition of the asteroid like in PI you see the richness of the planet.
+A new gameplay where its needed the coordination to mine effectively in group, depending on the size and complexity of the asteroid.

Difficulty to make: HARD
Fun to produce: WOW


Solution #2: The Cheap and bastard way
So how could you make mining more interactive with the mechanics and tools we already got? Using PVE as reference? Possible. What people do in PVE? Select targets and make sure they are hitting the targets. How? Checking that the guns got the correct ammo for the range and transversal velocity of the target. Nice there is the solution.
If you get the train of thoughts then you end making
+The amount of yield you get per cycle depends on the current range of the asteroid and its composition. So if you wanna mine veldespar, you should do it in max range with the fall off counting both ways (farther and closer). Kernite should be mined more closer to the asteroid and Arkonor be as close as 1200m to be effectively mined.
+It should affect t1 and t2 strip miners in one way and the rest of the mining lasers in another.

Difficulty to make: EASY
Fun to produce: MEH (at least its better that before, annoys more the bot farmers)


Solution #3: The mini-game way
So, what if your hud showed a new thing when you equip mining lasers or strip miners and it looks like the speed bar (the speed bar its more like a round thing but works more or less like a bar) and it glowed red until you put it in a position where it becomes blue. And what if I told you that you need to put it blue to get the maximum yield in the cycle? Makes mining more interesting ah? And what if I told you that the best minerals needs to be re-calibrated every # of cycles? And that every asteroid have a different calibration position? You could not being AFK for long.
If you get the train of thoughts then you end making
+A calibration bar where the user have to set to properly focus the mining laser to get the maximum yield possible. It changes in every asteroid and could change every # of cycles depending in the type of asteroid.
+Could have different sensitivities depending on the skills and type of miner (and crystal)

Difficulty to make: MEDIUM
Fun to produce: GOOD

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EDIT:
Well here my line of thought to Nestara solution. One that I heard many many times before.

Solution #4: The Rat Tap Map Trap way
Ok so stronger rats... I mean, incursion rats maybe? Well that just will force to have support right? Humm... So it just makes miners bring guns to protect them right? Well in high sec they are not so needed and in null sec they got it. Does it *fix* mining? Nah. Well what do miners do? Sit and make sure they getting the resources. Get resources. What if rats could affect the miners to get their resources? Like using something to cut your cycle before time? Like ECM and sensor dampers? Well just more reason to kill them. And what if they came, cut your cycle, ran away and they came again? Like guerrilla tactics. They would annoy the hell out people and dang more reason to stay sited in the game. Thats a solution. And to annoy more they could call reinforcements that could use that or again the guerrilla tactics. And if they kill your drones when chasing them
If you get the train of thoughts then you end making
+Rats that can affect the cycle of miners. They should use guerrilla tactics where they come, affect you and get away fast. Could be using ECM and sensor dampers to cut the cycle short and the turret dis to affect the striper.
+More variety of rats in re-spawns and maybe they could use the Sleepers/Incursions rat AI. Would be awesome to see them more in null sec freaking out the bastards. In high sec the "annoyers" rats could spawn more instead of good gangs. To keep the game balanced they should be still weak but more annoying, so it makes them necessary to engage at the right time.

Difficulty to make: EASY
Fun to produce: MEH (its makes you sit more, annoys more the bot farmers)

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EDIT: ALSO CHECK IDEA #5 and #6 and all post of the other people around. People want a change.

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Hope you liked the proposals to this essential problem that is current mining mechanics. And I wish this could help CCP in some way, maybe they get inspired.
I accept ISK donations

Actually think about doing those for any length of time. Same monotony as before, just with more annoyance you have to deal with. First idea isn't bad though.

#1 sounds nice but beyond anything but a full expansion.

#3 is probably the best all around option. They even already have density and scanning map type stuff from PI that they could adapt to use with ore scanners.

Stronger rats won't do much neither. And a lot of people know mining needs to be improved somehow.

Mining is NOT fine as it is. It's boring as all get-out, and the best thing going for it is that it lets you make money while afk or chatting it up. It should obviously be low key enough to allow the relaxing, but enough needs to be added to reward players that stay at their keyboard and play the game. A visual map mining kind of thing, like PI resources, would make bottingf much harder as well i'd imagine.

I like the idea of a mini-game PERHAPS, but it'd have to be done right, I wouldn't want this to be some crappy Everquest 2 type thing where you do a repetitive mini-game that only has four different variations.

This would definitely be a chance though if it was done like this to get CCP off their collective asses and design something fun and interactive to play, currently anything you do in EVE consists of point, click, wait for several hours and then repeat. Why not have some kind of puzzle game where it's a bit like bejeweled and when you activate the mining lasers a screen comes up and the more points you score, you get bonuses to the amount of ore that goes into your cargo hold and pretty skilled people can quickly make ISK at the beginning by putting their ore into the can while they progress through the puzzles?

Sure, it'd make no sense to the EVE universe, CCP could work on something that would, but at least it'd make mining more interesting and rewarding.

i'd love for us to do it like Minecraft or Miner wars but I doubt CCP would ever dare to do anything creative like that and unfortunately the rest of the stuff looks like it would only drive miners away because it seems to make it a bit more tedious than necessary.

I like an adapted version of the PI model. Boring holes in asteroids sounds server breaking though, and you could make it much simpler and more challenging.

Basically, you set it up so you have fewer and larger asteroids, and introduce a mining view much like the PI view. Initiate a scan on the asteroidand select a target point for your lasers from the shifting mass of ore density indicator hues then drop the mining view as your lasers start chugging away.

Now you are free to watch for pirates or players interested in ruining your day for awhile. At some pont, your density of ore is going to putter out and you'll have to reinitialize the mining view and reposition your lasers targeting point. I suppose you could also have multiple points based on number of lasers and visible density.

Ideally, to maximize your mining, you have to maintain the mining view and move your lasers as the density points shift and move along the surface of the asteroid. To make it more interesting, the asteroid shrinks by leaps and bounds as it is mined, until it is no more than a little lump of debris floating in space.

Botting difficulty: Extreme
Mining enjoyment Level: Theoretically fun
Fleet Support requirement for mining activities: A must.
Risk: Variable to high

Yes they are. They are a symptom and a cause of the same sickness, mining its boring and its not rewarding enough. Mining just as anything else should be made in its real majority by players.

Funny how other forms of resource gathering except for asteroid mining are automated, with the player's involvement just being setup and transport of materials...

Hey I know!

Anchorable mining structures deployable in belts and grav sites, harvests and stores ore, player transports it.

Refund everyone's mining skillpoints, or make those skills applicable to the effectiveness of the structure. Re-tool mining ships to do something more fun and useful, like station window cleaning.

The sad truth is that botters have it right, Eve just needs to accept and integrate it into the game. Any activity that is monotonous enough to be accomplished fully by a bot should just be automated in the first place. Or changed to the point where botting isn't practical, but that's aimed more towards the nullsec botting PvE Ravens and Tengus.

Ok here it comes two more, the first one inspired by Jatif McJafitson comments. I like to do this and exercise the mind that keep playing Minecraft. That thing its killing my brain (I don't stop seeing cubes and I feel more idiot than months ago) but its fun as... you know.

Solution #5: The Auto-mato way (Got to love this names)
Ok, for now what its mining? Its getting into a belt, then get to a asteroid, then hit a button, wait until the cycle its done and your cargo hull its full. How and when you empty the cargo hull to get mining started again depends on your logistics setup, the only different and dynamic activity in mining. Ok and Jatif said that THE FREAKING thing of getting in select the asteroid and hitting a button its so dumb it should be automatic. Maybe cool as PI everybody says. Humm. And how to adapt it to current skills system and modules. Dammit its hard, humm. And if we draw inspiration in RL asteroids, how could be that mining? Wait, this is giving me a idea completely different on how I want to end this one. Focus. Automatic. Well the only thing that hits me its setting something called "The collector" in space, and having them have multiple sizes and capabilities. How they should work, well, here comes the cool thing.
The "Collector" its a automatic structure that people should set in space next to asteroid belts. Asteroids in asteroids belts are big, and they move a lot. So the collector sit and wait the asteroids to come by and they hit them with the mining lasers while they pass. And they do this a lot of times.
So, if using EVE style lets say that the collectors are a hybrid of anchor-able structures and ships. Yeah, you heard me right. Lets say that its like getting a retriever, fitting it up and then getting into a position, anchor it, and wait until it fills up alone. Now the trick its knowing THE position. Using visuals like in PI, you see in the system map densities for the coming 3 hours (Or 6 or 2. 3 Hours sound fair). Yeah, they are not that constant (And those densities should look like droplets or like spot marks, apart that the internal game mechanics could make them more empty and rare as more mining have been accomplished and they should move in a orbit). Then after you set the collector in the position, the collector starts getting the resources and its more or less successful depending on its fit, the density and composition of the location.
Now the part of the logistics its the tricky one as it should be like current one. Maybe the collector could have a bigger internal cargo hold that current mining ships but then when they fill up, they should eject all the minerals inside into a can. And do it again, until they stop mining. That sounds normal and even fun to rob the cans that trow the collector itself .
If you don't get a part you should ask me what because this one have taken a lot of time and text-space to explain.

Difficulty to make: HARD
Fun to produce: GOOD (makes finding the resources more fun, mining them more automatically and transport them to the stations as usual as it is now. Apart that make bots more obsolete as they cannot find the resources by themselves easily [WOULD NEED A VERY INTELLIGENT PROGRAM TO ACCOMPLISH IT]


Solution #6: The Mix it Good (shaken not stirred) way.
Ok this one came as I was thinking in the last one and all the others behind it. So what if we mix the mini-game idea with current mining. And PI-like mechanics, and idea #1. Humm. Lets say we get a hulk and it "lands" in a big asteroid. And it opens a interface where you start using to see the "interior" of the asteroid. You see densities and composition in 3D. And you set a target region and you hit the cycle laser to start. Nah, it sounds like current mining with a awesome interface. Well, what if you mix it a little with idea # 5 and you end... making something that mines by itself? Well it needs a twist doesn't it?, and if you mix it with RL lets say, in planing a mining route inside the asteroid... AHA!
Ok lets say that you get into the asteroid and land. Then, instead of just selecting a place to cycle you program it to do it automatically by selecting places you wanna mine inside the asteroid, like multiple zones (That could have Hexagons and Pentagons forms). Then using different layers inside the asteroid (like in #1) you start seeing the inner layers composition and you start the selecting zones and start mining automatically following the plot you gave them. And that is, a mix of all previous ideas. Make me freaking tired now.

Difficulty to make: HARD
Fun to produce: GOOD

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Now I wish a CCP dev could see this posts
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