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[Duality] Sovereignty Playtest Competition

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Gabriel Karade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#141 - 2015-06-20 13:00:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Gabriel Karade
Edit: hmm, it's actually starting to grow on me.

War Machine: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=386293
BlitZ Kotare
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#142 - 2015-06-20 13:54:15 UTC
We could use some new timers Fozzie, we're past the list from yesterday.

I've spent the last ~5 hours entosis linking **** and here's some thoughts:

- The plexes need some way to tell each other apart. Often they even spawn in very similar areas so giving them some kind of code to differentiate them from each other is really necessary.

- The warmup on a capital using an entosis link is ok, but the cooldown at the end of the cycle is pretty heavy handed. Even just having to sit around for an extra 1-2 minutes on a subcap feels wasted, but being stuck somewhere for 9 extra minutes because that's just how the cycles worked out on your carrier is awful. From reading the notes on the module I was under the impression that the cycle time would still be 2 minutes and it was just the warmup phase that was extended. In practice the module seems to have a 10min cycle time on capitals.

- Taking sov that's completely uncontested shouldn't be this painful. I realize on TQ uncontested sov will most likely have lower indexes, but still. Maybe some kind of acceleration factor where if the defender (or attacker) doesn't entosis any of their plexes, as the other party completes them the capture rate speeds up?
klana depp
Tr0pa de elite.
#143 - 2015-06-20 14:54:53 UTC
BlitZ Kotare wrote:

- The plexes need some way to tell each other apart. Often they even spawn in very similar areas so giving them some kind of code to differentiate them from each other is really necessary.


ack - it was hard to tell apart newly spawned sites from existing ones, fleet was a mess even tho there was not a single hostile in system. yeah people will get used to it, but still, something like a scan signature that shows up in the name - maybe in front of the system name? - would be great.

BlitZ Kotare wrote:

- Taking sov that's completely uncontested shouldn't be this painful. I realize on TQ uncontested sov will most likely have lower indexes, but still. Maybe some kind of acceleration factor where if the defender (or attacker) doesn't entosis any of their plexes, as the other party completes them the capture rate speeds up?


agreed.
yesterday we decided to just give up because it was too boring to wait for 43 minutes doing nothing.
i understand that the purpose is to cap military power of entities that have lots of it but this is just making me wanna close the client for the day :P
Lisselle Rotsuda
Alliance Navy N7 Program
Weaponised Anarchy
#144 - 2015-06-20 15:03:49 UTC
klana depp wrote:
BlitZ Kotare wrote:

- The plexes need some way to tell each other apart. Often they even spawn in very similar areas so giving them some kind of code to differentiate them from each other is really necessary.


ack - it was hard to tell apart newly spawned sites from existing ones, fleet was a mess even tho there was not a single hostile in system. yeah people will get used to it, but still, something like a scan signature that shows up in the name - maybe in front of the system name? - would be great.

BlitZ Kotare wrote:

- Taking sov that's completely uncontested shouldn't be this painful. I realize on TQ uncontested sov will most likely have lower indexes, but still. Maybe some kind of acceleration factor where if the defender (or attacker) doesn't entosis any of their plexes, as the other party completes them the capture rate speeds up?


agreed.
yesterday we decided to just give up because it was too boring to wait for 43 minutes doing nothing.
i understand that the purpose is to cap military power of entities that have lots of it but this is just making me wanna close the client for the day :P


you could always try it in sub caps Blink
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#145 - 2015-06-20 15:26:44 UTC
Here's the most up to date list of reinforcement exits in the competition zone:
Exit Time    Solar System    Structure    Owning Alliance    Defense Multiplier
Ongoing    YQB-22    Station    Suddenly Spaceships.    4.7
Ongoing    YQB-22    TCU    Suddenly Spaceships.    4.7
Ongoing    YQB-22    IHub    Suddenly Spaceships.    4.7
Ongoing    18XA-C    IHub    I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth    4.2
Ongoing    VKI-T7    IHub    Suddenly Spaceships.    5.5
Ongoing    VKI-T7    TCU    Suddenly Spaceships.    5.5
Ongoing    3D-CQU    TCU    I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth    4.7
Ongoing    3D-CQU    IHub    I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth    4.7
Ongoing    LF-2KP    TCU    Q Alliance    4.5
Ongoing    LF-2KP    Station    Q Alliance    4.5
Ongoing    K1I1-J    TCU    Q Alliance    5.2
Ongoing    LF-2KP    IHub    Q Alliance    4.5
Ongoing    K1I1-J    IHub    Q Alliance    5.2
Ongoing    K1I1-J    Station    Q Alliance    5.2
Ongoing    MH9C-S    Station    Eastasia Alliance    5.2
Ongoing    MH9C-S    IHub    Eastasia Alliance    5.2
Ongoing    MH9C-S    TCU    Eastasia Alliance    5.2
2015.06.20 15:34    G-AOTH    Station    Eurasia Alliance    3
2015.06.20 15:40    G-AOTH    TCU    Eurasia Alliance    3
2015.06.20 15:49    G-AOTH    IHub    Eurasia Alliance    3
2015.06.20 16:14    CBL-XP    IHub    Nemesis Enterprises.    2.5
2015.06.20 16:17    G7AQ-7    TCU    Eurasia Alliance    3.7
2015.06.20 16:19    D-GTMI    Station    Eurasia Alliance    2.4
2015.06.20 16:42    G7AQ-7    IHub    Eurasia Alliance    3.7
2015.06.20 16:45    CBL-XP    TCU    Nemesis Enterprises.    2.5
2015.06.20 16:46    D-GTMI    TCU    Eurasia Alliance    2.4
2015.06.20 17:01    UL-7I8    IHub    Praetorian Directorate    4.8
2015.06.20 17:17    D-GTMI    IHub    Eurasia Alliance    2.4
2015.06.20 17:20    FSW-3C    IHub    Eurasia Alliance    5.2
2015.06.20 18:08    ZQ-Z3Y    TCU    Eurasia Alliance    6
2015.06.20 18:11    GN7-XY    IHub    DARKNESS.    4.7
2015.06.20 18:12    GN7-XY    TCU    DARKNESS.    4.7
2015.06.20 18:16    PI5-39    Station    DARKNESS.    4.9
2015.06.20 18:21    5KG-PY    Station    DARKNESS.    3.9
2015.06.20 18:27    ZQ-Z3Y    IHub    Eurasia Alliance    6
2015.06.20 18:31    F-DTOO    IHub    DARKNESS.    6
2015.06.20 18:31    F-DTOO    Station    DARKNESS.    6
2015.06.20 18:31    F-DTOO    TCU    DARKNESS.    6
2015.06.20 18:42    PI5-39    IHub    DARKNESS.    4.9
2015.06.20 18:43    GN7-XY    Station    DARKNESS.    4.7
2015.06.20 18:43    ZQ-Z3Y    Station    Eurasia Alliance    6
2015.06.20 18:45    PI5-39    TCU    DARKNESS.    4.9
2015.06.20 18:58    INQ-WR    TCU    DARKNESS.    5.8
2015.06.20 18:59    QO-SRI    TCU    DARKNESS.    4.3
2015.06.20 19:22    INQ-WR    IHub    DARKNESS.    5.8
2015.06.20 19:25    5KG-PY    TCU    DARKNESS.    3.9
2015.06.20 19:35    5KG-PY    IHub    DARKNESS.    3.9
2015.06.20 19:41    QO-SRI    IHub    DARKNESS.    4.3
2015.06.20 20:36    H6-CX8    IHub    Fidelas Constans    6
2015.06.20 22:19    FSW-3C    TCU    Eurasia Alliance    5.2
2015.06.21 00:16    9-F0B2    Station    Brave Collective    3.6
2015.06.21 00:24    49GC-R    Station    Brave Collective    3.2
2015.06.21 01:08    I7S-1S    TCU    Oceania Alliance    4.1
2015.06.21 02:52    KA6D-K    Station Freeport    Freeport    1
2015.06.21 03:08    9UY4-H    Station    Brave Collective    6
2015.06.21 03:20    3GXF-U    IHub    Suddenly Spaceships.    4.5
2015.06.21 03:34    J6QB-P    TCU    Oceania Alliance    2.2
2015.06.21 03:36    I7S-1S    IHub    Oceania Alliance    4.1
2015.06.21 04:34    3D-CQU    Station Freeport    Freeport    1
2015.06.21 04:43    I7S-1S    Station    Oceania Alliance    4.1
2015.06.21 04:44    J6QB-P    IHub    Oceania Alliance    2.2
2015.06.21 05:00    J6QB-P    Station    Oceania Alliance    2.2
2015.06.21 05:20    T-RPFU    Station Freeport    Freeport    1
2015.06.21 08:18    OXIY-V    Station    No Not Believing    5.2
2015.06.21 10:12    2V-CS5    IHub    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    5.3
2015.06.21 10:13    2V-CS5    Station    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    5.3
2015.06.21 10:14    2V-CS5    TCU    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    5.3
2015.06.21 10:31    TXJ-II    IHub    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    6
2015.06.21 10:33    H9-J8N    IHub    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    6
2015.06.21 10:33    H9-J8N    Station    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    6
2015.06.21 10:34    GA9P-0    Station    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    6
2015.06.21 10:34    TXJ-II    Station    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    6
2015.06.21 10:35    TXJ-II    TCU    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    6
2015.06.21 10:38    GA9P-0    TCU    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    6
2015.06.21 10:45    GA9P-0    IHub    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    6
2015.06.21 11:07    H9-J8N    TCU    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    6
2015.06.21 11:22    3GXF-U    TCU    Suddenly Spaceships.    4.5
2015.06.21 11:35    C1-HAB    IHub    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    5.7
2015.06.21 11:37    C1-HAB    TCU    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    5.7
2015.06.21 11:50    C1-HAB    Station    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork    5.7
2015.06.21 12:33    HP-6Z6    Station Freeport    Freeport    1
2015.06.21 13:33    7YWV-S    Station Freeport    Freeport    1
2015.06.21 14:01    MVCJ-E    TCU    Q Alliance    5.3

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#146 - 2015-06-20 15:38:36 UTC
As for the discussion around the capture speed of nodes this really comes down to the challenge of balancing between the desires and goals of attackers and defenders. We're definitely listening and this system has been built from the beginning to be easily adjustable.
However we're not going to jump into any changes from one day of Duality testing, especially considering that the balance of this test is significantly different than any expected TQ situation (smaller groups hitting largely undefended systems with unusually high multipliers). As the test period goes on we will be interested to see how the lower defensive multipliers (thanks to normal decay and system changing hands losing their Strategic index) will impact the flow as well as what happens when the active groups start running out of undefended territory and begin bumping heads with each other more.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
kiu Nakamura
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#147 - 2015-06-20 15:57:22 UTC  |  Edited by: kiu Nakamura
klana depp wrote:
yesterday we decided to just give up because it was too boring to wait for 43 minutes doing nothing.


If you don't want to invest 43m to conquer space on your behalf, you dont want that space in the first place. SCNR.
Gabriel Karade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#148 - 2015-06-20 16:00:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Gabriel Karade
Edit: sorted - "dude, re-read the manual..." Smile

War Machine: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=386293
Dreamer Targaryen
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#149 - 2015-06-20 18:12:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Dreamer Targaryen
I would appreciate having a timer of the cooldown-cycle at the end, to know when I am finally free to warp off again. Regarding the 45min-1h entosis-periode, I disagree with shortening it. Taking the living-space from people, should take you at least an hour.

Edit:
Additionally it would be great to have the name of the alliance displayed in the tooltip of the logos in "Solar System: Information" -> "Sovereignty" -> "Structure Sovereignty Status" to determine who owns those structues, if the alliance-logo is the default one.
Gabriel Karade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#150 - 2015-06-20 19:59:31 UTC
Just for info; when you pop the nodes associated with the IHub, it (the IHub) just disappears - no big badda boom :/

War Machine: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=386293
Gabriel Karade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#151 - 2015-06-20 20:45:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Gabriel Karade
Q: I drop an Ihub, it appears as 'Concord' = I have to Entosis my own Ihub?? Sad

So, we got rid of a [J4LP] Ihub, dropped our own in place, then had a massive scrap with [Brave], but .. should it not have dropped as ours off the bat?

We pinned their Jump freighter to prevent them dropping their own Ihub, but the 'Concord' thing kinda screwed us in the end....

(they said same happened to them the other day)

War Machine: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=386293
kiu Nakamura
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#152 - 2015-06-20 21:13:26 UTC
Gabriel Karade wrote:
Q: I drop an Ihub, it appears as 'Concord' = I have to Entosis my own Ihub?? Sad


In the current system you need to anchor and then online stuff. In the new system you throw it in space and entosis it. Not that different?
Gabriel Karade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#153 - 2015-06-20 21:16:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Gabriel Karade
kiu Nakamura wrote:
Gabriel Karade wrote:
Q: I drop an Ihub, it appears as 'Concord' = I have to Entosis my own Ihub?? Sad


In the current system you need to anchor and then online stuff. In the new system you throw it in space and entosis it. Not that different?

I guess so, just was unexpected at the time.

Edit: Terrible grid-fu at the time too; was sat on the Ihub and couldn't lock it, nor see what was happening, we only figured out too late.

Ah well, if this is the design intent - noted (but there should probably be something in the description about having to Entosis it)

War Machine: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=386293
SilentAsTheGrave
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#154 - 2015-06-21 07:44:13 UTC
CCP Fozzie, for the love of all that is holy; please remove the alliance tournament ships from the market. They are extremely over powered, as they should be, but to have them for free and unlimited is just silly. I have spent a good amount of time trying to help test this new sov system, but this **** is out of control. It breaks all reality of what would be on TQ and completely ***** up everything everywhere. It is challenging enough to deal with Pandemic Legion having all their super carriers and titans in this tiny test pocket, but to be constantly facing AT ships rolling with high grade pirate implants and links... Ugh

Leaving these on the market was a colossal mistake.
Tappits
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#155 - 2015-06-21 10:24:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Tappits
SilentAsTheGrave wrote:
CCP Fozzie, for the love of all that is holy; please remove the alliance tournament ships from the market. They are extremely over powered, as they should be, but to have them for free and unlimited is just silly. I have spent a good amount of time trying to help test this new sov system, but this **** is out of control. It breaks all reality of what would be on TQ and completely ***** up everything everywhere. It is challenging enough to deal with Pandemic Legion having all their super carriers and titans in this tiny test pocket, but to be constantly facing AT ships rolling with high grade pirate implants and links... Ugh

Leaving these on the market was a colossal mistake.


Its no more imbalanced than 100isk Carriers and Dreads.
Its in fact not imbalanced at all as every one has access to them.

Maybe you would like then to unseed the systems and just copy over assets from TQ to make it fare?
We will still have access to AT ships dreads slowcats and supers and you can run eagles for everything?

I also think when we we blocked you in your station last night we used Full TQ roaming setups that we use all the time and not 50 AT ships so i have no idea what your on about.
Ruune en Gravonere
Running with Dogs
Northern Coalition.
#156 - 2015-06-21 12:13:37 UTC
Could mail notifications of sov attacks go out across the whole alliance? Most sov is held by holding corps with a few alts in so... or will it show on everyones sov dashboard?

It would be really great to see 'real' data instead of fake data to try to get a feel for what that will be giving us
Agustus palpius
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#157 - 2015-06-21 12:20:56 UTC
It'd be really nice to have the beacons be uniquely identifiable by a number of sig tag like when probing. Currently differentiating each individual node is fairly difficult.

Another nice thing would be more access to the soverignty tab built into the game. The ability to right-click a node and see the sovereignty of the given system (what's contested / what the modifier is) would be nice.
Don Pera Saissore
#158 - 2015-06-21 12:25:06 UTC
The at ships outperform all other ships of the same class. If you want to use a ceptor there is no reason why you shouldnt use the whiptal, same for logi just use the etana.

I was roaming around yesterday and it seems that most of the groups gave up. PL has consumed their neigbours, brave is brave and they are being kicked around by everyone (small advice, dreds cost 100 isk just keep undocking them if someone comes knocking on your station). It looks like pl brave and spectre are the most active groups there.
Warmeister
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#159 - 2015-06-21 12:52:20 UTC
Our neighbors didn't even bother to login (apart from Affirmative.)
Ruune en Gravonere
Running with Dogs
Northern Coalition.
#160 - 2015-06-21 12:58:03 UTC
without wanting to draw attention to ourselves we've been active since the start but we are one of the smaller alliances...