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Level 4 Ship Progression...
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Fen Haroun
Dramani Confederacy
#1 - 2011-12-24 23:28:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Fen Haroun
So I've found myself a little bit lost on EVE at the moment, as I just don't know what I should be going for now.

Currently all I'm really aiming for is efficient level 4 mission running, 'cause I have to play via PLEX atm and I kinda enjoy the mission, so it seems like a sensible way to get the ISK... but I'm not too great at this whole 'dedicated ISK making' business so the bankroll isn't exactly extravagant =P

So at the moment I fly a Maelstrom, I'm starting to work on getting T2 guns for it and I'm wondering where to go next on the road to efficient mission running... a friend of mine a while ago made me set my mind to the Machariel, then I came across the Vargur and today I got told a Tengu is the most efficient level 4 runner... so quite simply I don't know which of these to pick.

So, oh knowledgeable ones, what would you suggest and why? ^^

Edit: I'm open to yet more ideas, but it'll likely only confuse me further... so be nice :P
Kahldor
Doomheim
#2 - 2011-12-24 23:45:00 UTC
Well since you almost have T2 guns I would suggest staying on track and get a Mach. Once you get that you can keep running L4s or switch to Incursions and easily make 50-100 mil/hr. People claim 100+mil/hr in incursion but I have found it's pretty uncommon to get a decent/consistent fleet to get that figure most of the time I get 70-80mil/hr.

After that you can look at cross training for a tengu/amarr. The tengu is the most versatile mission runner in that it has selectable damage types and can tank any mission pretty easily. Amarr is good all around as long as you mission in Amarr space. But the choice is up to you. If you stick around long enough you will eventually train every faction.
Fen Haroun
Dramani Confederacy
#3 - 2011-12-24 23:47:37 UTC
Lol funnily enough the T2 guns are still quite some way off, far enough for it to not really be an issue if I change my mind now Ugh
Izziee
University of Izziee
#4 - 2011-12-24 23:57:35 UTC
Fen Haroun wrote:
Lol funnily enough the T2 guns are still quite some way off, far enough for it to not really be an issue if I change my mind now Ugh


Stick with it, I was utterly shocked at the difference in damage, it's crazy.
Fen Haroun
Dramani Confederacy
#5 - 2011-12-24 23:59:17 UTC
Izziee wrote:
Fen Haroun wrote:
Lol funnily enough the T2 guns are still quite some way off, far enough for it to not really be an issue if I change my mind now Ugh


Stick with it, I was utterly shocked at the difference in damage, it's crazy.

This is one of the problems XD if I were to go the road of a Tengu or something it'd be a complete waste of time to get T2 guns =P
Lauren Hellfury
Super Happy Awesome Fun Times
#6 - 2011-12-25 00:04:41 UTC
I'd also suggest sticking to the Mach. It's a fantastic ship and similar to the Mael.

However, since you are subbing via PLEX it's quite a big purchase to make so I would suggest finding a decent fit for it and then working on pimping your Maelstrom with the modules that you'll be using on the Mach. Work on boosting your speed to mitigate damage so that you can reduce your tank in favour of more gank.

I'll guess that you are using a damage control in there and that would be the first item to go in favour of 3x gyro's and 2x tracking enhancers. With an AB in the mids work on getting 1 or 2 tracking computers in there or even an omni-directional tracking link for your drones.


When you are happy with the speed you are running missions and ISK is coming in nicely then look to train up Gallente BS to lvl 4 and hop across to the Mach. If you start hoarding isk when you begin the Gallente ship training you'll likely have enough for the Mach hull when it's done and you can simply port most of the fittings straight across.

At this point feel free to go a little heavier on the tank, maybe put the damage control back on since you will gain a couple of lows and lose a mid. But, again, as you learn the Mach you'll be able to strip that off and go 4/3 gyro's/TEs

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Mallet Sceptera
Doomheim
#7 - 2011-12-25 00:27:10 UTC
The mach is the most efficient L4 mission runner, but the tengu is better at just about everything else besides incursions. I prefer to fly logi, legion, nightmare, or vindicators for incursions (ymmv, check your local FC for details).

It would appear that you're much closer to the mach than anything else though, so stay the course and try to fight the urge to spread your sp around.
Captain Nares
O3 Corporation
#8 - 2011-12-25 00:28:16 UTC
Fen Haroun wrote:
So I've found myself a little bit lost on EVE at the moment, as I just don't know what I should be going for now.

Currently all I'm really aiming for is efficient level 4 mission running, 'cause I have to play via PLEX atm and I kinda enjoy the mission, so it seems like a sensible way to get the ISK... but I'm not too great at this whole 'dedicated ISK making' business so the bankroll isn't exactly extravagant =P

So at the moment I fly a Maelstrom, I'm starting to work on getting T2 guns for it and I'm wondering where to go next on the road to efficient mission running... a friend of mine a while ago made me set my mind to the Machariel, then I came across the Vargur and today I got told a Tengu is the most efficient level 4 runner... so quite simply I don't know which of these to pick.

So, oh knowledgeable ones, what would you suggest and why? ^^

Edit: I'm open to yet more ideas, but it'll likely only confuse me further... so be nice :P


If you are turret guy, there is no sence in training Tengu.

Both Mach and Vargur are excellent L4 ships. Mach has a bit more gank and speed. Vargur has better tracking and tank. I'd recommend to choose one which looks prettier to you.
Flakey Foont
#9 - 2011-12-25 00:44:36 UTC
For paying the bills, nothing beats a Mach for me...
stoicfaux
#10 - 2011-12-25 02:34:44 UTC
If you're blitzing in high-sec, then Mach is "best". However, the Vargur is also a really good choice, especially with salvage prices going up (for a strange and mysterious reason (i.e. major tweak to T2 salvage.))

If you're not blitzing, or if you're blitzing and only getting ~1,000 isk/lp, then Mach and Vargur are tentatively equal in income generation. (I'm still gathering data.)

If you can mission in high-sec with a Mach/Vargur with T2 guns then a Tengu is mostly crap and not worth cross training into. (Tengu is great at other things.)

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Verity Sovereign
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2011-12-25 03:07:51 UTC
Kahldor wrote:
Well since you almost have T2 guns I would suggest staying on track and get a Mach. Once you get that you can keep running L4s or switch to Incursions and easily make 50-100 mil/hr. People claim 100+mil/hr in incursion but I have found it's pretty uncommon to get a decent/consistent fleet to get that figure most of the time I get 70-80mil/hr.

After that you can look at cross training for a tengu/amarr. The tengu is the most versatile mission runner in that it has selectable damage types and can tank any mission pretty easily. Amarr is good all around as long as you mission in Amarr space. But the choice is up to you. If you stick around long enough you will eventually train every faction.


I'd say stay on track with the mach or the vagur. Incursion fleets really care about gun skills. Its pretty much unanimous that they'll take a T2 fit non shiny hull over a faction/meta 4 fit shiny hull.

I agree that 70-80 mill is more common for incursions. But it depends on the group you fly with.
There are fleets that do make well over 100 mill/hour, if you make the right connections/get in the right groups, that can become consistent.

Now I mission when don't have the time to get in a fleet, or am too lazy to make the jumps to the nearest incursion.

Playing to pay to play is real easy with incursions.

When I get in with good fleets, in less than a day, I earn a plex. Or just a few times a month, you can run incursions for a short while and make maybe 80 mill each time.

Just watch out when you start to buy bling with all the excess ISK.... I just got ganked leaving jita with sets of faction heat sinks and faction tachyons (for mission running- low cap use, none of the T2 crystals are really needed)
hippity hopity
Leftfield Synergy
#12 - 2011-12-25 17:22:51 UTC
Fen Haroun wrote:
Currently all I'm really aiming for is efficient level 4 mission running, 'cause I have to play via PLEX atm and I kinda enjoy the mission, so it seems like a sensible way to get the ISK...


For the love of all that is holy stop playing eve and get a job... missioning for plex is like sewing shoes together for nike its just wrong
Kasutra
No Vacancies
No Vacancies.
#13 - 2011-12-25 18:06:13 UTC
hippity hopity wrote:
Fen Haroun wrote:
Currently all I'm really aiming for is efficient level 4 mission running, 'cause I have to play via PLEX atm and I kinda enjoy the mission, so it seems like a sensible way to get the ISK...


For the love of all that is holy stop playing eve and get a job... missioning for plex is like sewing shoes together for nike its just wrong

Unless you like running missions.
Fen Haroun
Dramani Confederacy
#14 - 2011-12-25 23:02:20 UTC
hippity hopity wrote:
Fen Haroun wrote:
Currently all I'm really aiming for is efficient level 4 mission running, 'cause I have to play via PLEX atm and I kinda enjoy the mission, so it seems like a sensible way to get the ISK...


For the love of all that is holy stop playing eve and get a job... missioning for plex is like sewing shoes together for nike its just wrong

I was wondering if anyone would be pig-headed enough to make the assumption that I don't have a job... well done, you're the first >_> not only that, you seem to be assuming all I do all day is play EVE, which is also far from the case. Wonderful. Out of curiosity, just what are you basing this on?

For starters - if I really wanted to I could pay to play EVE. I don't really want to, and I have things I would be much better off spending my hard earned cash on. I do have a job, and if you're going to assume I'm some unemployed impoverished charity case... well I am sure you know where you can put that assumption.

Secondly - as Kasutra stated, maybe I like running missions. As a matter of fact I do, for a number of reasons, or I simply wouldn't be doing it.

To everyone who isn't making baseless and rather stupid assumptions - thank you for the tips and suggestions, it is most appreciated ;) it's gone a fair way to helping me choose the path I want to take in EVE.
Leshiye
Shadow Haven
#15 - 2011-12-26 07:11:26 UTC

Say what you like, I run Level 4's in a Night Hawk or a Sleipnir. Sure, the Mach is shiny and packs a massive wallop, and the Vargur is a holy terror and can salvage like a flea market princess.

I fit a command ship out for level 4's solidly for around half a bill.... that's if I'm just buying stuff wherever I'm at and not shopping all over multiple regions for the best prices. A good nasty tank that I am never worried about anything coming anywhere near being a threat to my tank. The DPS on a NHawk and Sleipnir are not the best, but then the ships you are laying waste to aren't exactly wild killing machines either. Right tool for the job... a command ship rolls 4's all day long with a quickness.

Spend 800 mill on just a hull, sure.... go right ahead. Or spend a third of that and salvage with a Noctis.... you know, the ship that made Marauders tractor beam bonus kinda pointless. Stay small and fast.... Light and lethal, frugal and rich.

Fly Safe,

Lesh
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#16 - 2011-12-27 13:14:47 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
If you're blitzing in high-sec, then Mach is "best". However, the Vargur is also a really good choice, especially with salvage prices going up (for a strange and mysterious reason (i.e. major tweak to T2 salvage.))

If you're not blitzing, or if you're blitzing and only getting ~1,000 isk/lp, then Mach and Vargur are tentatively equal in income generation. (I'm still gathering data.)

If you can mission in high-sec with a Mach/Vargur with T2 guns then a Tengu is mostly crap and not worth cross training into. (Tengu is great at other things.)




Hullo there, can you explain the T2 salvage tweak please?

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Tenga Halaris
Galactic Traders Union
#17 - 2011-12-29 14:21:30 UTC
Go for a Tengu and then save some ISK for a Mach.

Since the skillrequirements for the Tengu are pretty low, compared to a BS or even worse Pirate BS, you will make 40-80 mil per hour doing level 4s in a Tengu, which costs around 800 mil and only needs medium weapons trained.

You won't find another PvE ship with more bang for your SP invested.


A T3 cruiser is a nice ship for all kinds of things, so the SP aren't wasted at all.
IGNATIUS HOOD
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2011-12-29 19:54:00 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
If you're blitzing in high-sec, then Mach is "best". However, the Vargur is also a really good choice, especially with salvage prices going up (for a strange and mysterious reason (i.e. major tweak to T2 salvage.))

If you're not blitzing, or if you're blitzing and only getting ~1,000 isk/lp, then Mach and Vargur are tentatively equal in income generation. (I'm still gathering data.)

If you can mission in high-sec with a Mach/Vargur with T2 guns then a Tengu is mostly crap and not worth cross training into. (Tengu is great at other things.)



If you want to solo, and you want to salvage, then the Paladin is the obv. choice IMO. The Mach has more utility in other roles though and it sounds like your lazor skills are lacking and it takes awhile to t2 up lazors.

my .02 cents though
"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats."   --H.L. Mencken
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#19 - 2011-12-29 21:23:35 UTC
Bumblefck wrote:
Hullo there, can you explain the T2 salvage tweak please?


Drop rates changed. See here for example.