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teorycrafting: rigor rig I vs flare rig II
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Alexander Wellspring
Corporation of Independent Merchants
#1 - 2011-12-07 16:19:09 UTC
assuming you use fury heavy missiles on a tengu without painter or webber, the tengu has 2 rigor rig II and 100 spare point of calibration
For hit elite frigates and cruiser is better add rigor rig I or flare rig II?
stat wise at lvl 5 related skill and 3% implant:

2 rigor rig II + 1 rigor rig I
- explosion velocity 149.9
- explosion radius 85.1

2 rigor rig II + 1 flare rig II
- explosion velocity 179.9
- explosion radius 100.1

math in hands, better 30 more speed or 15 less radius?
Nalha Saldana
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2011-12-07 17:15:55 UTC
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Av6bUJhtOy5qdEEtNW9HVDAxdDI0NC1DTjRWanhWcmc
Write in the stats with 2 rigor and boom, you get the answer =)
Tenga Halaris
Galactic Traders Union
#3 - 2011-12-07 18:43:40 UTC
1) Rip those rigs off it
2) Install a Bayloading II and 2x Flare I
3) More DPS
4) Profit
SexTrader
LOst BrotherhoOd
#4 - 2011-12-07 20:17:23 UTC
Tenga Halaris wrote:
1) Rip those rigs off it
2) Install a Bayloading II and 2x Flare I
3) More DPS
4) Profit



Except you prolly wouldn't hit anything smaller than a BS for full damage.
Misanthra
Alternative Enterprises
#5 - 2011-12-07 22:50:09 UTC
can get the best of both worlds

rigor 2
flare 2

leavee enough calibration for ccc 2. Cap stable overrated but can be a nice to have in case of dc...or if you have little ones in the house. Came upon this setup after I lost the 1st tengu to a lv 4 because of baby aggro lol. No kids and a rock steady connection...you can go max damage effect probably


works frigs decent for me. Want it working better, hardwires. Radius, target velcotiy, rof. I also run the damage one. Benefit of putting your frig killing in via implants is they carry over to other ships. these implants work nice in a pve bomber I run tandem with a meatshiled rattller on an alt from time to time. the HML 5% damage obviously doesn't work in the manticore....can't have it all lol.

Just be wary of stacking tech II and tech I rigs same effect. As I recall stacking penalty works top down. the tech II' will enter the equation sooner and get hit less. that tech I is bottom of the stack and get hits hard for stacking to damn near make them useless.. Unless that has changed. stackin always a fun debate though...pick your sandobx here. I for example also don't like the stacking of 4 bcu's and run 3. Just me, others like that 4th one. Whatever floats your boat I always say.
stoicfaux
#6 - 2011-12-08 01:34:59 UTC
Punch in your numbers in this spreadsheet and see how many volleys it will take to kill various NPCs.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#7 - 2011-12-08 15:26:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Tanya Powers
SexTrader wrote:
Tenga Halaris wrote:
1) Rip those rigs off it
2) Install a Bayloading II and 2x Flare I
3) More DPS
4) Profit



Except you prolly wouldn't hit anything smaller than a BS for full damage.



False.

Faction HM radius explosion with maxed skills is about 120M: AHACS are slightly under this and those are cruiser sized.

Only problem he will have is to kill fast frigates in some sites, in pvp he will not kill a single frigate, that simple.

Edit: For pve I use one Tengu setup with 2 T2 riggors 1 T2 flare and let me tell you that the fastest and smallest frig you can find in any sort of mission/site I blow it with T2 missiles faster than you can spell it.
Alsyth
#8 - 2011-12-08 16:57:51 UTC
Unless you frequently stumble upon targets with a small sig (< missile expl radius) but a really slow speed (< missile expl velocity), consider rigor = flare.
Tenga Halaris
Galactic Traders Union
#9 - 2011-12-29 15:51:00 UTC
You can use Pecision or Faction Ammo to kill Elite frigs and/or Spider Drones. The HM have a weaponsig of 125m. It's not a Cruise Missile or a Torp.

I prefer the 850 DPS (imps necesarry) a Tengu puts out, if you use a bayloading II rig.

For all those who don't believe it's better, go enter the testserver and TRY IT!
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#10 - 2011-12-29 16:23:53 UTC
Alexander Wellspring wrote:
assuming you use fury heavy missiles on a tengu without painter or webber, the tengu has 2 rigor rig II and 100 spare point of calibration
For hit elite frigates and cruiser is better add rigor rig I or flare rig II?
stat wise at lvl 5 related skill and 3% implant:

2 rigor rig II + 1 rigor rig I
- explosion velocity 149.9
- explosion radius 85.1

2 rigor rig II + 1 flare rig II
- explosion velocity 179.9
- explosion radius 100.1

math in hands, better 30 more speed or 15 less radius?


More speed =+dps applied on smaller targets moving fast
Less radius =+dps on smaller targets

In both cases you win dps, now to answer your question witch is the best I'd say you have to try it by yourself and see witch is the one who sticks better to your game play.

I'm using the 2xT2 rigors 1XT2 flare for 60m rad explo 145m/s speed explo with CN HM, 104m rad explo and 171m/s speed explo for T2 HM.
IG fitting window with CN Scourge I have 633DPS, with Scourge Fury 711 with 3.8s ROF.
This setup sticks quite well for me, not sure it sticks for everyone. It's just an opinion and experience I share with you.
Liam Mirren
#11 - 2011-12-29 16:27:44 UTC
2x rigor II
1x Flare II

That's the ideal combo and allows you to use Fury ammo on the majority of targets.

Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#12 - 2011-12-29 16:27:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Tanya Powers
Tenga Halaris wrote:
You can use Pecision or Faction Ammo to kill Elite frigs and/or Spider Drones. The HM have a weaponsig of 125m. It's not a Cruise Missile or a Torp.

I prefer the 850 DPS (imps necesarry) a Tengu puts out, if you use a bayloading II rig.

For all those who don't believe it's better, go enter the testserver and TRY IT!


Actually I've tried this one too but I like it less, yes I have better dps on bigger ships and yes I can use T1 ammo on smaller targets (explo radius t1 is about 40m with bay load setup) but actually I'm stick with mine because I like it overall.
Just a matter of personal game play.
Goose99
#13 - 2011-12-29 16:28:42 UTC
3x rigors. Rats move slowly. For pvp, fly a gunboat. Tengu has no dronebay. You'll be shooting slow but small frig rats with missiles.
Tenga Halaris
Galactic Traders Union
#14 - 2011-12-29 16:48:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Tenga Halaris
Some german dude tested all kinds of rigs for weeks, in different missions and came to the conclusion and proved it by numbers that: more dps > weaponsig.

since you'll need at least two volleys to kill an elite frig... DPS will shine


...and we all know, that we can trust the germans, right? :)
Kulmid
ANZAC ALLIANCE
Goonswarm Federation
#15 - 2011-12-29 17:21:25 UTC
Tenga Halaris wrote:
1) Rip those rigs off it
2) Install a Bayloading II and 2x Flare I
3) More DPS
4) Profit


Don't listen to eft warriors like this. T2 ROF rigs are fine stacking on turret ships, but are much less useful on launchers due to wasted shots/lg unless your a missle counting god and have 0 lag. 2x t2 rigors will be a much better dps increase, especially on frigs. ROF isnt that great when you have to shoot 2-3 extra volleys to kill that elite frig.
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#16 - 2011-12-29 17:26:01 UTC
Tenga Halaris wrote:
...and we all know, that we can trust the germans, right? :)


Indeed, you'll hardly find people man of their word in this game and mostly, humble ones. Most Germans I met if not all have those qualities, that's why I like them so much.

Back on topic, has I said that was my favourite setup for my game play but I'll never pretend it's the best. Yours seem very yummy too.
Goose99
#17 - 2011-12-29 17:28:38 UTC
Tenga Halaris wrote:
Some german dude tested all kinds of rigs for weeks, in different missions and came to the conclusion and proved it by numbers that: more dps > weaponsig.

since you'll need at least two volleys to kill an elite frig... DPS will shine


...and we all know, that we can trust the germans, right? :)


Actually, 3x rigor cn missile fit kills non-Angel 30k bounty frig rat in one volley, compared to 8 volleys. And t2 rop rig on top of 4 faction bcs adds 17 dps.Lol
Tenga Halaris
Galactic Traders Union
#18 - 2011-12-29 17:39:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Tenga Halaris
17 DPS, 8 Volleys? That's crazy talk.

50 dps more and maybe +1 Volley for Elite Frigs.
Kietay Ayari
Caldari State
#19 - 2011-12-30 01:25:18 UTC
I just realized you can do more DPS AND have a much smaller explosion with Caldari Navy heavy launchers and Caldari Navy Ammo with one loading bay accelerator than you can with T2 launchers and rigor rigs to decrease the explosion radius. New Improved fit here I come.

Ferox #1
stoicfaux
#20 - 2011-12-30 06:15:07 UTC
Responses to various posters:

Lag only matters when switching targets. Once you're plinking away at a ship, the server deals with cycle times.

A T2 ROF rig adds 6% to raw DPS on top of 4xCN BCUs.

Elite frigates aren't very common in Angel space, and they represent a small percentage of NPC hit points you have to chew through, so there's not much reason to optimize how well you hit small targets.

Angel Viper - elite angel frigate at orbit velocity of 450m/s with a sig size of 22.5. All skills at 5 with 5% implants, T2 launchers:

* 2xFlare + RoF II w/Precision. Four salvos (3.67 volleys). 13.7 seconds TTK (time to kill)
* 1xRigor + RoF II w/Precision. Four salvos (3.93 volleys). 13.7 seconds TTK.
* mix of 3xRigor/Flare rigs: Four salvos with T1, precision or CN ammo. (Volleys varied from 3.25 to 3.88.) 14.6 seconds TTK.

* 2xRigor II, 1xRigor w/Fury. Six salvos (5.75 volleys.) 21.8 seconds.
* 2xRigor II, 1xFlare II w/Fury. Six salvos (5.65 volleys.) 21.8 seconds.

* 3xRigor I w/fury. Seven salvos (6.4 volleys.) 25.5 seconds.

* 2xFlare + RoF II w/Fury. Eight salvos (7.69 volleys.) 27.3 seconds.

* 1xRigor + RoF II w/Fury. Nine salvos (8.53 volleys.) 30.8 seconds.

The advantage to using three Rigor/Flare rigs is that you can use Fury ammo on elite frigates without having to waste 20 seconds switching ammo if there are one to three elite frigates to shoot.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
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