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daltonism problem with new icons, impossible to do PvP

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BrundleMeth
Black Parrot
Sylvanas Super mercenary
#61 - 2015-06-06 10:51:46 UTC
Dade Corban wrote:
New overview and icons are difficult and problematic. I hesitate at the login screen.

We told you in test server feedback this was ****.

Please revert.

They don't "really" want your feedback...
Don Pera Saissore
#62 - 2015-06-06 10:56:17 UTC
When they showed the preview at fanfest they said that npc ships will have a small cross in the upper right side of the icon because color blind people need to be able to quickly distinguish them form player ships. i have no idea why they didnt implement that.
xxxTRUSTxxx
Galactic Rangers
#63 - 2015-06-06 11:04:36 UTC
supported. +1 please fix ASAP!

this is a game breaker and needs a revert like yesterday!
Bernard Dupont
Les mitraillettes
#64 - 2015-06-06 11:11:58 UTC
+1 support

CCP should do something to help
Shmaury
The Brass Monkey Syndicate
Literally Triggered
#65 - 2015-06-06 11:20:40 UTC
I Also have red-green issues, wich is not such a huge problem in this game for distinction (u can change the corp member colours etc) but another consequence is that the red icons cause a sort of 'bleed' now wich is very irritating to look at and make it very difficult to get a proper overview of the different kind of npc icons because i notice that my eyes have a lot of trouble defining the shape of the icons due to that 'bleed' effect. As colourblind options are getting quite common in games i would love to get some respons on this issue.
McBorsk
Multispace Technologies Inc
#66 - 2015-06-06 11:35:18 UTC
Supported.

Fix the scaling issue as well, please.
SalubriousSky Rinah
Cryptic Spear
#67 - 2015-06-06 12:20:25 UTC
It's almost as though there is an internal memorandum at CCP, requiring employees to constantly develop 'new ideas' in order to maintain their employment at the company.

And unfortunately for the players, this is hurting the game significantly.

To give an example, and I can't quite remember which hull type appears this way, but CCP, you have given one of the hull classes the exact same shape as the previous old wreck icons (or something very similar)! So when I'm looking at my overview, my eye is trained to see a wreck and not a ship at the moment...it's quite surreal lol. And yes, of course, I'm sure you think 'players will get used to it', but why should we?

EVE was iconic in the space faring game culture for having the 'small, bigger and then biggest red cross' enemies to make the player stop and think twice before engaging the enemy. Now, all we see are different shapes that really convey no sense of what it is you are engaging!

I really hope you take a step back and realise that you've gone too far with this change, it is hurting gameplay significantly.

EVE is NOT Homeworld! Bring back the old icons please.

Sal
TigerXtrm
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#68 - 2015-06-06 12:22:17 UTC
I'm sorry but how are the new icons related to color blindness? Standings icons and overview backgrounds haven't changed and the icons themselves are white/grey.

You say you can't see the difference between blue and red, but that's not an issue the new icons introduced at all. I'm not sure what you're referring to.

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Scipio Artelius
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#69 - 2015-06-06 13:29:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
TigerXtrm wrote:
You say you can't see the difference between blue and red, but that's not an issue the new icons introduced at all. I'm not sure what you're referring to.

He's saying that the icons in space don't allow him to see the difference between players that are blue to him and players that are red to him (ie. He can't tell friend from foe in space) and in some cases can't see the icons in space at all.

See his post on page 3.
Hiply Rustic
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#70 - 2015-06-06 14:50:31 UTC
+1, supported, of course.

This is a no-brainer.

On secdond thought; I mean to say that a no-brainer has already occurred and this thread is a good place to call it out.

Ralph King-Griffin wrote: "Eve deliberately excludes the stupid and the weak willied." EvE: Only the strong-willied need apply.
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#71 - 2015-06-06 15:26:46 UTC

OP, kudos to you for bringing this up for your corpmates. They are fortunate to have a friend like you.

I agree that it's a good cause. But I think the first post should be edited to clearly state what the ask is, so that CCP folks don't have to dig through hundreds of posts to find it.

This is what I think the ask is from page 1 and page 3, and +1 from me for these:

  1. We know about Overview Settings -> Appearance > Use small colortags -> Uncheck. However, we need more colors to choose from for colortags that do not clash with specific color blindness limitations.
  2. The little icons on the bottom right of each overview ship icon is hard to see, especially if two colors seem to blend into each other due to colorblindness (ie: red and blue).
  3. The ship icons in space need an option for solid backgrounds, with these backgrounds being more vibrant colors when the non-transparent option is selected.


Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
Sbrodor
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#72 - 2015-06-06 17:46:10 UTC
tnx i edited 1st post with your words.
Z'rassa Taredi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#73 - 2015-06-06 18:12:36 UTC
I hope ccp listens to you, but wouldnt hold my breath. My ceo has visiion issues (hes an old fart) and has trouble reading the txt even when its set to large. He has to use a magnifying glass to read stuff a lot of the times...and hes been playing eve since the start. Ccp hasnt done much to address that problem for the visually impaired, and i can only imagine the hell hes going through with the new icons.


long story short, i support you in your crusade to make eve a more tolerant place, not only for the color blind but for all visually impaired.
Marcus Tedric
Zebra Corp
Goonswarm Federation
#74 - 2015-06-06 18:14:24 UTC
It's perhaps worth adding.....

Every company that operates in the UK (as CCP does - even the servers are here), especially and particularly when it comes to the Web - has to comply with the Disability Access Act.

Now, I am 'colour perception challenged' too.Smile

I may have little issue with the Overview changes; indeed as ex-Mil I rather like the new shapes. However, if they are causing problems by discrimination - then there may be a real problem here.......

Don't soil your panties, you guys made a good point, we'll look at the numbers again. - CCP Ytterbium
Blue Harrier
#75 - 2015-06-06 18:31:16 UTC
Sorry if I get on peoples nerves (I often harp on about the condition on the forums) but unless you are colour blind, I suffer from Deuteranopia which can be described as follows;

(the deuteranope suffers the same hue discrimination problems as the protanope, but without the abnormal dimming. The names red, orange, yellow, and green really mean very little to him aside from being different names that everyone else around him seems to be able to agree on)

It can be very difficult for a normal colour vision person to even begin to understand how it affects your daily life.

Daft as it may seem colour when used correctly can greatly enhance our enjoyment of a game, we need colour just as much as anyone but colour we can see, big bold blocks of colour not subtle shades, tiny lines and little dots, the big bold red cross immediately said to me ‘warning danger about’ the little red squiggles convey very little information.

This is one reason I play solo, not because I am anti social but because I can’t trust what I see is what you see and my mistake could be your blown up ship.

I support this thread one hundred percent.

"You wait - time passes, Thorin sits down and starts singing about gold." from The Hobbit on ZX Spectrum 1982.
Primarch Apocalypse
Adeptus Imperium
#76 - 2015-06-06 18:44:38 UTC
Verlyn wrote:


Dont think CCP cares, nor will care.



Actually in this case they are obliged to care. CCP has some sort of presence in the US , where all content is obliged to be accessible to people with a recognized disability , color blindness is a recognized disability. Now CCP is protected a bit by their draconian ToS (I have one almost as evil as this Twisted) but that will get thrown out the window by a judge faster that you can say "lawsuit". While such an action is unlikely it can still be very harmful to a fragile company like CCP - the last thing they would need is to be known as "the company that hates disabled people".

That aside the new icons are a good initiative with terrible results. The icons don't respect any design principles. They ignore familiarity , color theory , UX , UI and pretty much all the things a designer should know. The problem could be solved easily by the commuity. In 10 hours we could make a mod that allows us to use better icons , next day someone would make a better one. Then CCP could draw from the lessons & stories created by those mods and come up with a new revamped solution that would only server to increase player loyalty & consequently their income. However CCP bans AFAIK even such trivial modifications.
DscoutPSA
Doomheim
#77 - 2015-06-06 18:58:48 UTC
+1 support for non-dalton-reasons

I have resorted to removing the icons column altogether and shifting the 'Type' to column 1 where icons used to sit.

There was literally nothing wrong with the old system of icons.

CCP of late Remind me of management consultants brought in to a firm I was a director of 20 years ago, they just had to suggest wholly inappropriate and unnecessary changes to some things to justify their fees.

I can see players getting used to the icon system in the end but :reallyccp?:
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#78 - 2015-06-06 19:10:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Sibyyl
There are quite a few malcontents who don't like the new icons. I advise you guys don't dogpile on top of this issue. There is a separate thread for your feedback about that, and it's not necessary to rabble in here for that.

I think it's better to be laser focused on what the issue is that OP described.

Edit: Fixed a typo

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
Mike Azariah
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#79 - 2015-06-06 19:58:40 UTC
Colour blindness IS an issue that can and should be considered.

This is not hate for the icons just a simple request to consider or have alternatives for folks who need them.

Supported.

m

Mike Azariah  ┬──┬ ¯|(ツ)/¯
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
#80 - 2015-06-06 20:22:32 UTC  |  Edited by: RavenPaine
Classic example of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it"

My first thought was: WTF??!!??

Next thought was jokes about:
TeePees online, Cowboys and Indians
Oh Christmas tree, Oh Christmas tree
Etc.
Etc.

Final conclusion
RollRollRollRollRoll


These are NOT the kinds of response a typical business wants from its customers.