Assembly Hall

"If I drank alcohol one time, and it almost killed me, yes, my analogy still works. You can use a peanut allergy if you prefer. If something almost kills you the first time, you are a fool if you do it twice. "

Yet ]some people can drink some kinds of alcohol some of the time, and either enjoy themselves/ become addicted. The same is true of peanuts. Should I stop eating peanuts just because YOU are allergic to them? Should we all stop selling and drinking alcoholic beverages just because some people will die of an alcohol overdose?

You seem to be insisting that it was 'Walking in Stations' in and of itself which almost 'killed' the game.

I say that it was the promise of walking in stations and then thefailure to deliver that got people so angry. That, and the 'greed is good', gold ammunition and gold ships. It was, in short, a lack of vision on the part of CCP, and a kind of ambivalence about what their player base actually wanted.

There are two different sides to the argument, which even today is still a divisive issue.

There is also this quote to consider:

"What doesn't kill us makes us stronger." -Frederich Nietzsche.





I think you might have to be more specific here.

*Whoosh* is right. Abandons clarity is right. I have no idea what you are talking about.

What I said is this:

The other reasons you listed (hardware failure, lack of resources, etc.) were all credible and logical arguments, but saying stuff like this:

'This makes me extremely angry' and "It makes a LOT of other people angry too!' and 'Maybe we should start directing that anger at you!' make your argument a whole lot less credible.

I have paraphrased what you wrote here. Would you like me to cut and paste and show you what you actually said?

Or, perhaps we can both agree that saying 'This makes me MAD' is an ineffective strategy, and perhaps even a touch ironic.

How many angry impotent rage posts from miners and haulers have been directed against CODE members here on these forums for blowing up other people's ships? Were all those impotent tears of rage from miners effective at getting what they want, or simply amusing to read?

Pot, meet kettle.

So what if this makes you angry? How is that relevant to anything? Why should I care if all this anger (rhetorical forum anger, I am assuming) gets directed at me? I don't think any of the other people are getting angry discussing this topic.

Telling me that this topic makes you, and a lot of other people 'very angry' is pretty meaningless. It's like a big dog that barks from behind a big fence, or a child throwing a tantrum. An Idle threat. I have no control over what makes you angry and what doesn't. The person who makes that choice is you. However, I think it's a little silly to get so angry over opinions expressed on a blog about a 'spaceship game' on the internet, isn't it?

The only reason to get angry is because emotionally, you feel strongly about this, but you think that you don't have the logical arguments you need in order to espouse the viewpoints that you have. Either that, or the rational arguments won't be enough.

If you do have those logical arguments, and your first post indicates that you do, then you really have no reason to be angry or make (implied) threats.

'The end' as far as you are concerned, perhaps.

It's been four years since Incarna came out, was started, and then abandoned. Since that time, CCP Seagull has said that they got over their Incarna 'fear', and are willing to re-investigate such things as walking in stations. EVE blogs are still discussing WiS even today. After all, with everything else already explored and developed, 'walking in stations' really is the last and final frontier.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Ajnxq65D220

CCP Ned Coker says: “Incarna and avatar gameplay is definitely not shelved indefinitely, it’s just not being worked on actively in full production right now.”

http://www.vg247.com/2012/10/08/eve-online-incarna-content-definitely-not-shelved/



It's a shame that you can't discuss this topic in a more respectful, intelligent language. Instead, you have to rely on personal insults, unsubstantiated claims, and hyperbole to try and get your point across.

Words like 'Yammering', 'banal', 'armchair psychology', 'delusional' are all attempts to defeat my argument by attacking the credibility of the person making it instead of the argument itself. You are making these value judgements about me, yet you have not demonstrated why any of them might be true.



I think that Nietzsche quotes will be around a lot longer than your own quotes. "Only a fool drinks poison twice" is not particularly memorable.

Also, you are again resorting to that same logical fallacy of ATTACKING THE PERSON and not the argument itself.

'Look at Nietzsche the drug addict!'

http://www.logicallyfallacious.com/index.php/logical-fallacies/10-ad-hominem-abusive

Who cares if Nietzsche was a drug addict or not? Does that make his philosophy any less relevant? Does that mean you are smarter than him? Many of the people that have made world history have also been drug addicts and alcoholics.

Hedonist? So what? Does it bother you when other people have fun?

Jim Morrison/ Amadeus Mozart was a hedonist and a drug addict, does that make what he said, or the music he wrote any less relevant?

For the record, Nietzsche died of brain cancer, not syphilis. He died at a fairly old (middle) age, after his philosophies he wrote inflamed and then transformed the world.

The logic is still sound.

Premise: "Whatever does not kill me, can only make me stronger."

Conclusion: Brain cancer killed him, so brain cancer did NOT make him stronger.

If you still believe that it was syphilis that actually killed him, the argument still works.

Conclusion: Syphilis killed him. Therefore, syphilis did NOT make him stronger.

If Nietzsche had actually survived his brain cancer and/or his life-long syphilis ailment (which would explain why he might have been a drug addict), then certainly he would be able to say 'The experience has made me stronger', since 'strength' is a subjective term.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/3313279/Madness-of-Nietzsche-was-cancer-not-syphilis.html

What about the countless soldiers who joined the military and died in their early twenties, yet despite their sacrifice remain largely anonymous? Would you say they made the right decision? Is it always 'foolish' to join the Military knowing that others have been, could be and will be killed?

Also, if quoting Nietzsche wasn't my 'best' idea, what would you say my 'best idea' was?

CCP have already come to their conclusion, and repeatedly communicated it. Thinking otherwise at this stage is wilfull blindness.

god knows but i wish they would

Other people's kids.

Some people afforded an opportunity will ****post on anything they can to garner attention by trolling and making negative points against something, no matter how constructive or well thought out. The difference between a discussion and an argument is typically the person involved in the argument will always resort to slinging mud to try to make their "point."

With that said, the concept of WiS is still plausible, and despite those who consistently say "it won't happen," or "CCP failed here because of this, that or the third," or "who gives a **** about stations because EVE is a spaceship game" are the ones living in willful blindness. If ignorance is bliss, they are the happiest people on earth.

The simple fact is, we do not know what the future is for EVE because we do not know what is covered under NDA, and we do not know what goes on in closed forums at CCP. If they see a means of expanding the breadth and depth of this game to inclue WiS, they will. It is their prerogative. Simply put, most players who start and quit lately is due to the fact they saw awesome cinematics involving interactions in stations, and were disappointed that it wasn't there, thus EVE was not what they expected.

With that said, erring on the side of caution yet still showing some hopeful optimism can't really hurt.

You are sure they never will add something similar to WiS, then why are you bothered by this thread and fight it?

I still want a cage in my room for my Fedo! Does that bother you too? :)

Is it maybe because of this: If you fight you might lose, if you don't you have already lost. ?
People often say one thing but do another. Given the extreme reactions of some of the player I wouldn't also go public and say "Hey guys, do you know what! WiS 2.0! Let's celebrate!".
If you can make money with it, then people often very quickly changing their minds.


I like spaceships too. The Myrmidon is one of my favourites. Always reminds me of the Sharlin class warcruiser from B5. Fishy and impressive.

In my opinion it's not about changing the game to something different. It's about pushing the borders further away. Extending the sandbox further into the surrounding grass.

Why does the captain's quartier has to end at that door and not some doors further. Why can't I see the weekly issues of The Scope on my tv, or commercials for corporations? At alliance tournament they have some very good spots. Why can't I place my SoE Statue on my coffee table? Why can't I go into a casino and gamble my money? Why can't I pay that the statues on Amarr Stations look like me?

The more people can do with their ISK, the more they will spend, the more they will need, the faster they are back in space to make more.


There is a point where it gets difficult. It's not like "Mining Lasers should have twice the yield! Who's with me?!" I just have given some simple examples of functionality I miss. What I would do with them? Using them.

I would buy a Fedocage and place it in my much larger Royal-Captains-Suite. Here we could have different anchor points where I can place it. Then I would put my Fedo in it and would be happy because the storage isn't the right place for it.

After that I would start to feed it with corpses. It's very hungry after the months locked away. It makes a sound like the purr of a cat while eating them. It's very relaxing while I'm lying in my fluffy bed and check the market for new corpses.

Fedos do also like Tourists but don't give them Quafe! That makes them mad and they will riot through the whole night! As penalty cou can't log off during the next ten minutes, you animal torturer!

Who says that everything must have a meaning.

You may have missed my post. CCP has NOT said "We have no intention of implementing this (WiS) feature."

On the contrary, CCP Ned Coker has said: “Incarna and avatar gameplay is definitely not shelved indefinitely, it’s just not being worked on actively in full production right now.”

http://www.vg247.com/2012/10/08/eve-online-incarna-content-definitely-not-shelved/

Also, if they have no intentions of implementing Walking in stations, then why are they still working on it?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5l_ZjVyRxx4

I think if your character gets drunk enough in station that this should overcome the 'jump fatigue' effect and make it a debuff so your ship randomly jumps somewhere totally different than intended. Also, that modules toggle on and off randomly, and that your typing becomes totally intelligible. So when your character wakes up from a drunken stupor, you find yourself in high sec, in a belt, surrounded by exhumer / mining frigate wrecks, and Concord pulls you over in your supercapital you can be like "avve nooo IDEA watshh your talkshining abooot aye didnnt smaaartbum nebodie."

Yes you are absolutely right, I never intended to oppose you with that.

This game was and still is made to entertain people, in this broader sense there is for me no need to give every feature or item a meaning inside the game. Indeed it's better if they have meaning and are useful.


Who of us believe politicians who say they never will increase taxes? Who believes CCP who says or not, doesn't matter, they never will implement features of WiS?

It's business. If you can make money with it, who cares what someone else said before. You can always blame your predecessor, say he/she was an idiot and had no idea. Now I have the say and I say we do this! That's how it works.