Player Features and Ideas Discussion

When was the last time you saw an NPC selling a tengu?

Extending this idea . . . your market orders would only be active for a portion of the day, after all, market is a form of play as well.

no

people can pvp dor hours on end, it is just the transport that has fatigue and said transport fatigue hurts miners and haulers just as much as the pvpers so there is no need to add a fairness limit.

no, just no

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Another point here...this would actually punish those who perform diverse activities in the game. I log in at work, run PI, run exploration, manufacture all sorts of stuff, haul my stuff around, buy and sell etc etc.Basically everything other than PvP as I don't particularly like it. Under this proposal I would actually be punished for having more diverse activities than simply missioning as each that fell into the OP definition of punishable PvE would have a cumulative affect on my allowed time on each of them.

Then to top it all off if I get home at night and find I have some time free and choose to head into lo/null for some better exploration I get slapped for having pootled around in the day providing stuff to the market and buying/selling stuff from others thus promoting them being in space doing stuff too.

Someone please link the every known language 'no' set...

This should be added as a sticky at the top so that it can be easily linked :D

Nicely sums it up.

And no-one except a botter can not be in favour of this.

Please think it through: what you do as a real player (as opposed to as a bot or bot-like entity) and what you get from it (the minerals you mine, the modules you loot etc. etc.) also gets more valuable, and this is the crucial point: even more so than for the bots.

More players would stay because their time reaps them better rewards as it does now where they have to compete with bots or bot-likes.

Their income also goes down, while prices go up, causing a classical case of hyperinflationary spiral which leads to a dead economy.

Assets, i.e. things you can fly or fit, are potatoes.

If there are fewer potatoes being grown, they become more valuable. If less money is being generated, then those more valuable potatoes end up worth much more. To get a potato now costs more time investment, as there are fewer of them. If you have money stored up before it becomes harder to get, you can continue to treat potatoes as before, right until you can't afford to eat them, or there are no more potatoes at any price. Thus those with a fat stack can continue to engage anything that moves, but players without it must weigh the risk of their potato going away vs. the time it requires to obtain another potato.

How many bots do you think are in this game?
Why should "bot-likes" be penalized?
How does limiting what can be done by everyone as seperate timers not hurt newbies disproportionately, as they do not have anything like the SP to effectively do all the things that would need to be separated for it to make sense for PVE only fatigue?
How does a single fatigue timer for PVE not disproportionately hurt newbies, as they don't have the isk or SP for the pimpest boats to make the most isk/hr before their fatigue sets in, thus soft-capping them to a much lower income even with more effort?
Conversely, how does this limit improve the game for anyone?
How do we prevent an economic collapse due to stagflation?

Please re-read that.

Except most players don't grow potatoes in isolation. They receive cash for services, and miners, most of whom are either super-casual or fanatically hardcore, mine minerals. Other players then take those minerals and craft potatoes. They then put up potatoes at the best price they can get, or what they figure is reasonable considering their costs for minerals and their effort.

Casuals mine occasionally, usually when bored, and probably without actually doing the math or work of getting boosts and hauling set up to maximize efficiency. They do not lose income based on fatigue, and if they grow potatoes, they grow few or small potatoes, or buy the minerals to feed into their potatoes.

Fanatical miners provide a large chunk of the minerals, often while semi-AFK. While I do not have stats, would be surprised if it is less than 40% from these hardcores, who you describe as "bot-like" or acuse of actual botting, who usually have multiple accounts set up to run boosts, hauling and mining. They are more likely capable of growing whole potatoes by themselves, and some do, making the market less of a factor in their costs. These people lose real income from fatigue, but retain high relative income to the less dedicated and skilled miners.

Now, Joe mission runner and Jimmy Ratter need new ships, because CCP just nerf-batted their current potatoes too hard, and so now their current potatoes aren't useful. They have isk, and each needs a potato. Joe mission runner is a semi-AFK, capstable FOF missile kinda guy, and makes 40m/hr. Jimmy Ratter runs a shiny pwnmobile through belts and sites and cherry picks faction spawns and knows how to chain them, so he makes 120m/hr.

The new potato at the top of the pile costs 140m, and the toys to make it work right cost another 10.

Joe needs to run for almost 4 hours to afford this new potato, but is hit with fatigue after 2, so needs to either dock up in shame, new potato still on the shelf, or power through and take 5 hours to get the potato, ship getting less and less nice, and game getting more frustrating all the while. Joe has lost real, and relative income for the sole reason of fatigue.

Jimmy, on the other hand, quickly makes his 120m, and realizes that he got one particularly nice potato seed, so when his last tick ends, he takes the shiny potato seed and sells it, and then heads to the potato store @ 4-4, and gets himself a new potato, which is still the lowest buy order, because Joe is still stuck trying to kill a frigate with FoFs for the last 30 minutes because his fatigue has lowered his majestic potatoes DPS to less than that of a well rested and fit frigate. Jimmy has not lost much real income and has gained relative income.

Is this what you want, or is this some war on actual bots carried out in the most asinine manner possible?