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Mechanics behind the duration of combat booster side-effects
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Justin Perelta
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1 - 2015-04-24 13:14:22 UTC
I always assumed the side-effects lasted the entire booster duration but I see that they do not and it seems rather random. My last time taking a standard Exile I had three side-effects at the beginning and only one side-effect with 11 minutes remaining (DT prevented me from seeing how it lasted until the end).

Is the side-effect duration totally random or based on the neurotoxin recovery/control skills or strength somehow? There must be a random element to it since I lost 2 of 3 effects during that time but I can't find any explanation of it anywhere.

Thanks,
Justin
Plato Forko
123 Fake Street
#2 - 2015-04-24 23:11:35 UTC
anything chance-based is random, the math only explains the probability of whether something will randomly occur.
Justin Perelta
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#3 - 2015-04-25 07:33:41 UTC
Understood. I suppose I didn't make my point that clear. Every public source I can find on combat boosters states or implies that side-effect duration = booster duration. This clearly is not the case and I was wondering what affects the side-effect duration. Possibilities:
* Random time from 0-booster duration (BD)
* Random time from 30min-DB (30 mins being the base booster duration time before skills)
* Either of the above but with one or both skills contributing to lessening the side-effect duration
* This is a bug and it should be the total booster duration (CCP, please don't fix on my account, every PVPer in game will want to kill me!).
* This is a bug and the side-effects are the full booster duration but the notification of side-effect is bugged (CCP, you can fix that one).

Does anyone know what the underlying mechanic is? Could it be one of the above or something else?

FYI, these are screen caps from yesterday. I have Neurotoxin Control III and Recovery IV:
http://imgur.com/j1rh1iU,luZ4bHP#0
http://imgur.com/j1rh1iU,luZ4bHP#1

Justin
Plato Forko
123 Fake Street
#4 - 2015-04-25 18:54:16 UTC
sorry i guess i just skimmed the first part and responded to the second! what you're getting is odd, my guess would be it's a UI bug just because i've seen tooltips give completely bullshit info about as often as not. next time this happens open your fitting window and "show info" on the mods that are supposed to be affected then you'll see if a penalty is active or not by whether the stat that is supposed to be affected is different from what it was before you took the booster.
pushdogg
relocation LLC.
#5 - 2015-04-26 16:06:46 UTC
ever since these were introduced its been hard to get answers about them.

in my experience it is very rare that you get 3 side effects, sometimes i wont get any. ive also never paid attention to when the side effect drops off, because really i dont care enough beyond the initial check.

it would be nice to get someone to discuss these with some insight. finding answers about this particular item has always been an exercise in frustration(for me at least). even making them has a very long tedious process involved(although there are plenty of guides on this).

i mean honestly we wont know exactly how they work until someone can make billions taking them. (because there is no reason to make a guide or use them continuously for research when you dont make any isk doing that.)
Justin Perelta
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#6 - 2015-04-27 06:48:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Justin Perelta
Plato Forko wrote:
next time this happens open your fitting window and "show info" on the mods that are supposed to be affected then you'll see if a penalty is active or not by whether the stat that is supposed to be affected is different from what it was before you took the booster.


Damn you using common sense ;) Good idea and easy enough to confirm if it's a UI bug. I also thought it was odd that I got three side-effects. With Neurotoxin Recovery at IV it should be a 16% chance of getting each of 4 side-effects. I don't remember my probability math but that's a pretty small chance of getting three at once.

Justin

Edit: Think I found the right math: Chance of getting three side-effects together when each is a 16% chance is ~0.4%.
Lan Wang
African Atomic.
Dreadnought Diplomacy.
#7 - 2015-04-27 09:07:40 UTC
i guess its like irl i mean sometimes i get a hangover sometimes i dont, really wierd but random

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Justin Perelta
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#8 - 2015-04-27 11:20:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Justin Perelta
OK, so I did some research and took some screen shots. From this one test it seems to be a combination of side-effects not lasting the full booster duration AND a UI bug showing side-effects that I don't actually have!

Since I was testing Exile I needed a ship with a turret and a launcher to see all possible side effects. I used a PVE Nemisis:

Before booster, capacitor capacity is 443 GJ, explosion radius is 405m:
Stats before booster

Just after taking booster I get capacitor capacity and explosion radius side-effects. The capacitor is now down to 368 GJ (the correct 17% reduction) but explosion radius is unchanged at 405m:
Stats just after taking booster

Near the end of the booster effect the capacitor side-effect has gone and I have 443 GJ again. I still have the missile effect but the stat is still unchanged at 405m:
Stats near end of booster

Justin
Plato Forko
123 Fake Street
#9 - 2015-04-27 20:17:49 UTC
it's like booster roulette!
Noir Ruda
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2015-04-28 07:47:50 UTC
Yeah same here boosters sideeffects somtimes whereoff between 10 to 30 minutes at least in the ui.

I never checked if the side effects displayed where actually in effect.
Justin Perelta
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#11 - 2015-04-28 10:14:01 UTC
Since I'm pretty certain there is a UI bug I posted it over to Issues, Workarounds & Localization.

Justin
takedoom
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2015-04-29 04:25:21 UTC
Just get the skills and you will be fine.

http://spinthatdamnship.ytmnd.com/
Justin Perelta
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#13 - 2015-04-29 09:15:54 UTC
takedoom wrote:
Just get the skills and you will be fine.


Which skill do I train that fixes the UI issue where it tells me I have a side-effect that I don't actually have? Which skill affects the duration or duration randomness of the side-effects because the info available says the skills only affect probability of side-effect and strength of side-effect.

Justin
Justin Perelta
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#14 - 2015-05-06 15:04:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Justin Perelta
Took my testing to SiSi since it was cheaper than burning through Exile for fun. I have no Neurotoxin skills on SiSi so it should be a 20% chance for each side-effect with standard Exile.

I take exile and I get explosion radius and tracking penalty notification. Character sheet only shows tracking penalty. Sure enough, doing show-info on the ammo/modules show this to be correct. ~5 mins later the Turret effect disappears! So I have one notification for a side-effect I never had and a real side-effect that lasted 5 minutes. Shocked

Right after taking booster (the show info windows are doubled since two are from before the booster). Note that only tracking is affected and character sheet only shows one side effect while the notification in top -left shows 2 side-effects.
http://postimg.org/image/o68qohpwj

~5 mins later. Turret side-effect is gone:
http://postimg.org/image/ex6kedh0j

Justin

P.S. Booster pills are 1 m^3!!! I hope to god they aren't suppositories. ShockedBig smile