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Trade menu is fail

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Vissari Nolen
The Special Snowflakes
#1 - 2011-12-27 07:34:16 UTC
While sitting in station tonight i recieved an eve mail from some one named Tyrone Bigams regarding him wanting to sell a few shiny ships at significantly reduced cost. right from the start it was obvious something was up, but i decided to see what he was trying to pull and contacted him saying i'd buy a couple of his ships for resale purposes. he opens up trade menu and to my surprise it seamed nothing was wrong, two vexor navy issues and a dominix navy issue were put into the trade menu like he said. so i traded him the isk and hit accept. after the trade is completed i try to put them into the market and resell them only to find that the ships were simply named after their shiny counterparts and that i'd lost a sizable amount of money due to a pathetically programmed trade window. i'm wondering if this system was intentionally designed to be taken advantage of by scamming garbage or if it was just a happy accident. a trade system that allows players to rename the items whatever they like and have it be displayed that way in the trade menu is absolutely ridiculous. if an item is going to be traded it needs to display the actual name of the item in the trade menu, otherwise every single new player is going to fall for this at least once unless they're lucky enough to be warned about the trade systems inadequacies ahead of time. so, eve eve community, i ask you this: how do you feel with such a poorly designed trade system? are you happy with it?
Percival Gates
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#2 - 2011-12-27 07:56:34 UTC
Don't use the trade window. Use contracts. General rule of thumb: if it involves the trade window, it is a scam. Also, if it is that easy to make isk from, it is a scam.

Now, I know you are going to say "no, you dolt, that is not the issue here. The issue is that the trade window UI is poorly designed grrrrrrr." You are exactly right. So do yourself a favor and never use it again unless you are trading stuff between your own characters. Even then, use extreme caution. Scamming is part of the game. Lesson learned. And no, CCP will probably do nothing to change it.
Vissari Nolen
The Special Snowflakes
#3 - 2011-12-27 08:04:57 UTC
Percival Gates wrote:
Don't use the trade window. Use contracts. General rule of thumb: if it involves the trade window, it is a scam. Also, if it is that easy to make isk from, it is a scam.

Now, I know you are going to say "no, you dolt, that is not the issue here. The issue is that the trade window UI is poorly designed grrrrrrr." You are exactly right. So do yourself a favor and never use it again unless you are trading stuff between your own characters. Even then, use extreme caution. Scamming is part of the game. Lesson learned. And no, CCP will probably do nothing to change it.


the general purpose of this post was to let let people know about some obviously messed up things with the trade menu. i personally will never use it again. but a game that has a system you should never use for fear of getting scammed shouldn't have the system in the first place. either fix it or remove it. don't leave it there for people to take advantage of.
Percival Gates
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#4 - 2011-12-27 08:14:04 UTC
I agree with you, but you underestimate how sadistic CCP is. Also, I think it's fairly obvious how easy it is to abuse the trade window. This is the wrong place to post this kind of thing. The locals in here will flame you incessantly.

If you seriously want to complain to CCP about this and start a grassroots movement, post something in the "Features & Ideas Discussion" area. C&P is where villains are praised and victims are laughed at.
Vissari Nolen
The Special Snowflakes
#5 - 2011-12-27 08:21:25 UTC
Percival Gates wrote:
I agree with you, but you underestimate how sadistic CCP is. Also, I think it's fairly obvious how easy it is to abuse the trade window. This is the wrong place to post this kind of thing. The locals in here will flame you incessantly.

If you seriously want to complain to CCP about this and start a grassroots movement, post something in the "Features & Ideas Discussion" area. C&P is where villains are praised and victims are laughed at.


i understood this but was really having trouble finding a place to post this, and the "inform people of the latest scam" description seemed to fit this issue the best. even their forums are poorly done it seems.
KrakizBad
Section 8.
#6 - 2011-12-27 08:22:06 UTC
So never use the market either?
Vissari Nolen
The Special Snowflakes
#7 - 2011-12-27 08:28:03 UTC
KrakizBad wrote:
So never use the market either?


i fail to see what you're getting at, perhaps you can explain what is obviously a clever jab
Percival Gates
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#8 - 2011-12-27 08:41:24 UTC
Vissari Nolen wrote:
KrakizBad wrote:
So never use the market either?


i fail to see what you're getting at, perhaps you can explain what is obviously a clever jab

I think he may have been talking to me, since I said to never use the trade window. There are numerous market scams, also. But it's rather difficult to be completely certain when somebody enters a conversation and asks a straw-man question and never explicitly states who is the intended recipient of said question.
VIP Ares
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2011-12-27 08:52:06 UTC
In the first place- this was bad UI design and programming. I belive that in begining CCP did not have time and resources to fix all such things, even if they wanted to.

But with time, all similar scams became important part of EVE iniverse, and overall gaming experince, and it is highly unlikely CCP will ever change it.

There are always Twisted people that will enjoy ripping off noobs in such manner, and there will always be noobs who will fall for it at least once.

If you are evil enough, you will try to do it yourself to some poor rookie.

http://www.balex.info/index.php/pilot_detail/47623/
Vissari Nolen
The Special Snowflakes
#10 - 2011-12-27 08:56:43 UTC
VIP Ares wrote:
In the first place- this was bad UI design and programming. I belive that in begining CCP did not have time and resources to fix all such things, even if they wanted to.

But with time, all similar scams became important part of EVE iniverse, and overall gaming experince, and it is highly unlikely CCP will ever change it.

There are always Twisted people that will enjoy ripping off noobs in such manner, and there will always be noobs who will fall for it at least once.

If you are evil enough, you will try to do it yourself to some poor rookie.


i'm not that kind of person. and just because a poorly done feature like the trade window has become part of the eve universe doesn't mean that it no longer warrants fixing. if ccp didn't fix things just because players were used to them then nothing would get fixed after it came off of the test server. this is an issue that needs to be changed regardless of if scammers like it or not.
Darius III
Interstellar eXodus
The Initiative.
#11 - 2011-12-27 09:18:00 UTC
Working as intended. The ships don't even have the same skins. You are the problem... Next time right click show info. Welcome to Eve.

Protip>Don't read Jita local until you been playing 4 years

Hmmm
Vissari Nolen
The Special Snowflakes
#12 - 2011-12-27 09:22:51 UTC
Darius III wrote:
Working as intended. The ships don't even have the same skins. You are the problem... Next time right click show info. Welcome to Eve.

Protip>Don't read Jita local until you been playing 4 years


a trade window not properly displaying the names of the items is the problem, not the person using it. i shouldn't have to carefully scrutinize everything put into the window and STILL be paranoid about using it. i am not the problem, the overly exploited trade window is. as for the skins comment i suppose that would be something a more experienced player would catch, but as i said this more refers to newer players like myself who don't even fly shinies.
Kagan Storm
Doomheim
#13 - 2011-12-27 09:23:04 UTC
Vissari Nolen wrote:
While sitting in station tonight i recieved an eve mail from some one named Tyrone Bigams regarding him wanting to sell a few shiny ships at significantly reduced cost. right from the start it was obvious something was up, but i decided to see what he was trying to pull and contacted him saying i'd buy a couple of his ships for resale purposes. he opens up trade menu and to my surprise it seamed nothing was wrong, two vexor navy issues and a dominix navy issue were put into the trade menu like he said. so i traded him the isk and hit accept. after the trade is completed i try to put them into the market and resell them only to find that the ships were simply named after their shiny counterparts and that i'd lost a sizable amount of money due to a pathetically programmed trade window. i'm wondering if this system was intentionally designed to be taken advantage of by scamming garbage or if it was just a happy accident. a trade system that allows players to rename the items whatever they like and have it be displayed that way in the trade menu is absolutely ridiculous. if an item is going to be traded it needs to display the actual name of the item in the trade menu, otherwise every single new player is going to fall for this at least once unless they're lucky enough to be warned about the trade systems inadequacies ahead of time. so, eve eve community, i ask you this: how do you feel with such a poorly designed trade system? are you happy with it?



You Sir just failed at paragraphs and trading both at the same time. Bear

My ego is the the size of my carriers jump range.
VIP Ares
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2011-12-27 09:55:07 UTC
Well, "trade window" is only your first lesson.

Now if you continue reading Jita local chat, you will learn all other scams harder way.

http://www.balex.info/index.php/pilot_detail/47623/
Nathan Jameson
Grumpy Bastards
#15 - 2011-12-27 10:40:45 UTC
Vissari Nolen wrote:
i understood this but was really having trouble finding a place to post this, and the "inform people of the latest scam" description seemed to fit this issue the best. even their forums are poorly done it seems.


Why do you feel that other people will research the forums beforehand, any more than you did?

http://www.wormholes.info
Mathilde D'Arc
The Intaki Ladies Deep Space Astrogation Auxiliary
#16 - 2011-12-27 10:54:24 UTC

Two things:

1. Faction ships can be identified by their icon in the top left corner. This is your failing and not that of the trade window.

2. You can right click and inspect traded items. Despite accepting blatantly non faction ships by virtue of them not being tagged faction you didn't even bother to inspect the offered goods.

I fail to see how this is a fault with the trade window when you had every opportunity available to you to avoid an obvious scam attempt.
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#17 - 2011-12-27 15:56:58 UTC
Had someone try this on me once. I shorted him, entering 30,000,000 instead of 300,000,000.

Scammers who get excited and don't double-check numbers are great.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
seany1212
M Y S T
#18 - 2011-12-27 16:23:07 UTC  |  Edited by: seany1212
Vissari Nolen wrote:
Darius III wrote:
Working as intended. The ships don't even have the same skins. You are the problem... Next time right click show info. Welcome to Eve.

Protip>Don't read Jita local until you been playing 4 years


a trade window not properly displaying the names of the items is the problem, not the person using it. i shouldn't have to carefully scrutinize everything put into the window and STILL be paranoid about using it. i am not the problem, the overly exploited trade window is. as for the skins comment i suppose that would be something a more experienced player would catch, but as i said this more refers to newer players like myself who don't even fly shinies.


WORKING AS INTENDED

There is a real life modification that allows a Toyota mr2 to look like a ferrari (testarossa?), the owner can the chose to sell it as such, you are the moronic customer that chose not to research into your product because you thought you were getting an exceptional deal. Right click, show info for a reason.

Edited for the fail of autocorrect on ferrari -.-
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#19 - 2011-12-27 16:57:26 UTC
seany1212 wrote:
There is a real life modification that allows a Toyota mr2 to look like q defeating (testarossa?), the owner can the chose to sell it as such, you are the moronic customer that chose not to research into your product because you thought you were getting an exceptional deal. Right click, show info for a reason


In real life, there are consequences for misrepresenting a product. If you list it as something it isn't you've committed fraud and can be in serious trouble.

Eve isn't real life, and we shouldn't be trying to emulate this boring world.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#20 - 2011-12-27 16:58:08 UTC
Thank you. Your post made the perfect "still working" section for the trade window walkthrough on my blog. It's nice to see that despite CCP's attempts to save people from themselves, trade window scams are still worth the trouble.

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com (shameless plug)

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
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