EVE General Discussion

Fights happen because there is a value to winning, a point to being the man standing at the end. I will fly my ship home through dangerous territory because I want to get my ship back alive. Why would I bother if there is no cost to doing so, might as well run it in to the nearesty gatecamp and save myself half an hour. Sure, once dying has no cost, everyone can run merrily in to the gunfire heedlessly, but whats the point? There is a reason I don't play FPS's, theres no investiture for me in the result. There is in EvE combat.

And insuring mods completely flattens the risk/cost of faction, deadspace, and officer mods - now you have to make a judgement over whether the cost is really worth the miniscule benefit, faced with the fact the ship might be wreckage long before its given enough benefit to justify that cost. If you insure mods, there is absolutely no reason ever to not fit up the shiniest fit you can physically afford, since once its strapped on your ship, its "safe". Its a no-brainer, faction hardners and damage mods every time.

Things must be really bad when even one of top tier "dark lords" are playing something else.

But I can see a lot of risk aversion. I was expecting another "grrr highsec why they no show up in my bubble camp?" issue but I've been caught red-handed in WHs with a poor DPS exploration fit BC (back when exploration sites in K-space were also combat sites) by gangs ranging 4 - 6 and have all run off.

Why?

Because all of them, individually, feared that I could take at least one of them out, so being afraid of being the one getting taken out, they all ran off.



Yes the player base has degenerated somewhat. It's not all about ISK and risk though. There's a lot of sperg thrown in.






As my good friend Dracvlad says, people WILL fight when they have (p) "skin in the game". That also means a chance at even a draw instead of a highsec wardec bittervets versus noobs ROFLstomp. But having skin in the game means loss potential.

Thus, as per my theory from several years ago, there are neural pathways that go on in this game that mimic real life.

That's the big draw. That's why players keep coming back. You can experiment with real world outcomes in a parallel nature whereby unlike the Matrix you don't die on a chair in RL with a spark plug sticking out the back of your head when you fail.




To that I would say that the leet PVP crowd should pat themselves on the back. All the highsec wardecs and ganking and bubble camps have had their effect it seems. The leet PVPers have won Eve. In lowsec just about everything that moves gets killed. They won lowsec too. Congrats all around!

Now nobody wants to fight and even the leet PVPers are in highsec for the same reason their prey is in highsec.

I think the root of the problem is comparable to "racing for pinks". This is a term (from the 1970s or earlier) when the registration of a car was on a pink-ish document. These days cars have "titles" which tend to be green in color (in the USA as far as I know). But the old registration card enabled owners to easily sign a car over to someone else.

That's right. You could sign a car over to a new owner right on the spot with those old registrations.

So "Racing for Pinks" existed back then which basically was this:

You drag race.
Win: you get their car.
Lose: you lose your car.

I knew people in this culture. If you wanted to look under their hood, you had to pay for it. To look at what kind of engine, carb, nitro, supercharger, etc. they had, you have to fork over several hundred bucks.

OR

Beat them in a drag race and then you own the car and look under the hood all you want (kind of like a kill report). Or fail to beat them and they own yours and look under your hood.

You can bet this was a very small culture.

And the guys in it all had several things in common: they were all mechanics deep in the auto industry and losing a car in a race was no big deal to them. They had several more lined up. If you won a car, you improved it, and used it to race again. Maybe you lost it, maybe you got other cars. A single car will cycle through a half dozen guys several times before it got ultimately wrecked or if it was an old car, a collector bought it.

Now, imagine Joe Blow who works two jobs all summer to buy an old Camaro. Is he going to want to race for pinks? I doubt it. And I have never seen someone who actually had to work to pimp their ride do that.

I have seen some of the racing for pinks crowd try to get them to race, and when word got around that they tried that, the other guys would shame them for that. Because basically, it's like trying to play up someone's ego to steal their car. You see, they had a code of sorts.
(if it were the other way around though, well then you have a fool in need of a lesson)


Why am I bringing this up? Because I see a large set of parallel factors in all this. The guys who sit on endless piles of moon goo can lose ships to other guys on piles of moon goo all day. Yet they get bored and go and... gank freighters in highsec and what does that do? It drives up the price of....

ship replacement

End the ganking and prices may come down. Therefore I welcome the OP to the anti-ganking movement.

As-is the only thing that keeps the market afloat despite the hundreds of billions that get injected via isk faucets is that people tend to blow up their ships and effectively get rid of their stuff. If you'd get back your investment on your ship (near total) people would just pile up money and the value of isk would plummet to nothingness.

Think about this for a second.

You pay some industrialist for your ship (effectively, he sold you "refined materials" at a ~5-10% profit margin, but going back all the way through the chain is going too far)

You go buy your fit, you pew, you lose your ship and get 95% of its value back.

What is now happening is that the isk you spent on that ship, virtually doubled. You have the value of the ship and the industrialist has the value of the ship (you paid him, remember?). This is happening over and over and over again. For every ship lost you inject more money into the market that nobody worked for. Minerals are suddenly the only chokepoint to ensure ship replacement and the price rises to accomodate increased demand, which in turn increases insurance payout which in turn increases....


So yes, dumbest idea ever. Hyperinflation in a bottle.

Completely agree.
If my Vindicator with heatsinks costs me nothing (or almost nothing) you can have as many killmails with it as you want and blame me as you wish. I would not care anyway. I will just fit it for the kicks and get it blown on undock. Because it costs nothing.

And i think most players will just stop hunting for things like bling bears. Because after first HOORAY went you left with lots of useless killmails. What is the reason to bait someone if you can just ask him "give me your killmail for 5 million ISK which is what you pay for insurance after losing' and you both have little fun.

I agree CCP should remove ALL insurance.

Maybe give a leeway for new players. First three months on your sub and you still get insurance.

Do you get insurance if killed by concord? I forget.

Nope, getting Concordokken automatically revokes any insurance payout.

Closed.