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Question regarding Matari tattoos

Author
Uraniae Fehrnah
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2011-12-26 17:57:42 UTC
Due to busy schedules all around I haven't been able to really ask this to the few people I would normally have chosen, so now I ask it here.

I'm curious if anyone has any sort of resource regarding common marks and their meanings? I'm specifically interested in marks other than the voluval. We've all heard of teenagers in the Federation being (arguably) disrespectful by getting matari tattoos without truly knowing what they mean or without earning them by the traditional standards of matari society, so I'm wondering if any intrepid persons have attempted to create something of a lexicon for common marks.

Needless to say I am debating the merits of attempting to get a matari tattoo with a somewhat specific meaning. However my specific intentions aren't something I'll be sharing over the IGS, so if anyone is genuinely curious about it you'll have to speak to me in a more private venue.

Again what I'm attempting to find is optimistically some sort of codex or lexicon of marks other than the voluval.
Seriphyn Inhonores
Elusenian Cooperative
#2 - 2011-12-26 18:08:17 UTC
Regarding Gallente teenagers (a large chunk of which are ethnically Minmatar) being disrespectul for Minmatar culture, I'd just like add the addendum that the rest of New Eden is being disrespectul to Gallente culture, creativity and hard work by watching our holovids, listening to our music, wearing our clothes, and reading our literature.

That is all.
N'maro Makari
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#3 - 2011-12-26 18:20:19 UTC
It's complex.

Voluvals aside, tattoos vary at a tribe, clan, and even family level. Im no expert though, so I recommend consulting a shaman. Perhaps seek out Terra Matar, theres a good few people in the know among them.

And Mr Inhonores, well, I'm sure someone else coming to this thread can summarise better than I.

**Vherokior **

Arkady Sadik
Gradient
Electus Matari
#4 - 2011-12-26 19:21:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Arkady Sadik
Tattoos for the Minmatar are a method of communication first, and art only second. A bit like uniforms and medals for other cultures, where it is quite important for them to look good, but their primary purpose is to convey a message of rank and achievements.

As such, new tattoos are created constantly. The basic ones explain which clan and tribe you are from, giving you an immediate place and background in any conversation. Further tattoos are added for your rank, grade or achievements during your life.

The mentioned "Gallentean teenagers" usually have not bothered to actually inform themselves about the tattoo practice and consider it simply art (a misunderstanding that would result in erroneously comparing tattoos to, say, Gallentean holovids, music, clothers, or literature). It's more akin to wearing the local police uniform, which is actually considered a crime in most nations because your impersonating an authority that you are not. But for the most part, it's this profound disrespect to the background of tattooing that causes the upset.

If you are interested in further information about tattoos, you can find some explanation here:
http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Tattoos_%28Chronicle%29
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#5 - 2011-12-26 19:35:01 UTC
Seriphyn Inhonores wrote:
Regarding Gallente teenagers (a large chunk of which are ethnically Minmatar) being disrespectul for Minmatar culture, I'd just like add the addendum that the rest of New Eden is being disrespectul to Gallente culture, creativity and hard work by watching our holovids, listening to our music, wearing our clothes, and reading our literature.

That is all.

This is a very grave situation, indeed. I think this would be the first time when I will agree with you. Something must be done to stop this disrespect. Banning gallente holovids outside of the Federation will be a perfect solution to start with.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Katrina Oniseki
Oniseki-Raata Internal Watch
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#6 - 2011-12-26 20:25:36 UTC
Arkady Sadik wrote:

The mentioned "Gallentean teenagers" usually have not bothered to actually inform themselves about the tattoo practice and consider it simply art (a misunderstanding that would result in erroneously comparing tattoos to, say, Gallentean holovids, music, clothers, or literature). It's more akin to wearing the local police uniform, which is actually considered a crime in most nations because your impersonating an authority that you are not. But for the most part, it's this profound disrespect to the background of tattooing that causes the upset.

Katrina Oniseki

Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#7 - 2011-12-26 21:48:46 UTC
Uraniae Fehrnah wrote:

Needless to say I am debating the merits of attempting to get a matari tattoo with a somewhat specific meaning. However my specific intentions aren't something I'll be sharing over the IGS, so if anyone is genuinely curious about it you'll have to speak to me in a more private venue.


Regardless of your intentions, you will appear to most to be an Amarrian plastering herself with tribal markings.

Good luck!

Sabik now, Sabik forever

Mikkel Lybecker
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2011-12-26 22:32:49 UTC

Uraniae Fehrnah wrote:
I'm curious if anyone has any sort of resource regarding common marks and their meanings?


A few exist, but the problem is that they're only usually relevant to a specific clan, tribe or region, and as tattoo art is a constantly evolving form of communication, such references are always a few steps behind what's actually happening.

Uraniae Fehrnah wrote:
We've all heard of teenagers in the Federation being (arguably) disrespectful by getting matari tattoos without truly knowing what they mean or without earning them by the traditional standards of matari society, so I'm wondering if any intrepid persons have attempted to create something of a lexicon for common marks.


I kind of like it that Gallente kids are getting tons of body art done these days. Usually they're the ones culturally stampeding all over us by foisting on us their architecture, fashions and soft drink, so it's good that the shoe's on the other foot and they get to look like us for a change. Some people feel it's disrespectful or whatever but when I see them I just tend to have a chuckle. There are worse ways for a bored kid to squander Daddy's disposable income, I guess.

Uraniae Fehrnah wrote:
Needless to say I am debating the merits of attempting to get a matari tattoo with a somewhat specific meaning.


As for you having a Matari tattoo, with a specific meaning, that's going to be perceived really weirdly no matter what the reasoning is and I would strongly advise against it. I'm not even sure why you would want one. I don't find it offensive or anything - but others might, not everyone's as tolerant as I am about that sort of thing. Walking around planetside where I grew up with a tribal tattoo is a great way to wind up in a box if you don't know what it means, and that's even for Minmatar so an Amarr is going to struggle a lot more. Stationside that's less of an issue of course, but if nothing else, getting tattoos with specific meaning for the context of a tribe or clan, when you're not actually in any (relevant) tribe or clan, tend to mark you out as a bit of a try-hard douchebag. Not saying that that's what you are, just saying that that's how you'll be perceived. We seriously laugh hard at those people behind their backs. To avoid social death in multicultural circles, you'd be better off getting a tattoo that isn't Matari related and just has a personal meaning for you, or because you like it, or whatever.
Rek Jaiga
Teraa Matar
#9 - 2011-12-26 22:42:22 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:

Regardless of your intentions, you will appear to most to be an Amarrian plastering herself with tribal markings.

Good luck!


Because there have never been ethnic Amarrians who were accepted into the Tribes, right?

I'm sure Uraniae knows full well the consequences of receiving a mark, and I am glad she is treating the situation with due respect.

Oh, and what Arkady said.
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#10 - 2011-12-27 00:01:54 UTC
Seriphyn Inhonores wrote:
[...] by watching our holovids, listening to our music, wearing our clothes, and reading our literature.

That is all.


Gallente have literature? Books, even? (And no, Seri, empty, vapid consumer-swill like this doesn't count!).

(Your popular music is shite, too, by the way--sorry, but there's just no gentle way to put itRoll)

Star Wars: the Old Republic may not be EVE. But I'll take the sound of dual blaster-pistols over "NURVV CLAOKING NAOW!!!11oneone!!" any day of the week.

Leopold Caine
Stillwater Corporation
#11 - 2011-12-27 10:39:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Leopold Caine
Rek Jaiga wrote:
Silas Vitalia wrote:

Regardless of your intentions, you will appear to most to be an Amarrian plastering herself with tribal markings.

Good luck!


Because there have never been ethnic Amarrians who were accepted into the Tribes, right?


I know one, but he decided to run from the Republic when his benevolent 'friends' decided to use him as a political scapegoat. Because he's an Amarrian.
So, ms. Fehrnah, I'd advise caution.
Unfortunately, I don't have such a high level of understanding of Matari culture regarding tattoos specifically, but I have a couple of Thukker friends who could probably help you with that... even then, I'd advise something subtle and discreet.
  • Leopold Caine, Domination Malakim

Angels are never far...

Stillwater Corporation Recruitment Open - Angel Cartel Bloc

Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#12 - 2011-12-27 12:37:29 UTC
Let's imagine that Uraniae Fehrnah has just got her new, but simple minmatar tatoo. For example, two lines on her cheek that form a cross. She came to parlour to show her amarrian, caldari, minmatar and gallente friends her new tatoo, but shortly left because of business call. Amarrian, minmatar and gallente made wry faces.
Caldari: - What's wrong, guys?
Amarrian: - Pfft. What a barbarianism!
Minmatar: - Pfft. Does she even know its meaning? She didn't earn right to wear it yet!
Gallente: - Pfft. Such nice art on her cheek and she ran away without telling where I can get it too...

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#13 - 2011-12-27 16:54:58 UTC
Amarrians who go native in order to appear to be "unique" are not the special little snowflakes that they think they are. No, they are a disgrace.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori

Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#14 - 2011-12-27 17:03:57 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
Amarrians who go native in order to appear to be "unique" are not the special little snowflakes that they think they are. No, they are a disgrace.


At least this way, Brother, it makes them easily identifiable!

Sabik now, Sabik forever

Kazzzi
Heathen Legion
Iron Men of the Hood
#15 - 2011-12-27 17:11:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Kazzzi
Rek Jaiga wrote:

Because there have never been ethnic Amarrians who were accepted into the Tribes, right?


Acknowledged as a non-enemy? Possibly.
Respected? Maybe.
Befriended? Rarely.
Fully accepted into a tribe? Unheard of.



Rodj Blake wrote:
Amarrians who go native in order to appear to be "unique" are not the special little snowflakes that they think they are. No, they are a disgrace.


Yeah, I'm not a big fan of tribal ink either, but there is that one space nun with the hot scripture tats that I'm sure even you would appreciate.
ValentinaDLM
SoE Roughriders
Electus Matari
#16 - 2011-12-27 17:23:48 UTC  |  Edited by: ValentinaDLM
Rodj Blake wrote:
Amarrians who go native in order to appear to be "unique" are not the special little snowflakes that they think they are. No, they are a disgrace.


Amusing I see you got a new job as the fashion police Rodj. I see you have taken not having a sense of fun, adventure nor open mindedness to new levels. What's next? Going to tell people putting autocannons on their Prophecy is disgraceful?

Though to be fair I find it equally amusing that some Minmatar feel a sense of pride and accomplishment in some ink, I never much thought of them as a vain people, but now I see their vanity simply knows another form, they are not showing their money about like the Caldari, nor touting their peerage like the Amarr, but it is still vanity nevertheless.
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#17 - 2011-12-27 17:44:17 UTC
ValentinaDLM wrote:
What's next? Going to tell people putting autocannons on their Prophecy is disgraceful?


On the contrary, if somebody wants to smite Shakorites with their own type of weaponry, I'm not going to stop them.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori

Kalaratiri
Full Broadside
Deepwater Hooligans
#18 - 2011-12-27 18:00:37 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
ValentinaDLM wrote:
What's next? Going to tell people putting autocannons on their Prophecy is disgraceful?


On the contrary, if somebody wants to smite Shakorites with their own type of weaponry, I'm not going to stop them.


What about the Midularites? Should they use railguns?

She's mad but she's magic, there's no lie in her fire.

This is possibly one of the worst threads in the history of these forums.  - CCP Falcon

I don't remember when last time you said something that wasn't either dumb or absurd. - Diana Kim

Tarunik Raqalth'Qui
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2011-12-27 18:25:03 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
ValentinaDLM wrote:
What's next? Going to tell people putting autocannons on their Prophecy is disgraceful?


On the contrary, if somebody wants to smite Shakorites with their own type of weaponry, I'm not going to stop them.

Never mind that small pulse lasers fail when it comes to brawling anyway, which kind of renders laser Punishers less than effective.
Telegram Sam
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2011-12-27 18:58:41 UTC
I personally see no harm in Gallente teenagers or anyone else getting a Minmatar tattoo. Matari will always be able to distinguish who is actually Matari, just from the mannerisms. The carriage, gait, the way of using the hands (and not using the hands) when speaking. Even in a backlit room showing only silhouettes, one could distinguish a Matari, as well as whether he/she is a Brutor, Sebiestor, Krusual or Thukker.
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