EVE General Discussion

Tell you what ... it will *never* be enough.
It will only get *worse*.

Just look at the games that are being produced ...
... or just look outside. Look at the people.
Look at the children.

The people who whine now are already having children.

Anyone who believes it's not getting much, much worse is either delusional ...
... or a serious part of the problem!


I see it where I work.
Children whine, because they want something ...
... and the ****** parents just give in.


You can absolutely expect it to get much worse.

In 2010 I have spent hours per day in my 10mn AB rifter speedtanking lvl4s for my friend to farm in his hurricane.

I have spent hours webbing people into warp.

In 2011 I once spent over half an hour waiting for a ganker to go GCC ...
... so he drops into his pod and I can farm his 170 Million ISK bounty.


The issue is not what you do ...
... but how you do it ...
... and how you perceive it.


Doing things like this is exactly PART of the game!


If you do not care about the people you spend time with ...
... and don't talk to them ...
... then of course you will perceive it as a waste.


If you don't want to help your friend ...
... then you both aren't friends.

Hours webbing is great of you to do, but to somebody who flies freighters often they will be exposed to ganks for longer than hours. I personally don't fly freighters but I see bumping as a one-sided mechanic in highsec where most actions you could take personally to resolve the bumping issue are disallowed by CONCORD.

Bullshit.

No one is flying freighters for hours when he is being webbed.

When I wrote "spent hours webbing" I meant that cumulative.
Not "all of them at once".


You did not actually address anything I said.
You asked me a question, I responded, now you ignore it because it doesn't fit your bullshit.

You are a troll, nothing more.


And it's not a personal attack when I say you have no friends.

All you show is that it is indeed nothing more but a factual statement!

It's funny how the word friend has evolved in Eve to mandate web-b***h be one of it's definitions. Because apparently if you don't have one you don't have friends is the apparent logic.

It's not being daft, in real life its uneconomic to guard every ship as 99% get through fine. All I'm saying is that there should be something post-bump that a friend could do to help is that a nerf to gankers?

Who is that friend now?
What the friend can do, post-bump, is web the freighter into warp.


What the freighter pilot can do?
Call friends for backup.


If we see it this way, then freighter-bumping is actually quite realistic.
Except for the bumping part, of course.


Great ingame/IRL reality:
Freighter gets captured/bumped by ship.
Freighter captain calls for backup.
Backup arrives and saves the day.


Sad ingame/IRL reality:
Freighter gets captured by ship.
Freighter captain ... looks stupid, because he has no friends.
No backup arrives and you lose it all because you failed to play an MMO as multiplayer game.


Is there a wrong way to play an MMO?

Yes, there is!
It's called Massively Multiplayer for a reason!
Playing it alone is pretty much the wrongest thing you can do!


99% of all the MMOs out there do not even deserve to be called that way.
They aren't massively multiplayer.
They are "we pretend that you play with all these other people".
They teach people to play ALONE, next to all the others who play ALONE!

That's not MMO!

But hey, sure you can play it solo.
Absolutely!
You can also ignore the negative side effects!
Absolutely!

And you know what then happens?

You get bumped in your freighter,
because you had no friend to web you into warp.

You get killed in your afk mining ship,
because you had no friend to talk to ingame.

Your blingy mission ship goes up in smoke,
because you completely blocked out the fact that smartbombs are bad
when there are other players around.

You get killed from a gatecamp after jumping to lowsec,
because you had no scout whatsoever to check for other people.


There's hundreds of explanations and reasons why playing an MMO solo is the wrong way to go!

You can play solo, yeah, but then accept when you get shafted!

Yes, you did write that. You wrote if they were friends they would do so. There is only one way to interpret that, if they do they are friends, if they don't they aren't. You made a pretty clear statement of assured help for anyone who was a friend. So nothing in my original point was contradicted.

Edit: Feel better after the tantrum you edited in? Lets get something very clear. At no point did I say it was not better to have scouts, webbers, or any other point of assistance, I just poked fun of the viewpoint that anyone who didn't have a webber on hand was inherently friendless, which is something you never contradicted but rather re-enforced.

You in your own mind conflated that to whatever this little fit of yours is about in response to me. It's really funny that your speak to others about misreading when you yourself insert entire different meaning and arguments into a post.

Ok, back on topic I guess, since trolls like to take things off topic but moderators don't care when it is pro-griefing to derail a topic that could possibly be anti-griefing.

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Part of the reason it needs to be addressed, it is a hostile aggression of the victim, greatly negatively effecting their ability to play the game, at no consequence to the aggressing player.

Yeah, because you know its a sound game mechanic when the primary solution to being unofficially aggressed is to not play the game. How is not playing at all a good solution to a questionable mechanic?

And logging off isn't even a solution, most of the time I see a bumped pilot log off, an Ibis is brought in to immediately flag the pilot with timers so it doesn't warp or disappear, at which point its a cake walk. I've witnessed and tried to help pilots that were stuck for hours at the mercy of a bumping mach or three, or in the cases where they just gave up on playing the game since the couldn't do anything anyways that the gankers just endlessly tossing noob ships to keep the flags rolling for 2 hours straight.

Unless you are just saying don't fly freighters, ever. But then who would fly the freighters? Even further that doesn't cover bumping when relating to station games.

There are numerous combinations of available options to fix this, just finding the right parts to put in the correct places might take some creative work. Yeah he could do work to prevent it, but its not completely avoidable, and in the case where it happens, there is very little recourse to the very clear aggression and hostility the bumping pilot is applying towards the victim.

In summary bumping is a mechanic in the game that allows one player to greatly reduce (or entirely eliminate) the playability of the game for another player without any consequence for the aggressing player.

I will agree that friendly webs are the ideal way to move freighters, and you bet my brother and I never take our freighter anywhere without it (not to mention it cuts the total travel time in half). We consistently haul double digit billions in and out of Jita all the time, haven't been caught, but thats not saying we can't be caught. But again, friendly webs aren't a be all end all solution to the general problem of bumping as bumping extends to station games and more.

If I had anything else to say I forgot it now, my aunt dropped off my cousin's *shudder* MacBook for me to fix and now my brain stopped working.

Sure they do; remove collision boxes from ships that don't have timers or can be otherwise legally agressed. They just don't want to.

So for now, petition continued bumping as harassment.