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Advice for protecting a Retriever

First post
Author
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#21 - 2015-04-23 17:46:42 UTC
Tipa Riot wrote:
Dana Goodeye wrote:
mining alligned means start mine, click a station, hit allign, then stop your ship.

Urban legend, won't work. A ship at zero speed counts as not aligned.

Yeah your ship needs to be moving
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#22 - 2015-04-23 17:50:00 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Tipa Riot wrote:
Dana Goodeye wrote:
mining alligned means start mine, click a station, hit allign, then stop your ship.

Urban legend, won't work. A ship at zero speed counts as not aligned.

Yeah your ship needs to be moving



A Higgs Anchor may be worth considering too.

Drops your max speed, so getting into warp should be faster.

(or you can be aligned, and stay within range for longer)

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

Solomar Espersei
Quality Assurance
#23 - 2015-04-23 17:50:31 UTC
Mark88fan Jones wrote:
Plus I have an application to join Eve University corp.

All discussion of retrievers aside, you'll certainly benefit from your time spent in the Uni. Best of luck.

Quality Assurance Recruiting intrepid explorers and BlOps/Cov Ops combat enthusiasts

Ned Thomas
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2015-04-23 18:02:56 UTC
Personally, I never liked the Retriever. It was the first barge I bought, lost it to a war target (ah, memories) and I switched to a Procurer because it was cheaper and I could buy a new one quicker. I kept trying to convince myself to go back to the Ret, but whenever I took it out I just missed the Proc.

I've since mothballed all mining ships except a Prospect P
Degnar Oskold
Moira.
#25 - 2015-04-23 18:58:49 UTC
Mark88fan Jones wrote:

I plan on mining in .8 or higher security so hopefully the Retriever fitted with advice in this thread will be relatively safe.


No, it will not be safe. Remember, CONCORD does not exist to protect you from ganks, it exists to punish the gankers after they open fire.

There is no system security level that is high enough to generate a CONCORD response before 2 gankers in catalysts manage to blow up a Retriever.

The only safe places to use a Retriever are
1) Distant, remote parts of hisec such as hisec islands in lowsec that CODE and their copycats do not go to.
2) Nullsec, in safe systems firmly under control of your alliance and where you can get safe as soon as an unfamiliar face enters local.
13kr1d1
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#26 - 2015-04-23 20:01:43 UTC  |  Edited by: 13kr1d1
Dana Goodeye wrote:
mining alligned means start mine, click a station, hit allign, then stop your ship. but i can assure you, if you tank your procurer correctly, you gonna laugh at the gankers =) they might be gonna try you once, because your young. dont fear them :) just be precautious.


Align doesnt work if you stop your ship. Perfect alignment is 3/4 speed pointed at a celestial to warp to, anything else is going to increase your time to align and warp out.

Steve Ronuken wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Tipa Riot wrote:
Dana Goodeye wrote:
mining alligned means start mine, click a station, hit allign, then stop your ship.

Urban legend, won't work. A ship at zero speed counts as not aligned.

Yeah your ship needs to be moving



A Higgs Anchor may be worth considering too.

Drops your max speed, so getting into warp should be faster.

(or you can be aligned, and stay within range for longer)


Mostly wrong. It increases agility more than the mass gain, so in the inertia equation it does help you accelerate a tiny fractional bit, but its mostly there to make you move SLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOWwwwwwwwwwww so that you can align and have the proper warp-to speed set while continuing to mine. Acceleration is from 0 to max speed WRT inertia and mass, so cutting your max speed by 1/10th with a mod means you actually accelerate slower in absolute velocity terms. You can accelerate from 0 to 30 m/s in 10 seconds with the higgs, or 0 to 300 m/s in 10 seconds without the higgs.



This works well for ships with mining laser upgrades, because since you chew roids up faster and you move slower, you're less likely to run off target.

Don't kid yourselves. Even the dirtiest pirates from the birth of EVE have been carebears. They use alts to bring them goods at cheap prices and safely, rather than live with consequences of their in game actions on their main, from concord to prices

Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#27 - 2015-04-24 04:33:46 UTC
Mark88fan Jones wrote:
A lot of very helpful advice, thanks! Tho some I din't understand because it was like reading another language lol.

I plan on mining in .8 or higher security so hopefully the Retriever fitted with advice in this thread will be relatively safe. Plus I have an application to join Eve University corp.

If I decide later to mine in lower security areas I guess I would probably then buy a Procurer for the added protection.


Yeah basically either:

- Mine with a retriever and write the occasional loss off as part of the running costs.
or
- get a procurer which mines just as fast but does waste some time with more runs back to base to empty out

If your mining in 0.8 and above and really paranoid just run level 1 missions and mine them before handing them in. You can still be scanned down but at least its harder than gankers just warping to a belt.
Laken Starr
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2015-04-24 08:00:53 UTC
As others have said, if you're worried about safety, use a Procurer. They can be made much more tanky than a Retriever without sacrificing nearly as much m3.
Cherri Minoa
Serendipity Technologies Inc
#29 - 2015-04-24 08:33:53 UTC
Procurer

Tanked T1 and then later Tanked T2 are the ships you should be aiming for. It's a better choice even than the Skiff which, though it is more tanky, is a slightly more viable gank target because it is so much more valuable.

Don't mine AFK. (In fact, anything AFK in EVE apart from being in station will end in tears eventually). Max out your drone skills and fly with 5 x Hornet EC-300 and 5 x Light Combat drones. At your mining site, deploy your ECM drones set to aggressive. They are not massively effective, but they have a small chance of breaking the target lock of a ganker, which buys you valuable seconds until CONCORD arrive. When NPC rats appear, recall the ECMs and deploy your combat drones. If the rats have already targeted you, you will need to lock and engage the drones onto them manually. (Aggressive only works if the drones are active in space before you are attacked.)

In hi-sec you can probably tank belt rats all day, so its OK to replace one or two of your light combat drones with salvage drones if you want.

"If I had been censured every time I have run my ship, or fleets under my command, into great danger, I should have long ago been out of the Service" - Horatio Nelson

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2015-04-24 08:37:48 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Tipa Riot wrote:
Dana Goodeye wrote:
mining alligned means start mine, click a station, hit allign, then stop your ship.

Urban legend, won't work. A ship at zero speed counts as not aligned.

Yeah your ship needs to be moving



A Higgs Anchor may be worth considering too.

Drops your max speed, so getting into warp should be faster.

(or you can be aligned, and stay within range for longer)

Dropping the max speed to insta warp only works if the target was already moving. The higgs anchor reduces align time a tiny bit, but its there more for the velocity reduction allowing the ship to mine while fully aligned.

You can test this by webbing a freighter at stand still and then having it try to warp as opposed to webbing a freighter that was already partially aligned. The one at standstill will have a similar align time to one that wasn't webbed at all.

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!

Garmyne Atavuli
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#31 - 2015-04-24 11:05:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Garmyne Atavuli
As safe places to mine in high-sec go this is about the safest: Mission Mining
Not much in terms of variety of mineable Asteroids, just the basics without the +5 and +10% variants.

All you need to look out for are Combat Probes.
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#32 - 2015-04-24 11:19:38 UTC
Hi, I'm one of those bad gankers you've been warned about. (Well, not so active in ganking personally at present, I'm more in the logistics side of things, making sure the other gankers have access to equipment. I also sell miners replacement equipment after they have accidents).

My honest advice to a miner looking to protect themselves: Get experience ganking. You will learn all of the tricks we use, then, you will be able to figure out ways to counter them.

Who knows, you might even find the dark side of EVE more fun. But even if you return to mining, you'll have learned a lot.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com

Robbin Sund
#33 - 2015-04-24 11:45:02 UTC
Best way to survive in a retri? Find a silent place in highsec and mine your heart out.

Sometimes things come up and I forgot I had eve running, to get back to my retri and his drones sitting all fine after a few hours just floating in a belt doing nothing. always alive. : )

Closest thing to combat besides rats is the yellow flashing people trying to bait you.

One way trip! Why dont you drive?

Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#34 - 2015-04-24 12:06:24 UTC
13kr1d1 wrote:

Steve Ronuken wrote:
Stuff that wasn't entirely right

A correction.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Stuff that wasn't entirely right
pretty much the same correction


Oops? At least I also mentioned the proper reason? Big smile

Thanks for the correction.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

Azda Ja
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#35 - 2015-04-24 12:15:01 UTC
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
My honest advice to a miner looking to protect themselves: Get experience ganking. You will learn all of the tricks we use, then, you will be able to figure out ways to counter them.

At the bare minimum, they should read up on the basics. Even just being aware of the 'tricks' will help a ton for staying safe. Actually attempting to gank will make learning to counter it even easier of course, but simply reading up on how gankers operate should be 'mining 101'.

The same applies to doing PVE related stuff in lowsec, WHs or null. Learning how the 'predators' operate in each of their respective areas of space will do more for your survival while PVEing than anything else. Also D-Scan, never not D-scan. Out of habit, I try and D-Scan while I'm docked; it hasn't worked yet, but I won't give up hope. Same when I exit my building IRL, and then I remember there is no D-Scan button IRL, thats eyes and ears.

Grrr.

Solecist Project
#36 - 2015-04-24 12:27:19 UTC
My common advise is to orbit the rock and have bookmarks prepared.
One north, south, east and west at least.

As they are now visible in space it's even easier.

Play zoomed out a bit, so you can see your surroundings
and the trail of your ship. That way you see your heading.

As soon as danger comes,
warp to the bookmark with the least aligntime.

You can easily create bookmarks by warping to 100 to the belt ...
... warping back and to 100 to the bookmark.

To create a bookmark use CTRL+B.

Too bad that removed the ability to have several "SAVE"-windows at once.

The more bookmarks you have spread into all directions ...
... the faster you can gtfo.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia

ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#37 - 2015-04-24 13:18:17 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
ergherhdfgh wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:

They won't make you ore cargo hold capacity go down.

sorry for the confusion then.

Oh it's a common misconception, like cargo expanders on a bowhead (they don't effect the hold the ship goes in)



It's not so much a misconception as it is that I have not minned much since the tiericide. I totally forgot about ore holds. Much of my eve experience outside of the little niche that I have carved out for myself is old pre-tiericide info. I need to learn to silence myself on things that I've not done much recently. Thank you everyone for your patients and understanding.

Want to talk? Join Cara's channel in game: House Forelli

Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#38 - 2015-04-24 23:02:47 UTC
Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#39 - 2015-04-25 00:03:08 UTC
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
Hi, I'm one of those bad gankers you've been warned about. (Well, not so active in ganking personally at present, I'm more in the logistics side of things, making sure the other gankers have access to equipment. I also sell miners replacement equipment after they have accidents).

My honest advice to a miner looking to protect themselves: Get experience ganking. You will learn all of the tricks we use, then, you will be able to figure out ways to counter them.

Who knows, you might even find the dark side of EVE more fun. But even if you return to mining, you'll have learned a lot.
Hands down the best possible advice.

EVE is all about the players: know them and you can beat them. Or join them. Or avoid them, strike a deal, be friends, help them, ... The possibilities are endless and way greater than game mechanics (which, yeah, you should also learn eventually).

Plus, learning this way is way more fun!

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!

Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#40 - 2015-04-25 02:28:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
Hi, I'm one of those bad gankers you've been warned about. (Well, not so active in ganking personally at present, I'm more in the logistics side of things, making sure the other gankers have access to equipment. I also sell miners replacement equipment after they have accidents).

My honest advice to a miner looking to protect themselves: Get experience ganking. You will learn all of the tricks we use, then, you will be able to figure out ways to counter them.

Who knows, you might even find the dark side of EVE more fun. But even if you return to mining, you'll have learned a lot.
Hands down the best possible advice.
Damn straight, I'm a miner and industrialist, among other things.

I've ganked a few miners with the New Order with another character in the past; learnt more about not getting ganked in a week than I'd learnt in the previous 3 years.

If any newbies fancy dabbling in the darker side of Eve, they lie about the cookies btw; people such as Ralph, Gully and Sabriz will be more than happy to put you in touch with people who can show you the ropes and answer any questions. Alternatively ask here in NCQA, you won't get trolled and will get good information.

Quote:
EVE is all about the players: know them and you can beat them. Or join them. Or avoid them, strike a deal, be friends, help them, ... The possibilities are endless and way greater than game mechanics (which, yeah, you should also learn eventually).

Plus, learning this way is way more fun!
Indeed, the social game and the metagame, of which the forums are a part, are just as important to the overall game of Eve as the spaceships and explosions are.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

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